Zalixar Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, BleedTheClock said: I do think Kyler is going to be solid to good. But the MVP of the league this year? The Cardinals are still the worst team in their division. When's the last time the MVP of the NFL was the worst team in their division? The point is, even if Murray is great, he would need to be Mahomes-level elite to take that team anywhere. And quite frankly, that's not happening. I know you're excited about your shiny new toy, but the question wasn't is Kyler good. The question was is Kyler being hyped as the 2020 MVP insane? Which it is. You opened your statement with the next big thing, then went to MVP. Those are two different things, not that I claimed for MVP status. Then went on to why his hype is so high. Why wouldn't he be touted as the next big thing? Or that is hype isn't high? Are you going to say the next big thing, hype and MVP are exactly the same? So if someone agrees with one, it has to mean that you have to agree with him being an MVP statement? Seems that's what you are getting at by your response. I never mentioned MVP. Edited June 30, 2020 by Zalixar 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duluther Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 36 minutes ago, Daniel said: I laughed at this, but I'm also shorter than Kyler, so joke's on me. Hey I’m only 5’5-5’6. Kyler could punt me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaidersAreOne Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 Didn't deserve OROY for starters. 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deadpulse Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 1 hour ago, BleedTheClock said: I do think Kyler is going to be solid to good. But the MVP of the league this year? There was once a time when Carson Wentz was hardly argued by many on this very board to be the MVP in an injury shortened season. I bring that up just to say it is not outlandish that the 'best' isnt always the MVP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deadpulse Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 Just now, RaidersAreOne said: Didn't deserve OROY for starters. Josh Jacobs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zalixar Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Deadpulse said: Josh Jacobs? Raider fans super salty. He got 1/2 the votes. (Not saying his season wasn't impressive though, cause it was) Kyler ran for almost 50% of what JJ did. Not to mention almost 4k throwing yards (and leading a similar personnel offense that was one of the worst statistically in NFL history in 2018 and turning it around). (But Jacobs was hurt! Yeah, Kyler didn't even run for **** the first few games. Looked like he was told not to at all, he had so many options to break but then just went down, checked it down or ran out of bounds. So add a couple hundred to his game and I'll add a couple hundred to Jacobs for "full" yards.) Edited June 30, 2020 by Zalixar 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 51 minutes ago, RaidersAreOne said: Didn't deserve OROY for starters. 50 minutes ago, Deadpulse said: Josh Jacobs? 47 minutes ago, Zalixar said: Raider fans super salty. He got 1/2 the votes. (Not saying his season wasn't impressive though, cause it was) Titans fan here who will defend AJ Brown as the best rookie receiver in the class: Josh Jacobs deserved OROY. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zalixar Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Daniel said: Titans fan here who will defend AJ Brown as the best rookie receiver in the class: Josh Jacobs deserved OROY. He did awesome as well. Both of their votes still don't even add up to his. Deserve is a big word. Edited June 30, 2020 by Zalixar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 5 minutes ago, Zalixar said: He did awesome as well. Both of their votes still don't even add up to his. Deserve is a big word. Yeah, and the forum voted Hook the best fantasy movie of the 90s, so number of votes clearly means nothing. And yeah, I used deserve because I think it's the best word. Josh Jacobs deserved to win OROY. Second place, well that's actually a contest there. Murray or any of the three great rookie receivers should be in the discussion, but I'm biased in who I'd put. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zalixar Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 1 minute ago, Daniel said: Yeah, and the forum voted Hook the best fantasy movie of the 90s, so number of votes clearly means nothing. And yeah, I used deserve because I think it's the best word. Josh Jacobs deserved to win OROY. Second place, well that's actually a contest there. Murray or any of the three great rookie receivers should be in the discussion, but I'm biased in who I'd put. Ah, so you are totally downplaying who does the voting, got it. Probably good it's not left up to fans then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matts4313 Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 1 hour ago, Zalixar said: You opened your statement with the next big thing, then went to MVP. Those are two different things, not that I claimed for MVP status. Then went on to why his hype is so high. Why wouldn't he be touted as the next big thing? Or that is hype isn't high? Are you going to say the next big thing, hype and MVP are exactly the same? So if someone agrees with one, it has to mean that you have to agree with him being an MVP statement? Seems that's what you are getting at by your response. I never mentioned MVP. 6 hours ago, AntonChigurh said: Kyler Murray- MVP, top 5, probably the best qb in the league along with Mahomes for a decade or so Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matts4313 Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 1 hour ago, Zalixar said: Raider fans super salty. He got 1/2 the votes. (Not saying his season wasn't impressive though, cause it was) Kyler ran for almost 50% of what JJ did. Not to mention almost 4k throwing yards (and leading a similar personnel offense that was one of the worst statistically in NFL history in 2018 and turning it around). (But Jacobs was hurt! Yeah, Kyler didn't even run for **** the first few games. Looked like he was told not to at all, he had so many options to break but then just went down, checked it down or ran out of bounds. So add a couple hundred to his game and I'll add a couple hundred to Jacobs for "full" yards.) On a per game basis, Murray wasnt even the best rookie QB. Much less offensive player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 1 hour ago, Zalixar said: Ah, so you are totally downplaying who does the voting, got it. Probably good it's not left up to fans then. I'm not downplaying it. I just didn't talk about it. I said he deserved to win, and you started just throwing out voting stats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zalixar Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 (edited) 47 minutes ago, Daniel said: I'm not downplaying it. I just didn't talk about it. I said he deserved to win, and you started just throwing out voting stats. The insinuation with the fans voting for Hook for 90's fantasy film comparing it to voters who voted for OROY isn't that subtle. Unless you want to backtrack that. "Voting stats" were noted before you said Jacobs deserved OROY. So, no. If it was close, I think it could be a fair discussion. But it wasn't, so, not sure why people (pretty much only some fans) are adamant that Kyler didn't deserve it or someone else deserved it. Per actual discussion, Kyler has still a lot to prove still. Doesn't mean anything if he doesn't deliver in the coming years. But, that's why it's hype. A future outlook that is trending up. Edited June 30, 2020 by Zalixar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zalixar Posted June 30, 2020 Share Posted June 30, 2020 (edited) 4 hours ago, Ray Reed said: You said Lamar Jackson being a starting-level QB in this league was insane, and he won the MVP the next year. I don’t think you’re very qualified to rule on how likely or unlikely the prospects of future MVPs are for, like, the next 5 years probably. It's a tough business. I would rule out Kyler for MVP only because Kyler could throw for 5k yards and run for 1k for 40 TD's and have a 6 game winning season and won't win. They won't give it to someone who doesn't have a good team record and/or playoffs. I do think he will even have the stats, but just stating he has a lot going against him. I find it possible, but unlikely we have a winning season this year (I am thinking the following year is the jump). But who knows, SF went from 2nd worst to 2nd best. Lamar went to a good team. Mahomes went to a good team Watson went to a good team Kyler went to one of the worst teams in existence. Tough climb. Edited June 30, 2020 by Zalixar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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