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DK Metcalf Vs Deebo Samuel


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47 members have voted

  1. 1. Choose

    • DK Metcalf
      30
    • Deebo Samuel
      17


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3 hours ago, sammymvpknight said:

Because I don't think that they are good players in every system.

That depends on your definItion of “good”. Do you mean good as in equally productive? Good as in equally effective?

Deebo and DK are fine players. Any team would be lucky to have them if they became available.  

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12 minutes ago, SmittyBacall said:

That depends on your definItion of “good”. Do you mean good as in equally productive? Good as in equally effective?

Deebo and DK are fine players. Any team would be lucky to have them if they became available.  

I still think that they are both contributors...they are solid players. I don't think that either are true #1 WRs but they make it work and are productive in the systems that they play. I do think that they could both struggle if they left their current teams, and that is why I have some reservations about both of their abilities. But reality is reality...they are both contributors on teams that are absolutely perfect for their skillsets. If I'm the Saints or Jaguars (my two favorite teams)...I'm taking AJ Brown and Scary Terry in a heartbeat...because I think that they would succeed in any system.

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11 hours ago, J-ALL-DAY said:
11 hours ago, Killashaw said:

I think Metcalf would thrive in almost every offense, while Samuel is amazing at certain plays, like sweeps, but can't really do it in every system. Aka you have to adjust some plays to him, which isn't a huge deal obviously but still something you would rather avoid. 

 

I'm taking Metcalf just bc he's more of a true WR 1 than Samuel.

I'm not sure about that. There are certain teams where Metcalf wouldn't be as good. Seattle uses his skillset very well and it certainly helps he has a QB who is good with the deep ball. 

I was going to say the same thing. like @sammymvpknight is saying, both guys benefitted tremendously from their situations.

Deebo is certainly a great fit for the Shanahan offense, but I would argue that DK was very very fortunate he landed in a place with a QB is one of the best in the NFL at throwing the deep ball. That is basically all they do with him, send him deep or throw bubble screens to him. That's basically it. That's the route tree, like 4-5 routes with most of them running in a straight line (or thereabouts). 

DK is an incredible deep threat because of his size and long strides. Russ throws a very catchable deep ball. It puts a lot of pressure on a corner. 

I don't understand why people say Deebo wouldnt fit elsewhere. The guy is an incredible route runner and played every WR position (its part of the reason he had a moderately slow start to the season, its a complicated playbook and he was being asked to do a ton with no other good WRs on our roster). Did he benefit from Shanahan's offense? Sure thing. Does that mean he would be a lesser player elsewhere? absolutely not. DK on the other hand would not be the same player he is somewhere besides Seattle.  

DK only played X and in college he only played on one side of the field for a reason. He did spend most of his time in seattle on the left side as well. The guy is not polished. He very well may become polished, and when that happens he will be a lot harder to stop, but right now he is predictable and not versatile. He will bully smaller or slower corners, and benefit from perfect throws, but he will never be able to get himself open the way that Deebo does

13 hours ago, SpacemanSpiff said:

Tough to say, so I'll just go with my personal preference which is I tend to prefer my WRs to have height. Kenny Golladay is a perfect example of one of my ideal types of WRs. Size/speed combo. Calvin Johnson was another. The prototype, honestly. If you're not going to have that height, you better be elite at separating from defenders in the NFL or you better be one of the best route runners alive. Deebo is neither of those (yet, at least) so I'll take Metcalf just because that's the type of receiver I prefer to have my QB throwing to. 

That's a fair statement, some of this is personal preference.

I prefer guys with great feet, who have great lateral quickness, who make contested catches with strong hands. That describes Deebo. You say if you don't have the height, you better be great at separating, well Deebo is on his way to becoming an upper echelon route runner.

Height is certainly nice, especially in the redzone, so while DK isn't great at separating, its ok because he is big. To me, being able to separate is a skill, where as height is a physical trait. I would rather have a WR that has more skills than just physical traits. (obviously above a certain threshold)

I would argue he has much better hands than DK. Deebo dropped some super easy passes, but I think that was concentration more than ability (ie he looked away before securing the catch). DK dropped passes because that's what he does. He did it at ole miss, he has done it in Seattle. They are drops in the sense that he did everything he could to catch them, but dropped it anyway. I will concede its impossible at this point in time to quantify, but that is what the tape is telling me. One guy has better hands than the other. 

Deebo is more skilled imo. Better routes, better hands, better after the catch. DK is a better deep threat, but there is something to be said for a guy that takes a 5 yard slant and turns it into a 30 yard play after a broken tackle or two. Deebo runs with power when he has the ball in his hands. DK does too but not in the same way because he cant move laterally at all. That's who he is right now and that limits his upside in my book. I am unsure DK will ever be able to develop into a very good route runner. 

11 hours ago, sammymvpknight said:

I honestly think that both are a little overrated. Both landed in perfect landing spots for their skillsets. I think that AJ Brown and Terry McLaurin are both better players.

I thought about making this thread about all of the 2nd year WRs out there, because as good as this current draft is being hyped for WRs, some damn good ones came out last year too. I decided that I didn't want to muddy the waters and that there will be time for that debate later. These guys put up very similar numbers and play in the same division within one of the best rivalries in the NFL

12 hours ago, SmittyBacall said:

Though I will say Metcalf’s ability is rarer.

That's true but it doesn't necessarily mean its more valuable. Rarity can increase price of a commodity, but not because it caries more value, just because of restricted supply... (meaning it has nothing to do with demand)

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15 hours ago, sammymvpknight said:

I still think that they are both contributors...they are solid players. I don't think that either are true #1 WRs but they make it work and are productive in the systems that they play.

That’s fair, but I don’t think anyone is hyping them up as the next big things at the position. 

15 hours ago, sammymvpknight said:

I do think that they could both struggle if they left their current teams, and that is why I have some reservations about both of their abilities.

I think while they obviously benefit from their respective landing spots, “falling flat on their faces” in another system or “struggling” on a different team is overboard. Their skillsets are universal to pretty much any team.

15 hours ago, sammymvpknight said:

But reality is reality...they are both contributors on teams that are absolutely perfect for their skillsets.

Could this not be said about Drew Brees and Michael Thomas, for instance? Or Tom Brady and Julian Edelman? They obviously benefit from the system they play/played in, and would be lesser players as a by product if they were placed in a system that didn’t suit them. If we’re going to penalize Deebo and DK from benefitting from a system, we need to apply that logic elsewhere. 

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You have to love the outlook of both players. I imagine both will be consistent threats over the next half decade at least. 

I think DK is more versatile in the sense of various ways he can beat you vertically. Deebo is very versatile himself, but it's primarily close to the LOS plays. Any offense would love to have either guy, but I'd prefer the guy who will threaten a defense vertically rather than horizontally. 

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12 minutes ago, Daniel said:

I hated DK as a prospect.  He's already proven me wrong, but IIRC, he was running like 90% go routes last year.

Gimme Deebo.

A lot of go routes early on, but he really started to shine late in the season when Schottenheimer worked him around on sticks and crossing routes. People disliked him as a prospect because he's a stiff route runner, but that's not the only way you a receiver wins. A guy with that combo of size, speed, and ball skills is going to be a mismatch problem, especially when you have Russell Wilson throwing to him. 

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 5/28/2020 at 12:10 PM, SaveOurSonics said:

A lot of go routes early on, but he really started to shine late in the season when Schottenheimer worked him around on sticks and crossing routes. People disliked him as a prospect because he's a stiff route runner, but that's not the only way you a receiver wins. A guy with that combo of size, speed, and ball skills is going to be a mismatch problem, especially when you have Russell Wilson throwing to him. 

Right, but youre earlier comment of "DK is more versatile" is just flat out wrong. 

DK does a few things really well. He runs deep routes and he catches bubble screens. Thats it basically (so far). Corners, Posts, Deep routes are all the same type of route. DK usually only lines up on one side of the field. I wasnt a huge fan of his as a prospect but I said the day he was drafted he went to the absolute perfect spot due to cohesion with wilson because wilson throws a pretty deep ball. That might change later, he could develop into a more polished route runner

Deebo is asked to do a lot more. His route tree is much more diverse than DKs. Its not debatable in that sense. Doesnt mean he is better necessarily, but his game is more well rounded.

its going to be a really fun division for the next 5 years. 

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dEyIOlZ.png

They are two very different receivers.  DK was one of the best deep threats in the league last year per target.  Samuel was one the the better YAC threats.  I'd lean towards DK personally.

Edited by Gmen
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8 hours ago, N4L said:

Right, but youre earlier comment of "DK is more versatile" is just flat out wrong. 

DK does a few things really well. He runs deep routes and he catches bubble screens. Thats it basically (so far). Corners, Posts, Deep routes are all the same type of route. DK usually only lines up on one side of the field. I wasnt a huge fan of his as a prospect but I said the day he was drafted he went to the absolute perfect spot due to cohesion with wilson because wilson throws a pretty deep ball. That might change later, he could develop into a more polished route runner

Deebo is asked to do a lot more. His route tree is much more diverse than DKs. Its not debatable in that sense. Doesnt mean he is better necessarily, but his game is more well rounded.

its going to be a really fun division for the next 5 years. 

What exactly is Deebo asked to do that DK isn't? End arounds? You can point to a difference in specific routes (so can I) but that doesn't mean that DK isn't exploiting the same areas of the field as Deebo plus some. 

Like I said, DK started to shine late in the season when Schottenheimer was mixing in a lot of stick routes and crossing routes. Deebo is great after the catch, but DK also eats yards in the open field with his acceleration. DK is far and away the better vertical threat, which poses as a greater threat to the opposition. He was attacking defenses at the short, intermediate, and deep areas of the field late in the season. Deebo was primarily being schemed open near the LOS to take advantage of his abilities with the ball in his hands. 

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