DoleINGout Posted May 19, 2020 Share Posted May 19, 2020 20 minutes ago, kingseanjohn said: 10 years of 1st round picks and I'm considering it. But more than likely, still not enough. 10 is way too many, but 5 consecutive years of a teams first round pick? I think that seems like what his market value would be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingseanjohn Posted May 19, 2020 Share Posted May 19, 2020 Just now, DoleINGout said: 10 is way too many, but 5 consecutive years of a teams first round pick? I think that seems like what his market value would be. Not worth it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpacemanSpiff Posted May 19, 2020 Share Posted May 19, 2020 If I'm the Chiefs and some team offers me their draft for Mahomes, sick. I'm in. Look. I get it. Mahomes is ridiculous. When he turns it on, he might be the closest thing to unstoppable I've ever seen in football. But you know what? Football teams can be built in other ways, and especially right now with QB money the way it is, I'm not particularly keen on having to pay what is likely going to be the richest QB deal in the league. That's proving to be a losing proposition more times than a winning one. We have no idea what kind of cap effect Mahomes' contract is going to have on the Chiefs roster makeup. He's woefully underpaid for what he does, and the Chiefs are benefitting off that market inefficiency for -- not terribly much longer. If I'm their GM, we got a ring. Yes, could Mahomes have me in the title race for the next 10 years? Of course he could. Is the likelihood of getting another ring very high when I can't pay key defenders and role players? Probably not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted May 19, 2020 Share Posted May 19, 2020 13 minutes ago, kingseanjohn said: Not worth it I'd need more time. I want to see what the chiefs look like when they are paying him 40 million a season. Even for QBs, money matters Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuskieTitan Posted May 19, 2020 Share Posted May 19, 2020 29 minutes ago, SpacemanSpiff said: If I'm the Chiefs and some team offers me their draft for Mahomes, sick. I'm in. Look. I get it. Mahomes is ridiculous. When he turns it on, he might be the closest thing to unstoppable I've ever seen in football. But you know what? Football teams can be built in other ways, and especially right now with QB money the way it is, I'm not particularly keen on having to pay what is likely going to be the richest QB deal in the league. That's proving to be a losing proposition more times than a winning one. We have no idea what kind of cap effect Mahomes' contract is going to have on the Chiefs roster makeup. He's woefully underpaid for what he does, and the Chiefs are benefitting off that market inefficiency for -- not terribly much longer. If I'm their GM, we got a ring. Yes, could Mahomes have me in the title race for the next 10 years? Of course he could. Is the likelihood of getting another ring very high when I can't pay key defenders and role players? Probably not. I like you friend. But after you see how teams like the Browns blow first round picks like nothing, and just a draft isn't good enough for Mahomes. That's the kind of decision that gets people fired. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elky Posted May 19, 2020 Share Posted May 19, 2020 Idc how good you are, no one is worth an entire draft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elky Posted May 19, 2020 Share Posted May 19, 2020 (edited) 41 minutes ago, SpacemanSpiff said: If I'm the Chiefs and some team offers me their draft for Mahomes, sick. I'm in. Look. I get it. Mahomes is ridiculous. When he turns it on, he might be the closest thing to unstoppable I've ever seen in football. But you know what? Football teams can be built in other ways, and especially right now with QB money the way it is, I'm not particularly keen on having to pay what is likely going to be the richest QB deal in the league. That's proving to be a losing proposition more times than a winning one. We have no idea what kind of cap effect Mahomes' contract is going to have on the Chiefs roster makeup. He's woefully underpaid for what he does, and the Chiefs are benefitting off that market inefficiency for -- not terribly much longer. If I'm their GM, we got a ring. Yes, could Mahomes have me in the title race for the next 10 years? Of course he could. Is the likelihood of getting another ring very high when I can't pay key defenders and role players? Probably not. While you make sense from an economic perspective, Reid and Veach would be chased out of town by an angry mob if they even think about trading him. Edited May 19, 2020 by Elky 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jakuvious Posted May 19, 2020 Share Posted May 19, 2020 42 minutes ago, Forge said: I'd need more time. I want to see what the chiefs look like when they are paying him 40 million a season. Even for QBs, money matters I mean, what's the floor though, with an elite QB? Even the teams that have been inconsistent at maintaining a roster around them bottom out at like 7-9 with an elite QB (I'm thinking the Brees Saints, the Marino Dolphins etc.) Even those who think the $40M will be a huge deal are generally just predicting it'll be much harder to reach the superbowl. So from KC's perspective, you'd go from basically guaranteed competitiveness to a question mark, in any kind of trade. I would agree with KSJ that 5 first round picks wouldn't be enough for that. Especially since Mahomes going to that team makes them likely low first round picks. And you're likely trying to turn one of them into a replacement QB as well. The value would just never align. Like, from KC's perspective, you're envisioning a damn near guaranteed decade of relevant, competitive football. If the team crumbles around Mahomes (which is not something they really can even consider, since it means those making the decisions are probably losing their jobs), you're still likely in the hunt for the wildcard midway through the year. I just don't think there's anything that could be offered that KC would see as worth it, because they're trading away the future that they have envisioned for the franchise. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HTTRDynasty Posted May 19, 2020 Share Posted May 19, 2020 The people saying multiple draft classes aren’t enough are kidding themselves IMO. Imagine if the Packers had traded Rodgers away in 2011 for 3 draft full classes. They’d likely have won at least one SB since then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soko Posted May 19, 2020 Share Posted May 19, 2020 (edited) People are way overstating the QB cost here. Even if Mahomes’ cap hit is $40M+ a year (which is far fetched, cap hits are never the AAV), that’s what, two stud non-QBs? And I use the word stud loosely, because not all of the highest paid players are elite ones. Would you rather have to find a QB from scratch, Arik Armstead, and Amari Cooper - or the best QB in the league? I’d rather recycle receivers and second linemen than a QB. So the only real upside is hitting on draft picks - which isn’t a given - and utilizing them to win a ring before you have to pay them. Usually in the 3rd or 4th season. That’s a pretty tight window, where you still need to find a brand new quarterback. Hope it’s not a veteran, because that’s a minimum ~$25M for anyone with some semblance of a track record. I don’t see how ditching the league’s best QB for lotto tickets with time stamps on them is worth it. Edited May 19, 2020 by Yin-Yang 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DannyB Posted May 19, 2020 Share Posted May 19, 2020 While he's on his rookie deal? Not listening to offers. Once he has to get paid? I'd have to start thinking about it, but a lot of it depends on how much he's asking for, what the cap is, what the general lay of the land is around the league, and how the next 3 or so draft classes look. Not saying I WOULD, but it could be that in a few years QB salaries get too cost-prohibitive (you could argue they already are), and it would be better spent on a couple blue chip players, and an all-around upgrade at depth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jakuvious Posted May 19, 2020 Share Posted May 19, 2020 42 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said: The people saying multiple draft classes aren’t enough are kidding themselves IMO. Imagine if the Packers had traded Rodgers away in 2011 for 3 draft full classes. They’d likely have won at least one SB since then. Likely? I disagree very much. So you take a team, not good enough to win another superbowl WITH Rodgers. You remove Rodgers. Assuming you take a QB that same offseason, you draft one of, Newton, Gabbert, Ponder, Locker, Kaepernick, Dalton as the heir? Huge downgrade there, regardless of how right or wrong they get it. Get it real wrong, you may have straight torpedoed that team for the next 3 years. Now, for the mass of picks, the Packers drafted 29 players between 2011 and 2013. 7, or about 1/4, of those players are still in the league (I'm not going to count Guy, as he never played a snap as a Packer.) All but one have moved onto other teams. Tretter, Hyde, and Heyward all left after their rookie deals. So even if you add 21 picks, get another 5ish long term players, keep a few more past rookie deals without paying Rodgers, you're not getting a superbowl team out of that swap. Even if they get absurdly lucky, wait until 2012 to trade him, send him to Indy for the draft that would include a shot at Luck, I still wouldn't say that team probably wins another superbowl. Reality is, a huge chunk of those picks they get are busts or throwaways. You're getting, if you're lucky, a handful of good players from those picks. Not even great ones, but good ones. And you know the 2012 and 2013 picks will be lower as that team now has Rodgers and their prospects are improving. So only year one has high pick potential, and you'll know that from who you trade with. If they nail them all, sure, they'd likely win a superbowl, but that's not a realistic expectation. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerbyRam Posted May 19, 2020 Share Posted May 19, 2020 It depends on how much he wants to get paid. I imagine that he will eclipse the likes of Goff and Wentz in terms of wages (quite rightly) so you're looking at potentially €200m easy with a considerable amount guaranteed. Mahomes may well be a generational talent, but I'd take 3x 1st and 3x 2nds for the next couple of years - especially from a franchise that isn't loaded. Mahomes will be the peak of QB pay for a while, in my opinion. He will set the bar. At the moment, the top paid QBs in the league per contract: Matt Ryan - $150m total - $30m/year - $100m guaranteed - $94m fully guaranteed Russell Wilson - $140m total - $35m/year - $107m guaranteed - $70m fully guaranteed Jimmy G - $137.5m total - $27.5m/year - $74m guaranteed - $49m fully guaranteed Matt Stafford - $135m total - $27m/year - $92m guaranteed - $61m fully guaranteed Jared Goff - $134m total - $33.5m/year - $110m guaranteed - $57m fully guarantee8d Aaron Rodgers - $134m - $33.5m/year - $98m guaranteed - $79m fully guaranteed Carson Wentz - $128m - $32m/year - $108m guaranteed - $66m fully guaranteed Derek Carr - $125m - $25m/year - $70m guaranteed - $40m fully guaranteed Ryan Tannehill - $118m - $29.5m/year - $91m guaranteed - $62m fully guaranteed Alex Smith - $94m - $23.5m/year - $71m guaranteed - $55m fully guaranteed Ben Roethlisberger - $68m - $34m/year - $50m guaranteed - $38m fully guaranteed Kirk Cousins - $66m total - $33m/year - $96m guaranteed - $61m fully guaranteed Teddy Bridgewater - $63m total - $21m/year - $33m guaranteed - $33m fully guaranteed Tom Brady - $50m total - $25m/year - $50m guaranteed - $50m fully guaranteed Drew Brees - $50m total - $25m/year - $25m guaranteed - $25m fully guaranteed I would expect Mahomes to get something along the lines of $45m a year and Jackson $40m a year. Dak is looking for $35m+ as will Watson (for sure, maybe even $40m with Jackson). The likes of Darnold, Allen and Mayfield will have to think about overplaying their hand. I imagine all three will be signed to $35m+/year contracts though, eventually. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocky_rams Posted May 19, 2020 Share Posted May 19, 2020 6 hours ago, kingseanjohn said: 10 years of 1st round picks and I'm considering it. But more than likely, still not enough. Kinda overboard, but I get it from a fan’s perspective Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocky_rams Posted May 19, 2020 Share Posted May 19, 2020 Big Red better come in that deal with Mahomes if I’m spending that kind of draft capital Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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