Pace's Three Major Upgrades

[WindyCity]

13 minutes ago, JustAnotherFan said:

While this may be true, we still had holes that needed to be filled.  Plus, we needed to keep the strength of our team as strong as possible and these additions, presumably, does just that. 

The weakness of the team was a bigger deal for me.

The offense did not really have a significant addition. 

[JAF-N72EX]

9 minutes ago, WindyCity said:

The weakness of the team was a bigger deal for me.

The offense did not really have a significant addition. 

I hear ya. No, there wasn't any major additions added to the offense, but I think the more significant changes that we will see comes in the way of the offensive play-calling and seeing more 2 TE set formations now that we have Kmet. This was something that we couldn't do in 2019 that worked well in 2018. In 2018 we ran 21% of the plays from a 2 TE set and only 13% in 2019. This was largely in part because Burton. 

This will help in a few different ways. 1) It will allow us to keep a TE in to help block more to help the OL. 2) We will see a reduction in plays designed for Cohen in the backfield. 3) Give Mitch better security blankets.

 

[soulman]

On 6/27/2020 at 8:26 PM, WindyCity said:

My issue is the defense wasn’t the problem

OK, but THIS thread is about those three upgrades.  So put the scissors down and start playing nice with the others like the rest of us. 

Always a trouble maker in every crowd......Sheesh.

[soulman]

On 6/27/2020 at 8:44 PM, WindyCity said:

The offense did not really have a significant addition. 

So we didn't need any new TEs or a RG or another experienced QB?  Those aren't significant additions?

Oh hell.  We better let Pace know he screwed up again.

[MonserinNC]

13 hours ago, soulman said:

So we didn't need any new TEs or a RG or another experienced QB?  Those aren't significant additions?

Oh hell.  We better let Pace know he screwed up again.

Im `with you!!

I think the biggest upgrades actually did come on offense!! Gipson Ive heard is just kind of ok and was more of a one hit wonder, Quinn I actually do think is big. 

I actually think the biggest addition is TE as a whole....I fell like people kind of just forgot that our TE position was COMPLETE TRASH last year. Ive said it before but Graham was considered a FA bust and he still produced more than our unit. Then you add Kmet....and not even mentioning Demetrius Harris......while its not as significant as the addition of Khalil Mack obviously, it turns a position of weakness to a full blown strength. Besides the guys who have superstar TE's on their team, we are pretty deep as a group now.

QB to me is 2nd, adding Foles was a majorly underrated move. We added a Super Bowl champ and super experienced QB to a room that basically just had Trubisky and Chase Daniel haha. From all reports people seem to like Tru and I think he rises to this competition, and for Foles this is sort of his last chance(as it was in Philly) to maintain being a viable starter. Both players will benefit from this competition. 

3rd is RG to me. Kyle Long was terrible, I saw him get thrown around and completely dominated. Coward is a converted DT or something. Adding a former first round tackle at OG is kind of a big deal. I would say its right up there around Gipson but probably higher. Ifedi was a starter for a perennial contender and his main issue was penalties ON THE OUTSIDE. As an OG he will be closer to center and in theory should commit waaaayyy less penalties. He would also be huge and athletic as an OG as well. And similar to Foles, experience with a winning locker room. Similar to TE, we are going from a position that gave us NOTHING, to at least getting starter quality production.

[dll2000]

17 hours ago, soulman said:

So we didn't need any new TEs or a RG or another experienced QB?  Those aren't significant additions?

Oh hell.  We better let Pace know he screwed up again.

Glass half empty view of offense (Windy):

Foles when last seen was bad and beat out by an unheralded rookie.  He has never played well behind a bad O line or a less than great one.  He tends to hold the ball and take shots.  So even if Foles is an improvement he likely won't be long for this season.  

 RG is a vet minimum who no one else wanted.

Our big FA TE only played less than half snaps last year.  

Our draft pick for Y TE was an average blocker at collegiate level.  

It is same 4 guys that have been mostly average at OL for last several years aside from Whitehair at times and flashes from Daniels.  

Glass half full view of offense is:

Foles knows offense and is really, really good at his best.   MT can't be worse than last year if he is tagged to go in.  

Our O line should be much improved with presumably better coaching, Ifedi replacing Long and Massie back.  Along with Daniels and Whitehair cemented at their positions from day 1 of camp.

Graham, Kmet, Holtz and Horstead or whoever will be better as a group than whatever we were doing last year at TE from day 1.

Montgomery will be better in year 2 in protection.  Cohen will bounce back from very down year and get back to being dynamic playmaker and receiving threat out of backfield. 

Above improvements will lead to better play from Miller and Robinson continues his good play.

Nagy is much more comfortable and confident with these offensive assistants than he has been in last 2 years and gives them real responsibility instead of trying to do everything himself and everyone being an advisor.   I think this point is very underrated as a positive (assuming its true).

I think improvements on defense with addition of Quinn for Floyd being largest one obviously effects the offense.  Giving the offense more opportunities, better field position, more tired defenses and closer games.

Obviously defense is strength of this team glass half full or empty.   Health of defense will be real key to season and weather Quinn plays at same level he did in 2019 in Dallas.   He will have a different role with Bears so it is no given that 2019 Dallas Quinn will be what we are getting.

 

  

[MonserinNC]

26 minutes ago, dll2000 said:

Glass half full view of offense is:

Graham, Kmet, Holtz and Horstead or whoever will be better as a group than whatever we were doing last year at TE from day 1.

Montgomery will be better in year 2 in protection.  Cohen will bounce back from very down year and get back to being dynamic playmaker and receiving threat out of backfield. 

 

 

 

  

Im not going to pretend to be a stat geek but I read Demetrius Harris graded out as one of the top top blocking TE's in the league, to be honest I think he beats out Kmet except on obvious passing plays and just getting him reps....also, lets be real, nobody plays 16 games in the NFL anymore so Kmet will get his moments.

And yeah, they experimented with Cohen last year and I think they learned their lesson for this season. Montgomery not being a rookie should help also

[dll2000]

37 minutes ago, MonserinNC said:

Im not going to pretend to be a stat geek but I read Demetrius Harris graded out as one of the top top blocking TE's in the league, to be honest I think he beats out Kmet except on obvious passing plays and just getting him reps....also, lets be real, nobody plays 16 games in the NFL anymore so Kmet will get his moments.

And yeah, they experimented with Cohen last year and I think they learned their lesson for this season. Montgomery not being a rookie should help also

I keep forgetting about Harris.

[beardown3231]

2 hours ago, dll2000 said:

I keep forgetting about Harris.

We all will be by October, too.

[soulman]

3 hours ago, dll2000 said:

Glass half empty view of offense (Windy):

Foles when last seen was bad and beat out by an unheralded rookie.  He has never played well behind a bad O line or a less than great one.  He tends to hold the ball and take shots.  So even if Foles is an improvement he likely won't be long for this season.  

 RG is a vet minimum who no one else wanted.

Our big FA TE only played less than half snaps last year.  

Our draft pick for Y TE was an average blocker at collegiate level.  

It is same 4 guys that have been mostly average at OL for last several years aside from Whitehair at times and flashes from Daniels.  

Glass half full view of offense is:

Foles knows offense and is really, really good at his best.   MT can't be worse than last year if he is tagged to go in.  

Our O line should be much improved with presumably better coaching, Ifedi replacing Long and Massie back.  Along with Daniels and Whitehair cemented at their positions from day 1 of camp.

Graham, Kmet, Holtz and Horstead or whoever will be better as a group than whatever we were doing last year at TE from day 1.

Montgomery will be better in year 2 in protection.  Cohen will bounce back from very down year and get back to being dynamic playmaker and receiving threat out of backfield. 

Above improvements will lead to better play from Miller and Robinson continues his good play.

Nagy is much more comfortable and confident with these offensive assistants than he has been in last 2 years and gives them real responsibility instead of trying to do everything himself and everyone being an advisor.   I think this point is very underrated as a positive (assuming its true).

I think improvements on defense with addition of Quinn for Floyd being largest one obviously effects the offense.  Giving the offense more opportunities, better field position, more tired defenses and closer games.

Obviously defense is strength of this team glass half full or empty.   Health of defense will be real key to season and weather Quinn plays at same level he did in 2019 in Dallas.   He will have a different role with Bears so it is no given that 2019 Dallas Quinn will be what we are getting.

 

  

I'll take glass #2 and fill it to the brim if ya' please.

As for Graham, he was playing for a HC in an offense that doesn't use a TE as what Graham is best at yet he still produced far more than whatever we could muster out of our entire group of TEs.  You could bring back Des Clark playing on one leg and I'd call that an upgrade too.

As good an OL coach as HH is he may just not have been the right one for our scheme.  I guess we'll find out soon enough but with Massie out and Long a shell of what he once was 'til finally being sat down I can't see how the right side of the OL won't be improved with Ifedi or whoever and Massie back and healthy.  Compared to some of the stiffs we've paid to play OT in the past Massie and Leno aren't that bad.  I'll trust in Castillo until he proves otherwise.

[dll2000]

3 hours ago, soulman said:

I'll take glass #2 and fill it to the brim if ya' please.

As for Graham, he was playing for a HC in an offense that doesn't use a TE as what Graham is best at yet he still produced far more than whatever we could muster out of our entire group of TEs.  You could bring back Des Clark playing on one leg and I'd call that an upgrade too.

As good an OL coach as HH is he may just not have been the right one for our scheme.  I guess we'll find out soon enough but with Massie out and Long a shell of what he once was 'til finally being sat down I can't see how the right side of the OL won't be improved with Ifedi or whoever and Massie back and healthy.  Compared to some of the stiffs we've paid to play OT in the past Massie and Leno aren't that bad.  I'll trust in Castillo until he proves otherwise.

Like how I spelled whether as weather.   I don't know if device did that or I did.  Man I am tired today.  

[Heinz D.]

7 hours ago, dll2000 said:

Foles knows offense and is really, really good at his best.   MT can't be worse than last year if he is tagged to go in.  

Foles is a good quarterback. The majority of arguments folks have to prove otherwise are contrived. 

4 hours ago, beardown3231 said:

We all will be by October, too.

I actually think you're wrong about that. I think we'll have fun watching this guy contribute. 

[MonserinNC]

3 hours ago, Heinz D. said:

 

I actually think you're wrong about that. I think we'll have fun watching this guy contribute. 

Yeah, I cant find the stat but he was rated in the top 5 blocking TE's.......if anything I actually dont think we see as much Kmet as we think. He will play but Im thinking in 3 TE sets and even split out wide since we are pretty thin at WR.

[JAF-N72EX]

6 hours ago, Heinz D. said:

10 hours ago, beardown3231 said:

We all will be by October, too.

I actually think you're wrong about that. I think we'll have fun watching this guy contribute. 

This is just another case of bearddown riding the coat tail of Windys' propaganda.

Don't ask him to back it up with facts or actual game play though. That's difficult for him. 

[JAF-N72EX]

On 6/29/2020 at 5:27 PM, soulman said:

So we didn't need any new TEs or a RG or another experienced QB?  Those aren't significant additions?

Oh hell.  We better let Pace know he screwed up again.

I was trying to be nice and ignore it but yeah....that's what it is and we all know it at this point. 

14 hours ago, dll2000 said:

Foles knows offense and is really, really good at his best.  

I strongly disagree with this. He has been playing in the NFL for ~7-8 years and If he was that good then he would have already found a starting job. Instead he has been bounced around to 5-6 different teams.  There's a reason why he has been a back up QB. 

Secondly,  do we even know the offense at this point? Claiming that Foles knows the offense is a stretch. Especially considering that one of the 5 or 6 offenses that Foles has played second fiddle too was featured on an offense that was co-operated by Nagy himself back in 2016 with Alex at the helm.  If Reid and Nagy saw no value in him, then what does that tell you?

Foles is not a starting caliber QB....he has been lucky. He played in the same offense that has made Wentz look good. 

That said, Foles is a high end back up QB and that's what he was brought in for. Foles>>>>>>>Chase <equal> improvement. 

 

Edited July 1, 2020 by JustAnotherFan