Most intriguing position or roster battles

[dll2000]

#1

Corner back battles for sure.   Let me think this through as I write:

Bears went with 5 CBs last year:   Fuller, Prince, Skrine, Tolliver, Shelley - We pretty much knew who starters were about 2 weeks into camp.   With only slight question whether Shelley could somehow win nickel job with a stellar preseason game or practice or whatever.   He didn't ever really get that close to doing it.  Though gap itself wasn't huge I don't think as Skrine was never amazing.  They just trusted the veteran a lot more.    

A little different this year.  

You have Fuller as only locked starter of the three positions this year.     

Skrine is a presumed starting Nickel, but he didn't play good enough last year to lock that spot down in my mind.  He had zero INTs and was statistically bad in passer rating and completions allowed by the play by play nerds.  Either Shelley or Vildare could take that job from him with a good or better camp and preseason.  Or should be able to if coaches allow it.   

CB #2 is presumably going to our 2nd round pick.   Jaylon Johnson.   But Johnson will be rehabbing his shoulder and they will probably be careful with him in camp and preseason.  Tolliver, Burns and Roberson are playing not only for a roster spot, but also a possible starting job over an unproven rookie.   Could be a winner takes all type of situation with losers cut or on PS.

Johnson as a second round pick and most likely Vildare will be on roster regardless.  2nd rounders never get cut, and I think it would be pretty rare for a 5th rounder to be cut in their first year.

You would think Skrine would probably will be on roster as well as the 2019 starter.   He is only a 3 million dollar savings if cut and a known quanity.  You would think they wouldn't give up on 2019 draft pick Shelley in his 2nd year, but who knows?   Do we need 3 Nickel CBs on a roster?  Does it mean one of these guys gone?   The Vildare draft pick was a little puzzling and scary for Skrine and Shelley.  

So odds are Fuller, Johnson, and Vildare are roster locks.      Bears only carried 5 CBs last year.  Given situation they could carry 6 this year if they are afraid of someone being taken from PS.

But if we were to assume they keep 5 who are next 2?  

You need to be at least two deep at nickel and if you are keeping Vildare that likely means only one of Skrine or Shelley on 53 with Skrine being initial favorite.

So that leaves Tolliver, Burns and Roberson fighting for one back up and/or possibly starting CB job.    

I think if it came down to it of the candidates they would be most comfortable putting Shelley or Roberson on PS without losing them.  Assuming they like them.  So I think they have to stand out to make the 53 and maybe win an outright starting job.  Otherwise it is PS for them.   

I think if Burns loses to Tolliver and Roberson he will get flat cut.   I would give Tolliver edge since he is known to this staff and started games for Bears as first off bench.  But he didn't post good numbers last year either.   Burns has started more games, though he lost his job to poor play.

I think the hope is Johnson is clear #2 corner and draft pick is a homerun and either Vildare or Shelley separates and steps up at Nickel CB over other or possibly both over Skrine.  If it is Skrine again than so be it.   

  Then one of three darts in Tolliver, Burns and Roberson hits its mark.   I think they are okay with Tolliver as a back up as they seem to think they know his ceiling and floor, but don't really want him as a starter and if they find something better great.  Burns and Roberson are those shots in dark that maybe they can get lucky with and overtake Tolliver.    I think they will have to be clearly better than Tolliver to make it on 53 as he is the returning player.

The battles will be interesting if we could watch all of them.  

I think odds are right now it is:  Fuller, Johnson, Skrine, Vildare, Tolliver  PS: Shelley, Roberson.   If they keep 6, I think Burns makes it too.  

In all honestly it is a very real possibility we could struggle in 2020 at starting CB outside of Fuller - Skrine is just not that good and Johnson will be a rookie coming off an injury (assuming he starts).   We'll see what happens.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[MonserinNC]

I'm thinking Burns over Tolliver, once again I'm not a stat geek but I was reading something that QBs had like a 100 QBR when targeting Tolliver . Burns, sort of like Ifedi is a former 1st rounder who just needed a change but still had a ton of starts for a good franchise.....Tolliver was a good story but I think that's it

[soulman]

Has to be CB for me as well.  Other battles seem to have a front runner who been designated as first on the depth chart.

[beardown3231]

An under the radar battle is the RB spot after Cohen.

[dll2000]

1 hour ago, beardown3231 said:

An under the radar battle is the RB spot after Cohen.

I am thinking that goes to someone not currently on roster.  A late cut or whatever.

 

[JAF-N72EX]

I'm too lazy right now but somebody remind of how often a cornerback that gets taken in the 2nd round doesn't start for their team?

The C19 may be an issue, with vets getting the upperhand, but the only competition JJ has at this point is Roberson and Toliver.  Pace beat out about half of the league to get Roberson and, let's be honest, Toliver didn't play any better last season than a broken down Prince did.   

Edited July 1, 2020 by JustAnotherFan

[soulman]

I'm gonna go with whoever gets to run out on the field to retrieve the kicking tee after a kickoff.    Sprinters speed with obviously be a deciding factor. 

[MonserinNC]

On 7/1/2020 at 12:32 AM, JustAnotherFan said:

I'm too lazy right now but somebody remind of how often a cornerback that gets taken in the 2nd round doesn't start for their team?

The C19 may be an issue, with vets getting the upperhand, but the only competition JJ has at this point is Roberson and Toliver.  Pace beat out about half of the league to get Roberson and, let's be honest, Toliver didn't play any better last season than a broken down Prince did.   

Why is there so much love for Tolliver? Haha....he had a good college career but went undrafted and by the numbers hasn't been good. Roberson was the best CB in the CFL but I don't know if half the league was trying to get him haha

Telling you guys, Burns is a starter who just didn't get his option picked up

[Sugashane]

3 hours ago, MonserinNC said:

Why is there so much love for Tolliver? Haha....he had a good college career but went undrafted and by the numbers hasn't been good. Roberson was the best CB in the CFL but I don't know if half the league was trying to get him haha

Telling you guys, Burns is a starter who just didn't get his option picked up

I hope you're right. If Burns turns out to be good then we could be looking at Fuller, Johnson, and Burns as our nickel trio. That can be a good young corps to build around in the defensive backfield around with EJax already entrenched at FS. 

 But, by the numbers Burns hasn't been good either the last 3 years. That being said there is much more of a body of work and more good play to note for Burns, but I don't think he is a top 50 CB ATM and half the league clearly wasn't trying to get him either. If so he'd have been able to get much more in FA, or at least more than what Pace is paying Pat O'Donnell for this season. lol  Hopefully Burns surprises us and rips the spot away from Skrine (I have nothing against Skrine either, he's just 31 so I'm not looking at him as a long-term option). 

[MonserinNC]

17 hours ago, Sugashane said:

I hope you're right. If Burns turns out to be good then we could be looking at Fuller, Johnson, and Burns as our nickel trio. That can be a good young corps to build around in the defensive backfield around with EJax already entrenched at FS. 

 But, by the numbers Burns hasn't been good either the last 3 years. That being said there is much more of a body of work and more good play to note for Burns, but I don't think he is a top 50 CB ATM and half the league clearly wasn't trying to get him either. If so he'd have been able to get much more in FA, or at least more than what Pace is paying Pat O'Donnell for this season. lol  Hopefully Burns surprises us and rips the spot away from Skrine (I have nothing against Skrine either, he's just 31 so I'm not looking at him as a long-term option). 

Yeah I was reading an article that was sort of more University Miami focused just talking about how this young man lost both his parents basically right when he got drafted and takes care of both his brothers. Don't remember the exact numbers but he really was good last year and only 25. He essentially signed a prove it deal but we are looking at it as kind of a throw away.

I'm telling you guys, he can play....was kind of one of those things where a draft pick just doesn't live up to expectations so they need a change of scenery....I'm also not super high on Johnson first year.....I'm thinking JJ gets slowly worked in but Burns starts next year

[Zopound]

LCB- Fuller.....Roberson

RCB- Johnson.....Toliver

NCB- Skrine....Vildor (Vildor will start by mid season)

Shelley to S

Burns is an official bust, cut

Edited July 7, 2020 by Zopound

[dll2000]

I liked Burns as a late 2nd rounder coming out of college and he was a target for me.  That was year I did GM game and scouted heavily.  

Early public mocks weren’t high on him if I recall.   He rocketed up right before draft for some reason.   Just means NFL scouts always had him high and leaked just before draft.

I thought he was a raw project player with high upside/low floor.  I would have never taken him in first.  That was a bad reach by Pittsburgh.

He definitely has physical talent to play.  He just never seemed to get it.  Still young, still possible.  

[Sugashane]

7 hours ago, dll2000 said:

I liked Burns as a late 2nd rounder coming out of college and he was a target for me.  That was year I did GM game and scouted heavily.  

Early public mocks weren’t high on him if I recall.   He rocketed up right before draft for some reason.   Just means NFL scouts always had him high and leaked just before draft.

I thought he was a raw project player with high upside/low floor.  I would have never taken him in first.  That was a bad reach by Pittsburgh.

He definitely has physical talent to play.  He just never seemed to get it.  Still young, still possible.  

He had a good combine and then VH3 and Alexander both came on shorter than a lot of people thought (plus VH3's terrible 40), so there was plenty of sway just from that weekend alone. I was pretty damn high on him iirc. Thought a good coach could develop him into a longtime starter. He's just been pretty bad lately. If he becomes a "super sub" for us then the signing is a pure win. 

[Heinz D.]

On 6/30/2020 at 3:55 PM, beardown3231 said:

An under the radar battle is the RB spot after Cohen.

Or...(crosses fingers)...instead of Cohen. 

[dll2000]

19 minutes ago, Heinz D. said:

Or...(crosses fingers)...instead of Cohen. 

I don't get the Cohen hate.

Yes he was bad last year.  

He is a role player and honestly aside from last year he has been most feared Bears offensive player 2 of last 3 years.  From a defensive perspective.  He has been one of their only chunk yardage players and a dynamic punt returner.  

They tried him as a slot last year and it didn't work.  I too thought it would.   But then he couldn't play RB last year either.   So maybe he could play slot a bit better, but he just had an all around off year last year and wouldn't have been good at anything.