WaPo article expected Thursday detailing major issues inside Redskins Park

[RSkinGM]

1 minute ago, Thaiphoon said:

These aren't kids. They're grown men. If the name affects how they play, then I want them off the team.

I'm sure they wouldn't even be aware of it . but it's like an abusive parent - It's always there . Gets in your head, your SUBconscience .

[Troublez]

@Thaiphoon - Thanks for the response! While I see your standpoint, I just don't care that Ron is assisting in other facets of the organization..... up until something is being forgone. Maybe his efforts in the arena are necessary to change the culture? I for one, am kind of embracing the name change and the other elements of our off-season.

It is demonstrating change - from top down and providing the players an opportunity to hit the reset button. All franchise's are ran differently, the fact of the matter is Dan, or his puppet, have never involved the head coach (outside of maybe Gibbs) in these types of changes before. So maybe its for the best.....

 

[turtle28]

5 hours ago, e16bball said:

It was a joke. I don’t actually think Ron is setting the concession menu or composing pieces of music. 

However, it was a joke with a point, which is that I’m tired of them asking him to do all this PR and business side nonsense and they need to just let the man get the football team ready to play already. 

They use all their coaches for that bc Dan sucks at it. It’s not going to change for as long as Dan owns the team. Marty did it, Spurier, Gibbs, Shanahan & Gruden were all the face of the team when they were the HCs. Rarely did even Cerrato Or Allen talk to the media.

[turtle28]

3 hours ago, Troublez said:

@Thaiphoon - Thanks for the response! While I see your standpoint, I just don't care that Ron is assisting in other facets of the organization..... up until something is being forgone. Maybe his efforts in the arena are necessary to change the culture? I for one, am kind of embracing the name change and the other elements of our off-season.

It is demonstrating change - from top down and providing the players an opportunity to hit the reset button. All franchise's are ran differently, the fact of the matter is Dan, or his puppet, have never involved the head coach (outside of maybe Gibbs) in these types of changes before. So maybe its for the best.....

 

The thing is people want a true GM who handles that stuff and the coach just coaches, I want it too, but I don’t think Snyder will ever do it. Snyder doesn’t want someone like that who has total control of everything, he divides it up amongst several people and when they can’t agree, Dan makes the decision and that’s what they do. Like this past decade that happened twice w/ QBs, the McNabb trade and trading up for RG3.

Dan wanted them done and Shanahan went along with them even though he didn’t love either decision, but he still went along with it bc he was getting $5 million a year to be HC, have final say over the draft, free agency, personnel and to have final say of the roster.

Edited July 14, 2020 by turtle28

[Skins212689]

4 hours ago, Troublez said:

I am not a coach (nor have I ever been). So I am just curious, given the current constraints - what exactly more should he (or could he) be doing? It just seems that we are being a bit critical. So far - I have read a lot of "Shouldn't be doing this" and not "Could be doing this."

Do guys have the playbook, where are they in learning the playbook, are guy's in shape, how is he sure of those thing's, what are some ways they are adjusting to this type of off-season? Those are the things I would want my HC concerned about. How are guys adjusting to his staff? This is his 1st season with the player's and this type of off-season. There are many other things Rivera could be doing as a Coach oppose to being too caught up in these type of decisions. 

Dan should be the 1 handling the name change along with his business partners. Rivera and the Player's could get the opportunity to Vote once Dan came up with a name and from there Rivera along with the player's could share the news with fans. Fans Vote, Dan than makes his decision. Business wise it would be Smart to Agree with the Fans and Players especially if it's a acceptable name like the Washington Red Wolves. From there begin the process of the Name Change plus also getting RFK or location in DC for the new stadium while things are on the Up for Your Team. 

[Skins212689]

1 hour ago, turtle28 said:

The thing is people want a true GM who handles that stuff and the coach just coaches, I want it too, but I don’t think Snyder will ever do it. Snyder doesn’t want someone like that who has total control of everything, he divides it up amongst several people and when they can’t agree, Dan makes the decision and that’s what they do. Like this past decade that happens twice w/ QBs, the McNabb trade and trading up for RG3. Dan wanted them done and Shanahan went along with them even though he didn’t love either decision, but he still went along with it bc he was getting $5 million a year to be HC, have final say over the draft, free agency, personnel and to have final say of the roster.

That just says to me if Rivera was to disagree with the Name, Dan still would get final say so. So why is Rivera involved as much? Feel free to read my reply to @Troublez as well to get a better understanding of where I coming from. I think we are kinda making the same point. 

[turtle28]

1 hour ago, Skins212689 said:

That just says to me if Rivera was to disagree with the Name, Dan still would get final say so. So why is Rivera involved as much? Feel free to read my reply to @Troublez as well to get a better understanding of where I coming from. I think we are kinda making the same point. 

Owners own the team, in the end it's their business, they always have final say. If someone who works for them doesn't do what they want, they can fire them. Like Jack Kent Cooke almost fired Joe Jackson Gibbs after his 0-5 start in his first year but Bobby Bethard convinced him not too. Casserly said that JKC told him and Gibbs daily what to do and they usually ignored him.

Do example, Shanahan didn't have the stones to ignore Snyder until 2013 when he benched RG3 for Kirk and that was after he already got $20 million from Snyder, not a real true sign of courage on the red lobster's. He lied so much that when he was actually telling the truth no one believed him like in one of his final press conferences when he said to the media, ”Hey guys, I'm telling you the truth and I usually don't do that!”

Edited July 14, 2020 by turtle28

[MikeT14]

Wellwerewaiting.gif

[Skins212689]

2 hours ago, turtle28 said:

Owners own the team, in the end it's their business, they always have final say. If someone who works for them doesn't do what they want, they can fire them. Like Jack Kent Cooke almost fired Joe Jackson Gibbs after his 0-5 start in his first year but Bobby Bethard convinced him not too. Casserly said that JKC told him and Gibbs daily what to do and they usually ignored him.

Do example, Shanahan didn't have the stones to ignore Snyder until 2013 when he benched RG3 for Kirk and that was after he already got $20 million from Snyder, not a real true sign of courage on the red lobster's. He lied so much that when he was actually telling the truth no one believed him like in one of his final press conferences when he said to the media, ”Hey guys, I'm telling you the truth and I usually don't do that!”

Ok understandable, I just couldn't work for Snyder or anyone else under those circumstances personally, but I can see how other are capable of dealing with that type of behavior. 

I'd hope Snyder isn't that guy anymore though. As explained Snyder and his Business Partners should be handling these types of things more than a HC. We just have to see what type of guy Rivera is working with Dan. Hopefully these type of distractions don't take away from the list of Head Coaching duties Rivera has as well. 

[Danger]

2 hours ago, MikeT14 said:

Wellwerewaiting.gif

The announcement is that you aren't keeping the Redskins name. Yes, that's it.

[turtle28]

44 minutes ago, Danger said:

The announcement is that you aren't keeping the Redskins name. Yes, that's it.

The Washington Washingtonian’s after the magazine, write it down!

[Troublez]

15 hours ago, Skins212689 said:

Do guys have the playbook, where are they in learning the playbook, are guy's in shape, how is he sure of those thing's, what are some ways they are adjusting to this type of off-season? Those are the things I would want my HC concerned about. How are guys adjusting to his staff? This is his 1st season with the player's and this type of off-season. There are many other things Rivera could be doing as a Coach oppose to being too caught up in these type of decisions. 

Dan should be the 1 handling the name change along with his business partners. Rivera and the Player's could get the opportunity to Vote once Dan came up with a name and from there Rivera along with the player's could share the news with fans. Fans Vote, Dan than makes his decision. Business wise it would be Smart to Agree with the Fans and Players especially if it's a acceptable name like the Washington Red Wolves. From there begin the process of the Name Change plus also getting RFK or location in DC for the new stadium while things are on the Up for Your Team. 

Yet again - we have no idea if any of this is falling through the cracks. Who is to say that Ron is not concerned with the football elements you mentioned above? I am trusting the judgement of a 2 time coach of the year. The management of football operations SHOULD DEFINITELY have a higher priority over anything non football related. But that doesn't mean if Ron is assisting in other regards that he is neglecting these duties. I have yet to see evidence of that - you guys are saying the same thing over and over...

We may have differing opinions here - but if Ron is the CEO AND Coach, then his input is not out of line until he is neglecting other responsibilities. And by the way..... Vince Lombardi used to dabble in "non football" related issues as well. Specifically, he was responsible for designing the Redskins logo during the 1969/70 season. And he is regarded as one of the best coaches ever!

https://www.yahoo.com/news/washington-redskins-history-helmet-135328456.html

TL:dr - A Coach can do more than focus on football operations and still be a good coach.

[naptownskinsfan]

13 minutes ago, Troublez said:

Yet again - we have no idea if any of this is falling through the cracks. Who is to say that Ron is not concerned with the football elements you mentioned above? I am trusting the judgement of a 2 time coach of the year. The management of football operations SHOULD DEFINITELY have a higher priority over anything non football related. But that doesn't mean if Ron is assisting in other regards that he is neglecting these duties. I have yet to see evidence of that - you guys are saying the same thing over and over...

We may have differing opinions here - but if Ron is the CEO AND Coach, then his input is not out of line until he is neglecting other responsibilities. And by the way..... Vince Lombardi used to dabble in "non football" related issues as well. Specifically, he was responsible for designing the Redskins logo during the 1969/70 season. And he is regarded as one of the best coaches ever!

https://www.yahoo.com/news/washington-redskins-history-helmet-135328456.html

TL:dr - A Coach can do more than focus on football operations and still be a good coach.

The same 2-time coach of the year that's sub .500 over the past four years, and barely tops Bruce Allen's winning season number in the same amount of time?  

Sorry, I have a lot of reasons to dislike Rivera before it became apparent that he has a say in the business side, as well as running the entirety of the football operations. 

You are also neglecting to mention that no one but Belichick has succeeded as the CEO and Coach, and he has successfully mastered how to delegate and is not involved in the business side of the Patriots.  Every other coach-centered person that we think is coach centered has a strong person they are working in lockstep with in the front office.  The longer Rivera takes in naming Kyle Smith the GM (or whatever title that indicates he runs the front office) the further away we get from a collaborative effort and to a coach-centered one that usually fails.  

[Thaiphoon]

7 minutes ago, naptownskinsfan said:

The same 2-time coach of the year that's sub .500 over the past four years, and barely tops Bruce Allen's winning season number in the same amount of time?  

Sorry, I have a lot of reasons to dislike Rivera before it became apparent that he has a say in the business side, as well as running the entirety of the football operations. 

You are also neglecting to mention that no one but Belichick has succeeded as the CEO and Coach, and he has successfully mastered how to delegate and is not involved in the business side of the Patriots.  Every other coach-centered person that we think is coach centered has a strong person they are working in lockstep with in the front office.  The longer Rivera takes in naming Kyle Smith the GM (or whatever title that indicates he runs the front office) the further away we get from a collaborative effort and to a coach-centered one that usually fails.  

To add to that, did I miss something? Did Ron get named CEO?

Again - this has to do with how things are done organizationally. When I'm turning things around, I have my team leads focusing on their areas. They funnel things to the next level who then reports to me. Where is Ron in the organization? Seems to me he was hired to be at the "team lead" level (coaching) and not at the defacto GM level. I cannot tell you how many times the orgs that I inherited had one of their team leads acting as the Program Manager and doing both jobs badly. 

We don't need to know what specific balls are being dropped to know that organizationally, this is a huge risk. Because risk is measured in the future. Issues are risks that have come to pass. Is it an issue now? Maybe. But it's definitely a huge risk. 

[MKnight82]

4 minutes ago, naptownskinsfan said:

You are also neglecting to mention that no one but Belichick has succeeded as the CEO and Coach

So as a counterpoint, just to throw out a more optimistic look on this, I would argue that coach's biggest foil in team building is that they can't take a long term team building approach vs. a win now philosophy.  The positive is that Rivera is being given this power immediately, instead of midway through his tenure.  So I think he will take a more long term team building approach, and I think we've seen that this year as we didn't go nuts in free agency.