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Jets S Jamal Adams demands trade

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5 hours ago, dcat said:

You couldn't be more wrong about positional value if you tried.  No matter how good your safety is, it is far more important to have good OT, CB, Edge and of course QB. It is far more important to use your salary cap wisely, as I believe Joe Douglas will do.  So glad that JD isn't buckling to this idiot's absurd and premature demands.  

You've been "wrong" with nearly every single post yet instead of admitting it, you just pivot to an equally subjective thought. Appreciate the feedback, nonetheless. 

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17 hours ago, KingOfTheDot said:

Positional value matters though regardless of how you, me or anyone sees it. If Adams was an Outside Linebacker and was doing all of these things he'd be worth the 20M potentially but when you have to go 2 Deep, like we did early in the season because our Corners sucked, and he's playing the deep half and not making those gamechanging plays that 20M price tag hurts. It is all relative value.

This is the first positional value argument that is entirely fair. Given the right situation, where Jamal isn't confined to a specified role because of personnel deficiencies, I couldn't care less what his position is on the depth chart. It's irrelevant to his impact, which so many "traditionalist" don't want to hear.

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8 minutes ago, NJC33 said:

This is the first positional value argument that is entirely fair. Given the right situation, where Jamal isn't confined to a specified role because of personnel deficiencies, I couldn't care less what his position is on the depth chart. It's irrelevant to his impact, which so many "traditionalist" don't want to hear.

Yeah that's where the issue lies. It's like us having Bell without a quality OL. No matter how good the RB is if you cannot block for him then he's not going to give you the best production. Or having a WR who excels in the deep game with a QB who cannot stretch the field. 

 

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On 6/29/2020 at 1:35 PM, NJC33 said:

This is the first positional value argument that is entirely fair. Given the right situation, where Jamal isn't confined to a specified role because of personnel deficiencies, I couldn't care less what his position is on the depth chart. It's irrelevant to his impact, which so many "traditionalist" don't want to hear.

It is far from irrelevant to his impact.   Excellent Safety.  It is not and never will be, no matter how much anyone tries, be anywhere as near critical as OT, Edge, CB and QB.  There is no way I allocate anything close to Adams' demands (particularly a full year too early) if it diminishes the opportunity to allocate cap resources to the positions that will actually lead to a difference in the number of wins.  That ain't Adams no matter how much he and his legion of supporters wish it to be.  Plus he is an ******* who has insulted his teammates multiple times, turned against the fans that have bought in to his BS, making him the most impressive PHONY leader I've ever seen. 

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On 6/28/2020 at 5:38 PM, NJC33 said:

Spot on.. Those using "positional value" arguments to discredit Adam's importance have no idea the impact his versatility has on a defense or just how good he is in all facets of the game. Great video

Biggest BS argument (among the many out there).  No one is arguing he has no talent at his position or when he morphs into his LB role due to the rewst of the pass rush being horrible.  But that talent has not led to the number of wins we need because the more important positions on this team suck because of Maccagnan.  

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On 6/29/2020 at 1:28 PM, NJC33 said:

You've been "wrong" with nearly every single post yet instead of admitting it, you just pivot to an equally subjective thought. Appreciate the feedback, nonetheless. 

ThAt'S your opinion dude.  Mine is that Adams position and value to getting wins is not worth the money IMO.  Adams horrible narcisstic/selfish personality squashes any of the false claims that he is some sort of "leader" (undoubtedly the most wrong thing anyone has ever claimed is that he provides leadership, when he has demonstrated clearly that he is an anti-leader, throwing his teammates and nanyone else in his way under the bus.)    It is so sad to see so many fans duped by this me-first, no regard for team, character.

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 Yesterday... more Twitter nonsense for the sole purpose of enraging the fans.  His attempt to shoot his way out of town by insulting the fans, the management and worst of all, eventhe veiled attacks on his teammates (we need dawgs here... I'll not ask for an extension for these 8 teams....)  should not be honored.  That's my take.

 And outside of his social media manipultions, there is not a thing he can do about it. The sound of JD's silence is driving Adams crazy.  Adsms will lose his mind long before JD caves in to this utter nonsense. 

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23 minutes ago, dcat said:

ThAt'S your opinion dude.  Mine is that Adams position and value to getting wins is not worth the money IMO.  Adams horrible narcisstic/selfish personality squashes any of the false claims that he is some sort of "leader" (undoubtedly the most wrong thing anyone has ever claimed is that he provides leadership, when he has demonstrated clearly that he is an anti-leader, throwing his teammates and nanyone else in his way under the bus.)    It is so sad to see so many fans duped by this me-first, no regard for team, character.

My opinion is that your subjective takes are constantly proven inaccurate & you just continuously pivot to the next emotionally driven argument.

33 minutes ago, dcat said:

It is far from irrelevant to his impact.   Excellent Safety.  It is not and never will be, no matter how much anyone tries, be anywhere as near critical as OT, Edge, CB and QB.  There is no way I allocate anything close to Adams' demands (particularly a full year too early) if it diminishes the opportunity to allocate cap resources to the positions that will actually lead to a difference in the number of wins.

WHY?!? Not even trying to be controversial, you've yet to support any argument with objective reasoning. I've given you evidence that his usage doesn't align with the normalcy of his position & you've ignored it because it doesn't fit your box safety narrative. Furthermore, the game is evolving. Guys like Jamal & Derwin James are going to entirely redefine how we view and value the position IMO. Look what Tyrann Mathieu just did for the Chiefs defense. Versatility is valued now more than ever, and there simply isn't any player as versatile as Adams. That's important for defensive coordinators trying to combat this new wave of mobile QB's & air raid offenses. 

The cap argument is nonsense. Unfortunately, it isn't something we have to worry about right now (At all). 

I'm willing to listen, @KingOfTheDot made a great point relating to positional value that I had overlooked...But, not if everything you argue is fueled by a bias agenda. I can rattle off a long list of reasons & FACTS to illustrate why Jamal is so valuable. There's no point if you're going to refute it with certainty by siting INTs & subjective rhetoric, so we can agree to disagree.

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Posted (edited)
On 7/1/2020 at 9:36 AM, NJC33 said:

My opinion is that your subjective takes are constantly proven inaccurate & you just continuously pivot to the next emotionally driven argument.

WHY?!? Not even trying to be controversial, you've yet to support any argument with objective reasoning. I've given you evidence that his usage doesn't align with the normalcy of his position & you've ignored it because it doesn't fit your box safety narrative. Furthermore, the game is evolving. Guys like Jamal & Derwin James are going to entirely redefine how we view and value the position IMO. Look what Tyrann Mathieu just did for the Chiefs defense. Versatility is valued now more than ever, and there simply isn't any player as versatile as Adams. That's important for defensive coordinators trying to combat this new wave of mobile QB's & air raid offenses. 

The cap argument is nonsense. Unfortunately, it isn't something we have to worry about right now (At all). 

I'm willing to listen, @KingOfTheDot made a great point relating to positional value that I had overlooked...But, not if everything you argue is fueled by a bias agenda. I can rattle off a long list of reasons & FACTS to illustrate why Jamal is so valuable. There's no point if you're going to refute it with certainty by siting INTs & subjective rhetoric, so we can agree to disagree.

If you agree to disagree then why are you repeating the same points over and over?  You are trying to convince me that the SS position (including Williams' versatile use of Adams)  is worth the kind of money that Adams is screaming for vs the overall salary cap linitations.   I acknowledge that Adams is versatile and an excellent safety. IMO (opinion)  his production (INTs, tackles, assisted tackles pass defended, sacks etc) is very good.  But at $20 mill+ per season, he becomes one of the top 3-5 paid defenders (never mind totally out of sync with strong safeties).  That position isn't worth that  percentage of a teams' salary cap.  And that's it for me and until the cap is gone (never) that's the way it will be.  Positional value is critically important to the make-up of the team.  Plus, he's not a leader in any way and the me-first vibe he gives can't be good for team morale in any way.   No one is sayinghe isn't a good player.  I think he is overrated, but he is an excellent player.   But not worth his demands.  You and I disagree on his value.

And it looks like the rest of the league isn't rushing in to trade for Jamal at that price either.  Read Damien Woody's comments from yesterday (Daryl Slater's article from NJ.com).  Jamal has been advised poorly with repect to this whole mess he created.  Slater thinks he is savvy, but admits the whole thing is fruitless.  Joe Douglas has no reason to engage at this time and he won't.

Edited by dcat

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from Jason Fitzgerald at OverTheCap

https://overthecap.com/thoughts-on-the-concept-of-trading-jamal-adams/

"Player’s like Adams are very hard to take a fair look at. On one side there is the player -  and there really are little holes in his game. He is arguably the best overall safety in the NFL. He plays up in the box, can rush the passer a bit more than others and can cover well enough in the secondary. He’s the best player on the Jets at the moment.

However, being the best player on a bad team sometimes doesn’t carry the same value as the same player on a good team. Since Adams arrived in New York the Jets are 16-32.  His being the best safety has made little impact on the overall success or failure of the team. That isn’t a knock on him its just that there is only so much a safety can do to increase the chances of winning for a team. Adams being at the peak of his career isn’t going to make the Jets a 10 win team. It is also one of the reasons why the league values safety on the lower end of the salary spectrum, basically on par with running backs and tight ends.

That said, to a good team that considers themselves a Super Bowl contender, whatever added value that safety brings can be worth a lot because getting from 11 to 12 or 12 to 13 wins on a year is huge as is getting that one added win in the playoffs. While Adams isn’t going to make a bad team great or even good -  he can be considered a game changer in a different kind of situation. If that is something the Jets can exploit, it can bring more value than the player himself."

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