Jump to content
Outpost31

Pettine Sucks Fire Pettine

Recommended Posts

I will present my case in several ways, each separated by a bold, centered header that will look like this:

Ways Dom Mike Peppers.  Capers.  Pettine.  Ways Pettine sucks.

Michael Dom Pettine is the defensive coordinator of the Green Bay Packers. 

He is in his second year. 

In his first year, his defense allowed 25 points per game.  That was enough to rank 22nd overall.  This is still troubling.  Typically, when looking around the NFL, a defensive coordinator's best year is his first year. 

In his second year, Capers... Sorry, Pettine.  In his second year, Dom Pettine... Damn it, ****!  Sorry.  I won't do that again.  In his second year, Mike Pettine's defense allowed 20.7 points per game.  That was enough for his defense to rank 12th overall in scoring defense.  Pretty good, pretty good you might say. 

WELL YOU WOULD BE WRONG!

Dom Pettine's defense was the only top 12 defense to allow MORE points per game than his opponents averaged.

That's right.  The Packers allowed 20.7 points per game.  Their opponents on the year averaged 20.6 points per game. 

Don't believe me?  Let's take a look:

Top 12 scoring defenses in points allowed versus opponent average points per game:

12. Packers (.1 more point allowed than their opponents averaged)
11. Titans (2 full points LESS than their opponents averaged)
10. Chiefs (21.95 average score of opponents per game, they gave up 1.75 points less per game)
9. Cowboys (1.35 less than opponent's average)

Obviously as we go down the line, this gets worse for Pettine.  I won't embarrass him further on this point, except yes I will. 

The Chargers, who were 13th in scoring defense by allowing 21.6 points per game allowed .2 points less per game than their opponents averaged.

The Packers defense UNDERACHIEVED BASED ON THEIR OPPONENTS.

Dom Mike Capers Pettine sucks. 

The Pieces Pettine Had

In one single offseason, the Packers added the following:

*12th overall EDGE defender Rashan Gary.  Maybe the reason Rashan Gary sucks is because Pettine sucks. 
*21st overall safety (and the first safety drafted) Darnell Savage, who played VERY well until an injury seemed to slow him down.
*Z. Smith, who everyone knows was an elite EDGE defender last season.
*P. Smith, who everyone knows was an elite EDGE2 last season.
*Adrian Amos, who everyone should know is extremely underrated.
*Chandon Sullivan, who played exceptionally well in his role.

That is FIVE significant starters added to a defense.  Three major free agent signings, two first round picks. 

In addition to those five players, he had:

Elite DL Kenny Clark.
Promising and BAMF Jaire Alexander.
Kevin King, who might have started slowly each game, but allowed a passer rating of under 17 in the fourth quarter last season.
Blake Martinez, who might not be GOOD, but certainly is not BAD compared to the rest of the NFL. 

Where is the weakness?  Second and third DL?  Most teams don't even have one DL as good as Clark much less good second and third DL. 

Would ANYBODY here say any of the players I just mentioned is anything lower than an average NFL player?

So if you're a defensive coordinator and you've got:

3 elite (Clark, Smith, Smith)
3 good (Amos, Alexander, King)
4 okay (Sullivan, Savage, Martinez, Williams)

How could any DC worth paying allow more points than their opponent averaged on the year?

ESPECIALLY considering you allowed 24 points to a backup QB in KC? 

Let's just take a look at the NFL season Dom Michael Pettine had. 

First, I just want to point out one little reminder. 

PETTINE'S DEFENSE MISSED ONLY 4 GAMES FROM EXPECTED STARTERS ON THE ENTIRE YEAR!

THAT WAS THE LEAST AMOUNT OF MISSED GAMES FROM ANY NFL TEAM!

SO DON'T TELL ME PETTINE DIDN'T HAVE THE TALENT WHEN SOME TEAMS HAD TO REPLACE NOBODY PLAYERS WITH LESS THAN NOBODY PLAYERS FOR A GAME OR TWO!

Season Rewind

Bears game.  Week one.  We were all excited.  We finally had a defense.  The only problem is that we allowed just 7.5 less points than the Bears would average on the season.  The Bears offense turned to crap and we didn't know it. 

Vikings game.  Week two.  Missed 47 yard field goal, but I won't harp on that because this was a really good game by our defense I seem to recall.  For whatever reason, our defense can make Cousins and Trubisky suck.  Too bad they can't make literally any other quarterbacks suck. 

Broncos game.  Week three.  Another good game against the QB named Joseph Flacco who Flaccos Fear into the hearts of defenses.  Jaire with an incredible forced fumble, Savage with an incredible diving interception.  Pettine gets no credit for those two plays because HE SUCKS!

Eagles game.  Week 6.  This is the game that I know and love from Dom Capers.  No, Pettine.  And Know and HATE.  The Eagles had 4 days to prepare for this game.  It was in Lambeau Field.  We got our butts kicked here. 

Cowboys game.  Week five.  Ah, yes.  The game where DOM CAPERS forgot he was supposed to be pretending to be Mike Pettine and let one receiver get 226 yards receiving and he never bothered to help the corner who was getting manhandled all game.  Classic.  This was also the game where they were destroying us early, marching down the field, Dak hit Cooper, Cooper coulnd't catch it, ball bounced into Jaire's hands for an easy interception.  Lookit, I know teams get breaks.  I know that.  But we got a LOT of breaks this past year on interceptions and turnovers.  This game it was especially obvious.  Two missed field goals, 2 of Dak's three interceptions were just stupid luck. 

Raiders game.  7 points literally were saved because Carr lost the ball out of the end zone. 

Chiefs game.  Matt Moore lit us up.  Imagine if we had played Mahomes. 

Chargers game.  Thank God our offense sucked and they missed a field goal.  Otherwise this one would have been another 30 plus point game against Pettine's record.

Niners game.  Not even looking. 

Then we faced a murderer's row of Jones.  Haskins.  Trubisky.  Cousins.  Blough. 

Other Statistical Disappointments

18th in yards per game.
22nd in yards per play.
26th in rushing yards per game.
27th in rushing yards per attempt.
19th in yards per pass attempt.
27th in yards per completion.

Player talent versus other top 12 scoring defenses

Titans - I would give them the edge, except for EDGE.  They really had no elite pass rusher, but Casey and Simmons were better than our DL, and their secondary is legit good. 

Chiefs - They flat out are not more talented than us.  They just aren't.  Jones and Clark eh, I might give it to Jones, but not in a landslide, they don't have some premier ILB talent, and they had one good EDGE compared to our good EDGE and Elite edge.  They do not in any way have more talent than our defense does. 

Cowboys - Nope.  I'd take our players over theirs.  Not going to convince me the key to an elite defense is 37 first and second round picks at ILB. 

Denver - Nope.  Especially not when Wolfe, Chubb, Callahan all ended up on IR. 

Minnesota - Yep, they are probably more talented overall than our team is as far as defensive players.

Steelers - Ehhhh, I wanted to make an argument, but there's no argument there.  They're more talented.

Bears - Yeah they've probably got more talent.  It's not a landslide though. 

Ravens - Nope, they do not have crazy more talent than our defense does.  Thomas, Humphrey and Peters are their only clear upgrades over similar positions, but their EDGE rushers versus ours is yikes.  Ours are significantly better. 

Bills - Nope.  White and an ILB are not enough to out talent our defense.  Maybe you give them the edge, but not after a bit of thought. 

Patriots - Hell no.  The Patriots have a bunch of castaway DL, no legitimate pass rusher to speak of, a bunch of old slow ILBs playing ILB and EDGE.  Gilmore was the DPOY probably, but that's one corner.  Devin McCourty has always been underrated, but he was 32 years old. 

And finally...

 

PUTTING WILL ****ING REDMOND INTO THE GAME WHEN GARROPPOLO HAD THROWN 6 ****ING PASSES AT THAT POINT IN THE GAME AND THERE WERE 7 MINUTES LEFT IN THE 3RD QUARTER AND WE WERE ONLY DOWN BY 20. 

This one I honestly can't tell what was going on though.  We might have just been gassed out there.  It looks like Clark, Lancaster, Lowry on the DL, Fackrell and Preston on the edges, Goodson and Martinez at ILB, and Tramon Williams was in there, too.  I just don't understand the logic to it.  LET THEM BEAT YOU ON A PASS ONCE.  They had thrown 6 ****ing passes and you finally get them to 2nd and 10. 

And who the damn even hell is #35?  I don't even remember who that was and they were in the game on the TD run to end the 2nd quarter. 

It was like the Niners gameplan was:

Let's take advantage of them pushing through aggressively, then let's go right up the middle, then let's do the edge thing again where we just have to wait for Z and P to go to far upfield, then right up the middle, then let's... Let's run a reverse.  Let's run a reverse again.  And it ****ING WORKED. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We keep him until he gives up 30 points once and then we fire him and promote what’s his face DB coach from Minnesota.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Outpost31 said:

We keep him until he gives up 30 points once and then we fire him and promote what’s his face DB coach from Minnesota.

Did I just hear a knee jerk ?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
24 minutes ago, deathstar said:

I appreciate the effort.

This was effortless that’s how much Pettine sucks.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 minutes ago, OneTwoSixFive said:

Did I just hear a knee jerk ?

No I’ve considered it for a long time.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

Wow talk about knee jerk. You can't blame Pettine for being given the worst DL talent in the league. Outside of Clark  we have a bunch of guys. Gute should not of paid Lowry,  Adams is another typical 3rd round bust,  Lancaster is not good. Compare what we have on the DL to other teams like the Bears and 49ers. The Packers DL has been piss poor for 5 years.  Clark is a great building block but he can't do it alone. Pettine doesnt have the horses to stop the run,  that's why the defense is bad. The Packers are built to get after the QB, but if you can't stop the run you can't rush the passer. Ask Kyle Shanahan.

Edited by St Vince
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, St Vince said:

Wow talk about knee jerk. You can't blame Pettine for being given the worst DL talent in the league. Outside of Clark  we have a bunch of guys. Gute should not of paid Lowry,  Adams is another typical 3rd round bust,  Lancaster is not good. Compare what we have on the DL to other teams like the Bears and 49ers. The Packers DL has been piss poor for 5 years.  Clark is a great building block but he can't do it alone. The Pettine doesnt have the hoses to stop the run,  that's why the defense is bad. The Packers are built to get after the QB, but if you can't stop the run you can't rush the passer. Ask Kyle Shanahan.

Kenny Clark has more talent alone than the entire Patriots DL.  Don’t tell me a good defensive coordinator can’t stop a team from 300 rushing yards when he has Z. Smith, P. Smith and Clark.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Your expectations for the impact on how players play is astounding. There was a clear weakness in the interior front 7 teams could exploit. Past that, they played well. Statistics aren't some end all gauge, just like the 15-1 d wasn't "one of the worst all time" in actual play. It's something hopefully fixable, but we will have to see what adjustments can be made because there weren't really any good opportunities to invest in that area. If Lowery plays like 2018 instead of 2019 and Gary earns his way into rotational packages that will help.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
24 minutes ago, Outpost31 said:

Kenny Clark has more talent alone than the entire Patriots DL.  Don’t tell me a good defensive coordinator can’t stop a team from 300 rushing yards when he has Z. Smith, P. Smith and Clark.

That's the problem,  those guys are all we have. They log too many snaps and get worn down. Gute has to fix the middle of the defense. Clark's a good start but they need more bodies that can produce. Clark can't do it all,  the guy can't continue to play every snap. We didn't pay the Smiths to be tackling machines, they were brought in to sack the QB.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

Honestly besides Clark we really don't give a great push up front, in the NFC Championship we couldn't get off blocks in the run game to save our lives, we were manhandled. The Smiths weren't great at setting the edge in that game either. I think the problem with Pettine/Defensive coaching staff is  not getting these guys ready with gap discipline. So many times you saw them get fooled or just took the wrong gap and the Niners runners got loose very easily. 

I also find this little nugget interesting, Pete Dougherty was saying he talked to an assistant coach that was on Pettines staff(or with guys that were on Pettines staff), and they said they didn't practice run fits. You can take that quote with a grain of salt I guess, but I think it's true you get what you practice, and maybe he's just not practicing for it enough and spending the majority in the passing game. 15:30

 

Edited by Gopackgonerd

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You have to choose between Lancaster, Gary and Sullivan.

If you choose Gary you're playing Z at the 5, Rover position. Chandon is a tough fit for Dime backer but it's a role he filled, you'd be playing more 2-4 looks. Lancaster kept proving he shouldn't be a starter in the 3-3.

Pettine stuck with Lancaster and things didn't get better. I understand OP's frustration with sticking with something that clearly wasn't working in the games we lost.

Though as a team they were quite successful with how things went; as a rule you'd want to think that Rodgers would be more efficient in his limited touches than the other team with limited touches when everyones trying to burn clock. Unfortunately Rodgers isn't Godgers anymore and teams that stuck with the run stayed being successful and scoring TDs. When our offense was having a bad time Pett needed to pull a Yoast and refuse to give them another yard and let the CB's earn their paycheck, committing the safety to the box.

 

IDK if any of this is cohesive or makes sense. enjoy.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Too long didn’t read.

 

i was really down on Pettines performance anyways tho, so there’s a decent chance I’d at least somewhat agree with you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...