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Karnage84

ESPN Article: Amendola and Flowers laud Matt Patricia's tone

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https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/29200879

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"The way I operate as a football player and the product that I put on the field in relation to the business that I conduct, I want it to be as tough as possible in practice so when I get into the games I've been there before," Amendola said. "I understand what it feels like to be tired in a game because I was tired in practice, and I understand what my body can go through and how I can push my body mentally and physically, and that's something I really relate to. That's something I look for.

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"I tried to give as much insight as I could as far as what was the expectation or what was the demand and why is the demand for excellence so high," Flowers said. "Coach Patricia, he's a guy who has always been about winning. And so however he can get that out of guys, he demands highly of them and expects highly of them and his standards are very high no matter what environment he goes in.

"Guys like you mentioned obviously was accustomed to a different style or a different type, and that's just how business goes. Some people like it and some people don't. That's just how any business you go in, you're going to have people that agree with things and don't agree with things."

 

 

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Pretty good article.  The one thing about this regime is they definitely brought change.  Since I've been watching the Lions, 30+ years, I don't remember a coaching style like this one.  Will it work? I have my doubts, but it is definitely different.  As a fan base, we've asked to be tougher more times then I remember, but then when it happens, we want to go back to the old ways.

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In fairness, these are guys that knew him before and have come into the team. However, it does speak to the transition from Caldwell to Patricia. It will only work if the start stringing some W's together. 

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5 hours ago, Karnage84 said:

In fairness, these are guys that knew him before and have come into the team. However, it does speak to the transition from Caldwell to Patricia. It will only work if the start stringing some W's together. 

I cannot stress how important it is that we were winning games prior to Patricia's arrival and have been losing since.

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1 minute ago, nagahide13 said:

I cannot stress how important it is that we were winning games prior to Patricia's arrival and have been losing since.

Which is what can and likely will happen during a rebuild. Just because they haven't used those words doesn't mean that isn't what has been happening here. It's not a total tear down but it is a substantial change in the roster. 

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Depth Chart - 2017 (May 1) according to OurLads; May 1, 2018 ; May 1, 2020

Offense

WR: Golden Tate, Marvin Jones, Kenny G, TJ Jones

OL: Greg Robinson, Graham Glasgow, Travis Swanson, TJ Lang, Rick Wagner

TE: Eric Ebron, Darren Fells

RB: Ameer Abdullah, Theo Riddick

QB: Stafford

10/14 were brought back in 2018 (71% retained or 29% turnover); 3 are still on the roster in 2020 (21% retained or 79% turnover). 

Defense

DE: Corneilius Washington, Anthony Zettel

DT: A'Shawn Robinson, Haloti Ngata

OLB: Tahir Whitehead, Antwione Williams, JRM

MLB: Jarrad Davis, Paul Worrilow

CB: Slay, DJ Hayden

CB: Nevin Lawson

SS: Tavon Wilson

FS: Glover Quin

8/14 (57% retained or 43% turnover) were brought back in 2018. We now have 2/14 (14% retained or 86% turnover) still on the roster. Outside of JD this is an entirely different set of players going into 2020 instead of the roster in 2017. 

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1 hour ago, Karnage84 said:

Which is what can and likely will happen during a rebuild. Just because they haven't used those words doesn't mean that isn't what has been happening here. It's not a total tear down but it is a substantial change in the roster. 

This goes back to word choice.  Quinn fired Caldwell because first round playoff losses weren't good enough.  This wasn't supposed to be a rebuild it was supposed to be taking a solid team and getting them over the hump.  His choice of words to support hiring his buddy, and they havent won since.  

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11 minutes ago, Sllim Pickens said:

This goes back to word choice.  Quinn fired Caldwell because first round playoff losses weren't good enough.  This wasn't supposed to be a rebuild it was supposed to be taking a solid team and getting them over the hump.  His choice of words to support hiring his buddy, and they havent won since.  

That's all fair. Still - it is what it is. It is a rebuild. Maybe it wasn't meant to be but it is. 

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Look at Bill Belichick or Sean Payton when they first started out. Rebuilds take time & until they play this year, I’m not going to judge this staff. I believe they made some big moves this off season to build a solid team who will play better as an over all unit. The draft is seen as pretty good one by everyone outside of the Detroit media. So I’m holding judgement until they play & I’m not scared by their schedule. Playing tough teams makes you better & if your going to make the playoffs & win there, you need to play the tough competition. 

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We may have been winning games but we were never dominant.  Sometimes we were just plain soft.  Injuries played a big part of our problem last year.  The other one as Paul Pasqulaoni.  Paul Pasqualoni did a horrible job of developing his young talent.  There was no excuse for the lack of pressure from our D-Line.  Every O-Line looked like a Super Bowl caliber O-line last year.

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On 5/29/2020 at 7:43 PM, Just Want A Title said:

We may have been winning games but we were never dominant.  Sometimes we were just plain soft.  Injuries played a big part of our problem last year.  The other one as Paul Pasqulaoni.  Paul Pasqualoni did a horrible job of developing his young talent.  There was no excuse for the lack of pressure from our D-Line.  Every O-Line looked like a Super Bowl caliber O-line last year.

Definetly agree on the soft part. I just dont get how they expect a DB to run with a WR play after play after play after play when no one is touching the QB. I know its a chess match but sheesh. Thats fundamentals. You must get to the QB. Unless your corner is amazing at baiting and gets a bunch of picks. But I think we were at the bottom for picks and tied for 2nd worst in sacks...thats rough..

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On 2020-05-21 at 4:19 PM, nagahide13 said:

I cannot stress how important it is that we were winning games prior to Patricia's arrival and have been losing since.

Yes.

Its also necessary for coaches to be flexible with not only skill sets but personalities.

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On 5/21/2020 at 4:19 PM, nagahide13 said:

I cannot stress how important it is that we were winning games prior to Patricia's arrival and have been losing since.

Although technically true, his .563 winning percentage as head coach of the Lions wasn't anything impressive: good enough to occasionally lose in the first round of the playoffs and never bad enough to obtain draft capital of significance. I'd much rather acquire elite prospects and try to make a legitimate run than stay in mediocrity forever.

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1 hour ago, TL-TwoWinsAway said:

Although technically true, his .563 winning percentage as head coach of the Lions wasn't anything impressive: good enough to occasionally lose in the first round of the playoffs and never bad enough to obtain draft capital of significance. I'd much rather acquire elite prospects and try to make a legitimate run than stay in mediocrity forever.

A win percentage of .563 would put him top 50 all time in coaches win percentage and higher if you take out the guys in the 1950s and earlier.  Its hard to win in this league and he constantly had us as a winner.  And the wording and direction used at that time was to replace him to get over the hump because just making the playoffs isnt good enough.  Since then we have won 8 games. 

 

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51 minutes ago, Sllim Pickens said:

A win percentage of .563 would put him top 50 all time in coaches win percentage and higher if you take out the guys in the 1950s and earlier.  Its hard to win in this league and he constantly had us as a winner.  And the wording and direction used at that time was to replace him to get over the hump because just making the playoffs isnt good enough.  Since then we have won 8 games.

Yeah, it puts him in the Wade Phillips/Jason Garrett range: decent coaches that'll do enough to keep you from picking high in the draft, but have little to no playoff success. I haven't heard anyone begging for us to go after either of them.

"Consistently had us as a winner" is a bit of a stretch. He went 7-9, 9-7 and 9-7 over his last three years. The good teams view those years as complete and utter failures.

If we have success from this point forward, after essentially tanking last year, Quinn's plan would be a success: we did enough to land an elite prospect in Okudah while acquiring talented fits on both sides of the ball. Not tanking and going 7-9, 9-7, 9-7 may look like "winning", but we wouldn't have actually accomplished anything.

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