Predict Brady’s 2020 stats

[RUGmen]

As a Giants fan, I don’t think I have ever been more excited for another team than my own than seeing how the Brady led Bucs (and Bradyless Pats as well) fare this season. Even as a Giants fan, I have always been a huge Brady fan and I am hoping him  and the Bucs do well. I think this is the best  weapons he’s had for awhile now which will lead him to have a great season even at age 42. Many say this is Peyton final season 2.0 but I think it will be more of Vikings Favre.

im going to go with:

4700 yds

38 tds

12 ints

Edited September 8, 2020 by RUGmen

[SkippyX]

My guess would have been about what you guessed.

This might be the best group of weapons he's ever had on offense. (2007 is great, but the TEs push this group higher IMO)

• This assumes that Evans, Gronk, and Goodwin play 14+
• This assumes that Gronk is healthy again and comes back to even 85% of his 2017 form (he's only 31 and is fully rested after a year off)

 

Evans, Goodwin, Gronk, and Howard? This is not fair.

Think about the Red Zone. 

• 6'7" Gronk
• 6'6" Howard
• 6'5" Evans
• 6'1" Goodwin

Who is going to cover these guys?

 

In that scheme and with that line he is going to have to buy time on some plays and he will get hit.

I think he avoids the rush enough and makes enough plays to push towards 40 TDs and 5000 yards.

[diamondbull424]

I mean no offense, but even noodle arm Chad Pennington would put up numbers with that receiving core.

It could be argued as the best assembled receiving unit of all time. Two top 5-10 WRs (Godwin/Evans), a young talented WR (Watson) a top 2TE- all time (Gronk), and a top 10 caliber TE (Howard).

Brady not putting up numbers would say far more to me than him putting up numbers unless they’re 2013 Manning levels of insane. Now if he can compete/surpass those passing records than that would say a good deal. Otherwise a normally great passing season will say less than about the kind of team success he can lead them to.

edit: Considering all that I’ll guess and say 4800 yds, 41 TDs, 14 INTs.

Edited September 8, 2020 by diamondbull424

[PatriotsWin!]

10 minutes ago, diamondbull424 said:

I mean no offense, but even noodle arm Chad Pennington would put up numbers with that receiving core.

It could be argued as the best assembled receiving unit of all time. Two top 5-10 WRs (Godwin/Evans), a young talented WR (Watson) a top 2TE- all time (Gronk), and a top 10 caliber TE (Howard).

Brady not putting up numbers would say far more to me than him putting up numbers unless they’re 2013 Manning levels of insane. Now if he can compete/surpass those passing records than that would say a good deal. Otherwise a normally great passing season will say less than about the kind of team success he can lead them to.

You're not only severely overrating the talent around Brady (it's good, but Howard top 10 TE... all time best unit? lol), you're also not taking into account Brady is 43 years old. If Brady puts up anywhere close to 4000 yards and 30 TDs it would and should be considered an amazing season given his age. Can't believe there's still people out there unwilling to give Brady any credit.

Edited September 8, 2020 by PatriotsWin!

[Asciimo]

2013 manning was 37 years old, fyi. a full 6 years younger than current brady.

[SkippyX]

54 minutes ago, Asciimo said:

2013 manning was 37 years old, fyi. a full 6 years younger than current brady.

2019 Lick-a-W had 5000+ yards and 33 TDs on the same team without Gronk and he's not a good NFL QB

Manning also had a fused neck and never took care of his body the way that Brady (or even Brees) does.

 

Brady was 39 1/2 and 40 1/2 when he put up 971 yards and 5 TDs combined in back to back Super Bowls

Manning put up 421 yards and 1 TD combined at just under 38 and just under 40 in  Super Bowls.

I will take Brady over Manning every single time.

Edited September 8, 2020 by SkippyX

[Jakuvious]

1 hour ago, diamondbull424 said:

I mean no offense, but even noodle arm Chad Pennington would put up numbers with that receiving core.

It could be argued as the best assembled receiving unit of all time. Two top 5-10 WRs (Godwin/Evans), a young talented WR (Watson) a top 2TE- all time (Gronk), and a top 10 caliber TE (Howard).

Brady not putting up numbers would say far more to me than him putting up numbers unless they’re 2013 Manning levels of insane. Now if he can compete/surpass those passing records than that would say a good deal. Otherwise a normally great passing season will say less than about the kind of team success he can lead them to.

edit: Considering all that I’ll guess and say 4800 yds, 41 TDs, 14 INTs.

Okay, let's calm down a bit here.

[diamondbull424]

1 hour ago, Jakuvious said:

Okay, let's calm down a bit here.

I think it’s certainly in the argument. I can only recall a few in recent memory and none of them have the overall cache of this unit. I’ve seen better WRs and better TE cores. But someone will have to school me with a solid 5 better receiving cores overall that would remove this one from that conversation.

2 hours ago, PatriotsWin! said:

You're not only severely overrating the talent around Brady (it's good, but Howard top 10 TE... all time best unit? lol), you're also not taking into account Brady is 43 years old. If Brady puts up anywhere close to 4000 yards and 30 TDs it would and should be considered an amazing season given his age. Can't believe there's still people out there unwilling to give Brady any credit.

Howard when healthy is absolutely a TE in the top 10 IMO. The only problem with him has been his durability. Outside of that his YPT numbers and his production totals over the last three seasons certainly puts him on such a level. While other TEs may prove to be more healthy, there aren’t 10 TEs in the league I would deem as more talented than a healthy OJ Howard.

Also I didn’t remove any credit from Brady as this season has not happened. I said him putting up good passing numbers isn’t something unexpected with those weapons. I’d put it above the 07 and 11 Patriots cores. I’d put it above the 98 Vikings, 00 Rams, 06 Colts, 13 Broncos. At least on paper. Even if Brady isn’t as young as those squads, he’s still a good QB. Health as for all older QBs is the true impediment, but until Brady shows he no longer has durability, then I’m not going to assume he doesn’t.

The only QBs I think that could sink such weapons would be the likes of JaMarcus Russell, Kyle Boller, Nathan Peterman, etc.

Edited September 8, 2020 by diamondbull424

[Soko]

7 minutes ago, diamondbull424 said:

I’d put it above the 07 and 11 Patriots cores.

The 11’ Pats TEs are better, but are you sure you’d take Mike Evans and Chris Godwin over Wes Welker and Deion Branch? Even when you consider Welker/Branch were so flush with knowledge, seeing as they were already 30+ years old at that point? I dunno, might be a toss up. 

[diamondbull424]

16 minutes ago, Yin-Yang said:

The 11’ Pats TEs are better, but are you sure you’d take Mike Evans and Chris Godwin over Wes Welker and Deion Branch? Even when you consider Welker/Branch were so flush with knowledge, seeing as they were already 30+ years old at that point? I dunno, might be a toss up. 

At WR I would definitely take the young guns. Not to underrate Welker and his skillset obviously. But I think the gap is pretty significant there at WR. The 11 Patriots also have a good gap with AH and young Gronk over Old Gronk, Howard, and Brate; but I feel the gap is smaller there than at the WR spots.

But even if the 11 Patriots weapons are on a similar level to these Bucs... that’s telling as to the kind of talent of this unit assembled. I’d be surprised if Brady only put up some sort of mediocre numbers like last season in NE with depressed talent... Though I’m also not anticipating an all time great season, now that would be incredibly impressive.

Edited September 8, 2020 by diamondbull424

[Soko]

2 minutes ago, diamondbull424 said:

At WR I would definitely take the young guns. Not to underrate Welker and his skillset obviously. But I think the gap is pretty significant there. The 11 Patriots also have a good gap with AH and young Gronk over Old Gronk, Howard, and Brate; but I feel the gap is smaller there than at the WR spots.

But even if the 11 Patriots weapons are on a similar level to these Bucs... that’s telling as to the kind of talent of this unit assembled. I’d be surprised if Brady only put up some sort of mediocre numbers like last season in NE with depressed talent... only way I see that happening is if Covid forced a league shutdown and his bulk numbers thus suffered for it.

I’m kidding, man. Myself and I’m assuming, most fans, don’t really place that Pats group on any all-time list that extends beyond just the tight end room. Welker was a great slot receiver and Branch was very solid but the receivers were not a special group at all. Just poking some fun (wouldn’t include Howard in a group of top TEs, though. Maybe only on talent but not as players).

I’m with you on the Brady stuff - if everyone stays relatively healthy, there’s no excuse for him not to put up very good numbers. If you told me now that he won’t, I’d guess it’s because Father Time finally stopped hitting snooze and caught up. 

[diamondbull424]

2 minutes ago, Yin-Yang said:

I’d guess it’s because Father Time finally stopped hitting snooze and caught up. 

Exactly.

And yeah I hadn’t caught the joke. I would certainly agree that the TE core was absolutely an all time great unit. But yeah, I started to say I would personally take your 07 unit because of motivated Moss and a younger Welker, but I’ve been actively trying to keep my posts shorter. So I’m constantly deleting things.

[Jakuvious]

5 minutes ago, diamondbull424 said:

I think it’s certainly in the argument. I can only recall a few in recent memory and none of them have the overall cache of this unit. I’ve seen better WRs and better TE cores. But someone will have to school me with a solid 5 better receiving cores overall that would remove this one from that conversation.

So, included in your praise of their corp, was Gronk, who hasn't played in over a year, and arguably hasn't been an elite TE in over two, Justin Watson, who has 16 career catches to his name, and O.J. Howard, who isn't much more than a middling TE. If Howard is a top 10 TE, that says more about how quickly the talent level at TE falls off, than about his quality of play.. There are a lot of things that need to go the ideal way for that crew to enter that conversation. You need Gronk to go back to 2017 quality, you need someone to step up as a third receiver, you may need more out of Howard, especially if you don't get old Gronk. There's just a lot of projection to call them anything all-time level. As is, the only thing you know for sure, is you have a great WR duo, and a solid TE. That's all that's really set in stone, and plenty of teams in recent history can top that.

I'd definitely take the GSOT. Sure, the TEs are barely worth mentioning, but Faulk, Proehl, and Hakim are all huge wins at their spots. The recent Chiefs are worse at #2 WR and #2 TE, but they win so heavily at #1 TE, #3 WR, #4 WR, and, if we go with the 2018 crew, RB. I would take peak Broncos over the Bucs. Again, the difference between Wes Welker at #3 WR is far bigger than the gap between the second TEs. I would rather have 2013 DT, Decker, Welker, and Julius Thomas on the field than current Evans, Godwin, Gronk, and Howard. Even a team like the 2012 Falcons, with Jones, White, Gonzalez, Douglas, Turner, and Rodgers. Couple of the recent Steelers iterations. Either Brown/Juju/James/McDonald/Conner, or going back a bit further to Brown/Sanders/Cotchery/Miller/Bell, or even further to Wallace/Ward/Sanders/Miller/Mendenhall. I feel like I could pick almost any year of Steelers history under Ben, and they'd have at least 3 good WRs, at least 1 solid TE, and a solid receiving back. The recent Rams don't have quite the top talent, but you have to go so far down the depth chart to hit someone who isn't quite good, with Cooks/Kupp/Woods/Higbee/Everett/Gurley. I might even consider something like the 08 Cardinals, who again have nothing at TE but that top 3 at WR was sooooooooo good that year. Or even some of the peak Moss Vikings. When you had Moss as the star, Burleson and Robinson as productive depth, and Wiggins being incredibly productive at TE. This is getting closer to a stretch, but I think that top four still has an argument against the Bucs top 4.

To me, just the lack of a third WR with any experience whatsoever, and the question mark that is Gronk, keeps them from being at that level. IF a receiver behind Evans/Godwin steps up, and IF either Gronk is old Gronk or Howard steps up his production, they could be there. But it's not that yet. Give me any of the receiving corps in recent history with a great third WR over this crew having a better second TE. I'd just rather have to cover O.J. Howard than Mecole Hardman or Wes Welker or Emmanuel Sanders or Cooper Kupp. It would be different if it was like Kittle and Kelce at TE, or something ridiculous like that. But it's really just a solid TE and a hopefully still good one.

[patriotsheatyan]

200 of 300 for 2100 yards, 12 touchdowns, 10 interceptions

[Nabbs4u]

4 hours ago, diamondbull424 said:

It could be argued as the best assembled receiving unit of all time. Two top 5-10 WRs (Godwin/Evans), a young talented WR (Watson) a top 2TE- all time (Gronk), and a top 10 caliber TE (Howard)

No it couldn't,  not even in the slightest.