Good Read from SI: Chicago Bears Virtual QB Room

[G08]

https://www.si.com/nfl/2020/05/18/matt-nagy-chicago-bears-virtual-quarterback-room

[G08]

Nobody has any thoughts no this? Nagy basically admitted the offense had a poor lack of attention to detail last season, he's scrapping plays/schemes that worked well in KC because they're failing here, and he's giving his staff the power to push back against his ideas in order to implement better ones.

[WindyCity]

2 hours ago, G08 said:

Nobody has any thoughts no this? Nagy basically admitted the offense had a poor lack of attention to detail last season, he's scrapping plays/schemes that worked well in KC because they're failing here, and he's giving his staff the power to push back against his ideas in order to implement better ones.

I think this is your standard new staff piece.

We will see what Nagy does when the bullets were flying. I am one who believes that the personnel issues on offense also hurt Nagy last season, but he wasn't good. His play calling was erratic and he took way to long to adapt, not just for Trubisky.

[WindyCity]

I really like Nagy, but he showed up last season and was not ready for the adjustment the league had made to him.

[dll2000]

1 hour ago, WindyCity said:

I think this is your standard new staff piece.

We will see what Nagy does when the bullets were flying. I am one who believes that the personnel issues on offense also hurt Nagy last season, but he wasn't good. His play calling was erratic and he took way to long to adapt, not just for Trubisky.

I think it was personnel and execution.  They couldn't execute their base plays that set everything else up so that led to flailing about trying to get SOMETHING/ANYTHING to work.  It had to have been incredibly frustrating.  

Like a boxer or fighter that can't jab or base kick.  Then his big shots don't work or miss because they aren't set up properly and are expected and countered.  

Then he has no choice but to start trying to do crazy stuff because that is only way he has a chance to win.   But crazy stuff makes you look like an idiot most of time.

All that started in way they all prepared for the season and personnel decisions that they made or didn't make.  Once they were in it, there was no way out.

But it wasn't bad play calling.  IMO.  

 

 

 

Edited May 19, 2020 by dll2000

[G08]

At minimum, the offensive line needs to be flawless in their execution of blocks and assignments. That's for both the run and pass game.

WRs need to be precise in running their routes, particularly depth and ensuring that they are always where the QB expects them to be, when he expects them to be there.

 

You can live with the rest schematically.

[dll2000]

42 minutes ago, G08 said:

At minimum, the offensive line needs to be flawless in their execution of blocks and assignments. That's for both the run and pass game.

WRs need to be precise in running their routes, particularly depth and ensuring that they are always where the QB expects them to be, when he expects them to be there.

You can live with the rest schematically.

Well some of 'mistakes' aren't just blocking 'wrong' guy.  It's also not coming off the double and leaving the LB unblocked to make the play.  It's also bad communication on a combo resulting in blocking wrong guy.  Or the initial line call was wrong and you slid opposite of way they actually were coming.  

Its never going to be 100%.

WRs are always going to make some mistakes because it isn't all just running 8 yards and breaking this way or that way.   They have reads on some routes based on positions of defenders or whether they are in man or zone.

It is easy to get that wrong sometimes or read it differently on fly than the QB.

Sometimes its I am going to give the DB this one more move to get open and QB lets fly and ball is over thrown because he didn't expect that extra stutter step and necessary reacceleration.  

All that being said, the execution in 2019 was still embarrassing for an NFL team.  Especially at beginning of the season.  

 

[abstract_thought]

Bears fans: We excuse mediocre QB play but expect every other player to execute his responsibilities flawlessly.

[G08]

1 hour ago, abstract_thought said:

Bears fans: We excuse mediocre QB play but expect every other player to execute his responsibilities flawlessly.

QB is the hardest position to play in all of sports.

[JAF-N72EX]

2 hours ago, abstract_thought said:

Bears fans: We excuse mediocre QB play but expect every other player to execute his responsibilities flawlessly.

The thing is, the QB position is much more dependent on the other 10 guys doing their jobs than the rest of them are. 

For example, the OL missing a pass block isnt going to have any effect on the RB or stop the WR/TE's from running good routes, but it sure as hell is going to make it hard for the QB to do his job. If a WR/TE drops a pass it isn't going to effect the RB or OL but it is going to make the QB's job much harder. If the RB misses a cut back lane on a 2nd and 10 it isn't going to effect the WR or TE but it is going to make the QB's job harder by forcing him into a 3rd and long.

This is why the QB position is the most important player on offense because they have the most responsibilities.

[JAF-N72EX]

11 hours ago, G08 said:

Nagy basically admitted the offense had a poor lack of attention to detail last season, he's scrapping plays/schemes that worked well in KC because they're failing here,

I knew it. This is why I have been telling people to stop saying "the Bears run the same offense as KC/PHI" because it has been very clear to me that it isn't true at all. 

But I'm glad that he at least recognizes it. Now he just needs to back up those words. 

[abstract_thought]

2 hours ago, JustAnotherFan said:

The thing is, the QB position is much more dependent on the other 10 guys doing their jobs than the rest of them are. 

For example, the OL missing a pass block isnt going to have any effect on the RB or stop the WR/TE's from running good routes, but it sure as hell is going to make it hard for the QB to do his job. If a WR/TE drops a pass it isn't going to effect the RB or OL but it is going to make the QB's job much harder. If the RB misses a cut back lane on a 2nd and 10 it isn't going to effect the WR or TE but it is going to make the QB's job harder by forcing him into a 3rd and long.

This is why the QB position is the most important player on offense because they have the most responsibilities.

Agree with all of this, but it still doesn't change my point. There's an obvious double-standard in Bears fans where everything is expected to be perfect for whichever QB provides the rosiest long-term potential. Poor performance by anyone associated with that QB is used as an excuse to kick the can down the road on finding a replacement.

And while poor play in any position group will affect a QB, there have certainly been effective QBs with protection worse than Mitch's in 2019. The NFL reality is that protection is not going to be flawless. Good NFL QBs can make plays even when things don't go 100% according to script.

[JAF-N72EX]

27 minutes ago, abstract_thought said:

Agree with all of this, but it still doesn't change my point. There's an obvious double-standard in Bears fans where everything is expected to be perfect for whichever QB provides the rosiest long-term potential. Poor performance by anyone associated with that QB is used as an excuse to kick the can down the road on finding a replacement.

And while poor play in any position group will affect a QB, there have certainly been effective QBs with protection worse than Mitch's in 2019. The NFL reality is that protection is not going to be flawless. Good NFL QBs can make plays even when things don't go 100% according to script.

I agree with this and I fully understood your initial point as well.  However, that double standard is not only exclusive to only either Bears fans...it happens to every other QB as well. I guess that was the point I was getting at. 

Playing QB alone is going to always bring the most attention and that attention is always going to be ten-fold on a team like the Bears who have not had a good QB in decades.

But at the same time, It comes with the territory. 

Edited May 20, 2020 by JustAnotherFan

[soulman]

Well they always say "the devil is in the details" so at the very least Nagy has correctly identified that issue and set out to fix it.  That's a positive.

I can't speak to all of this so much from the perspective of an experienced footballer but I can from the perspective of a very experienced musician.

NFL football doesn't lend itself well at all to the jam band approach.  It's far more about precise repetition of scripted material played over and over again to perfection and that requires different skills and a wholly different approach.  Let's take a single example from each category.  Jam Band: The Allman Brothers  Scripted Band: The Eagles

In a good jam band ideas and new riffs flow between players like water in a stream never taking exactly the same path 100% of the time.  But for that to work all of the players must be highly intuitive musicians, great listeners, and very talented players on their instruments.  If not the material will never be tight and extended jams fall apart quickly.   Over the years as players changed their music changed somewhat based on the influences those musicians brought to band.  The Allmans of the 90s and 00s weren't the Allmans of the '60s or '70s.

In a scripted band like the Eagles each song played live in concert is played exactly the same as it was recorded (as close as possible) and will always be played that same way each time it's performed.  Their harmonies and who sings what part never change and the dueling outro solos between Joe Walsh and Don Felder on Hotel California are played note for note the way they were originally recorded.  That's the way they roll and always have so even changes in personnel had little or no impact on a live performance. They sound just like they always have.

IMHO one reason the Pats have been so successful for so long is Belichick uses a similar scripted approach to everything where it's all about attention to detail and executing each assignment exactly how it's drawn up.  It's how he's managed to stay on top and keep winning even when he drafts low each year and is constantly replacing the parts in his football machine year in year out.  He has had a GOAT QB so all he needed was players with decent talent who could perform week in and week out with almost boring uber consistency.

The Pats are like The Eagles of the NFL.

But this was Lombardi football too  He built is team around a few very talented stars, a 17th round pick QB who made few mistakes, and a whole lot of castoffs from other teams who simply needed a more regimented scheme to play in to be successful.  While Halas depended more on toughness and hard nosed in your face football Lombardi beat you with perfect execution and finding ways to allow teams to beat themselves by forcing errors.  Lombardi could tell you upfront what play he was gonna call then just dare you to stop it.

IMHO we do need to get tougher on offense in some ways but we also need to get a whole lot smarter because the league caught on to Nagy's gadget stuff pretty quickly and as DLL has posted we couldn't execute our base offense.  It was the execution of his base offense that made Lombardi's scheme so effective and served his gadget and outside the box plays so well.  Until we can do that week in week out we can't expect to be much better than a mid tier contender never reaching the top.  The best will beat us every time.