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What team unexpectedly collapses this year


patriotsheatyan

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10 hours ago, Archimedes said:

I think this myth stems from a stretch in the early to mid 2000s when you had a string of SB losers struggle the next season, and the SB “hangover” was born. 

Those stats you posted about recent SB losers not really struggling the next season surprised me so much that I looked up teams going all the way back to the 90s. The overwhelming majority of teams coming off a SB loss remained pretty good to great the next year, and really that run in the in 2000s really sticks out as a weird anomaly.

Yup. Even the team everyone thought would have hte worst hangover of all time, the 2017 Falcons still went 10-6 and went to the Divisional round. 

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1 hour ago, Shanedorf said:

posters here have had a really tough time answering with the way this question is phrased.
Instead of "unexpected collapses", we're getting "expected regressions." 
Those aren't meeting either criteria, but that's the bulk of the answers in this thread.

Alright ill play ball since my answer wasn't good enough 

Green Bay. That FO has shown theyve got no interest in maintaining a good relationship with AR12 or winning in general. With all due respect to Jordan Love how in the hell is that your first round pick when Adams is your only relevant WR? It wouldn't surprise me if theyre picking top 5 in 2021

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27 minutes ago, wwhickok said:

Alright ill play ball since my answer wasn't good enough 

Green Bay. That FO has shown they've got no interest in maintaining a good relationship with AR12 or winning in general. With all due respect to Jordan Love how in the hell is that your first round pick when Adams is your only relevant WR? It wouldn't surprise me if theyre picking top 5 in 2021

Well, unfortunately, you've come up short again
What you just barfed out is 100 % consistent with the national narrative, in fact there are professional parrots who would envy your response
So it wouldn't meet the "unexpected" part of the criteria as noted in the original post. 

Also, since the Packers beat the Steelers in SB XLV, the Packers have won more regular season games and more playoff games than the Steelers.
So how do you reconcile that reality with your comments above about "the Packers front office not caring about winning" ?

Why were the steelers without a 1st round pick this year ?
Was it because they don't care about winning or because they've got no interest in maintaining a good relationship with Ben ?

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17 minutes ago, Shanedorf said:

Well, unfortunately, you've come up short again
What you just barfed out is 100 % consistent with the national narrative, in fact there are professional parrots who would envy your response
So it wouldn't meet the "unexpected" part of the criteria as noted in the original post. 

Also, since the Packers beat the Steelers in SB XLV, the Packers have won more regular season games and more playoff games than the Steelers.
So how do you reconcile that reality with your comments above about "the Packers front office not caring about winning" ?

Why were the steelers without a 1st round pick this year ?
Was it because they don't care about winning or because they've got no interest in maintaining a good relationship with Ben ?

The reality is when you have 1 relevant WR and a top 5 QB you don't draft another QB. Tbh idc if you like my response or what the media suggests. Im not here to post what you think is acceptable 

Edited by wwhickok
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8 minutes ago, wwhickok said:

The reality is when you have 1 relevant WR and a top 5 QB you don't draft another QB. Tbh idc if you like my response or what the media suggests. Im not here to post what you think is acceptable 

So what you're saying is that you have absolutely no response to the "winning" stuff because it was proven to be completely erroneous ? 
If we can't trust you to make true statements, then why would we listen to you about how to build a winning franchise ?

You are just going to have to take the L here -  and I'll leave it up to others to decide if that's an unexpected collapse...or just more of the same.

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2 hours ago, wwhickok said:

Alright ill play ball since my answer wasn't good enough 

Green Bay. That FO has shown theyve got no interest in maintaining a good relationship with AR12 or winning in general. With all due respect to Jordan Love how in the hell is that your first round pick when Adams is your only relevant WR? It wouldn't surprise me if theyre picking top 5 in 2021

Man, your take is pretty far off base.

That GB front office made him the highest paid QB in the league and did well before they had to.

They fired the coach who won a Super Bowl, coincidentally over the Steelers.  And they did it because Mac wasn't getting results and clearly Aaron was frustrated with him and or his system.

We were all shocked when GB didn't go WR.  But look at what was there in the first round when GB picked.  You know, you pick late when you are in the conference championship game.  Even if you are blown out.  GB had a high rating on a QB who was still there.  So, they made the move to secure the QB.  Rodgers isn't what he once was and hasn't been the same since his shoulder surgery.  And he's getting old, and despite this, he still tried to win with his feet more than his arm or brain.  All of that tells me, as a fan, that GB is trying to secure their future, just like they did at the end of Favre's tenure in GB.  Add to that the possibility that the new coach would like to groom a QB into his system, and it was kind of the perfect storm...that being the Love pick.  (for the record, I didn't like the pick at first, but have quickly warmed to it)

I think we all hoped for a WR.  But there wasn't one there.  We tried to move up in the second for one...and it didn't work.  Apparently we tried to get Sanders in FA.  That didn't work.  So we are stuck with Adams and a bunch of scratch off lottery tickets.  But don't forget this new coach wants to run more, so we got a nice, big running back to compliment our small, quick running back.

Guess I'll end like this.  I would shock me if GB is picking in the top 5.  Chicago didn't get any better.  Minnesota probably took a clear step backwards.  The Lions are the Lions, which is unknown and honestly a little scary.  We only beat them twice despite never running a play with a lead last year.

But in the division, GB didn't step back much, if at all.

But if we are talking regression as in wins and losses.  I'd be pretty surprised, check that, shocked if GB wins 13 games in the regular season.  I'd be pretty thrilled with 10 or 11.

Edited by vegas492
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3 hours ago, Shanedorf said:

So what you're saying is that you have absolutely no response to the "winning" stuff because it was proven to be completely erroneous ? 
If we can't trust you to make true statements, then why would we listen to you about how to build a winning franchise ?

You are just going to have to take the L here -  and I'll leave it up to others to decide if that's an unexpected collapse...or just more of the same.

No thats not what I'm saying. The Steelers gave up a 1st for Minkah because they needed a FS. It made their defense much better. There was no one in the draft at that spot that would've been an instant starter.

Green Bay went into the playoffs last season and looked like they shouldnt have been there. Something they have done quite frequently as late. For a good stretch they'd been playing in a division with 3 sorry excuse for teams. 

Again, if they really wanted GB and AR12 to have a shot at a SB while AR12 is still there, they'd have given him some weapons.

What would make it unexpected imo is that on paper I actually think a lot of ppl still see GB as the favorite to win the division. 

Edited by wwhickok
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2 hours ago, vegas492 said:

Man, your take is pretty far off base.

That GB front office made him the highest paid QB in the league and did well before they had to.

They fired the coach who won a Super Bowl, coincidentally over the Steelers.  And they did it because Mac wasn't getting results and clearly Aaron was frustrated with him and or his system.

We were all shocked when GB didn't go WR.  But look at what was there in the first round when GB picked.  You know, you pick late when you are in the conference championship game.  Even if you are blown out.  GB had a high rating on a QB who was still there.  So, they made the move to secure the QB.  Rodgers isn't what he once was and hasn't been the same since his shoulder surgery.  And he's getting old, and despite this, he still tried to win with his feet more than his arm or brain.  All of that tells me, as a fan, that GB is trying to secure their future, just like they did at the end of Favre's tenure in GB.  Add to that the possibility that the new coach would like to groom a QB into his system, and it was kind of the perfect storm...that being the Love pick.  (for the record, I didn't like the pick at first, but have quickly warmed to it)

I think we all hoped for a WR.  But there wasn't one there.  We tried to move up in the second for one...and it didn't work.  Apparently we tried to get Sanders in FA.  That didn't work.  So we are stuck with Adams and a bunch of scratch off lottery tickets.  But don't forget this new coach wants to run more, so we got a nice, big running back to compliment our small, quick running back.

Guess I'll end like this.  I would shock me if GB is picking in the top 5.  Chicago didn't get any better.  Minnesota probably took a clear step backwards.  The Lions are the Lions, which is unknown and honestly a little scary.  We only beat them twice despite never running a play with a lead last year.

But in the division, GB didn't step back much, if at all.

But if we are talking regression as in wins and losses.  I'd be pretty surprised, check that, shocked if GB wins 13 games in the regular season.  I'd be pretty thrilled with 10 or 11.

We can agree completely disagree. There were definitely WR options, GB just didn't choose one.

Edited by wwhickok
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19 hours ago, Matts4313 said:

I fixed your post. You did provide a perfect example of bad analysis. In case you forgot, Rodgers had to go against the 9ers defense. The same defense most people considered the best in the NFL. Not that the Packers D was shabby, but it wasnt on the same level. 

Thanks for adding additional bad analysis to prove my point.

QBs who get paid 30+ a year sometimes have to beat tough teams.

There is not a more loser type argument than poor baby had to face a good team.

 

The 49ers were also 8th in points, 2nd in yards, and 6th in turnovers.

  • The Patriots were 1st / 1st  / 2nd (this is who MOST people called the best defense)
  • The Steelers were 6th / 5th / 1st
  • The Ravens were 4th / 3rd / 7th

They were one of the four best Ds most likely but clearly not #1.

The Packers gave up 3 more points than the 49ers in 16 games. (lots more yards)

 

Edited by SkippyX
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21 minutes ago, SkippyX said:

Thanks for adding additional bad analysis to prove my point.

QBs who get paid 30+ a year sometimes have to beat tough teams.

There is not a more loser type argument than poor baby had to face a good team.

Then why is Wentz 7-25 against winning teams 😉

 

Perhaps because there is ~$80m in talent on the other side of the field trying to stop you. Its reasonable that QBs will struggle against incredible defenses. 

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15 hours ago, wwhickok said:

We can agree completely disagree. There were definitely WR options, GB just didn't choose one.

Give me the WR options that were available to GB when they traded up.

I'm no draft expert, but this simple fan didn't see any of them as a first round wide receiver.  You see something different?  The last of the bunch that I saw as a first round talent was Aiyuk.  And I had Love as a better prospect.

Regarding Love...I saw a QB with first round tools.  Even if the grades for a WR and a QB are the same, I'm going QB in the first round over an equally rated WR.  QB is just a more important position, even if your QB is a future Hall of Famer and turning 37 this year.

And...I've got no issues with you shipping your first rounder for Minkah.  That was smart.  You are right in the fact that he was better than anyone you were getting with your pick.  

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37 minutes ago, vegas492 said:

Give me the WR options that were available to GB when they traded up.

I'm no draft expert, but this simple fan didn't see any of them as a first round wide receiver.  You see something different?  The last of the bunch that I saw as a first round talent was Aiyuk.  And I had Love as a better prospect.

Regarding Love...I saw a QB with first round tools.  Even if the grades for a WR and a QB are the same, I'm going QB in the first round over an equally rated WR.  QB is just a more important position, even if your QB is a future Hall of Famer and turning 37 this year.

And...I've got no issues with you shipping your first rounder for Minkah.  That was smart.  You are right in the fact that he was better than anyone you were getting with your pick.  

What I'm saying is I think GB trading up for a QB was a bad decision In my opinion. There were WR options if they just sat still.  I dont feel Love helps them this season and a WR could have. Imo.

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On 8/13/2020 at 1:16 PM, wwhickok said:

Alright ill play ball since my answer wasn't good enough 

Green Bay. That FO has shown theyve got no interest in maintaining a good relationship with AR12 or winning in general. With all due respect to Jordan Love how in the hell is that your first round pick when Adams is your only relevant WR? It wouldn't surprise me if theyre picking top 5 in 2021

Sounds like you're buying into GB being a legitimate 13-3 team last year....

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