Mossburg Posted September 16, 2020 Share Posted September 16, 2020 4 minutes ago, roger murdock said: Jokic is better vs the rest of the league. I think this is fairly proven as of right now given his huge success and ADs lack there of as the guy. AD will win the 1v1 matchup though. AD is the perfect guy to guard Jokic and attack him when hes playing defense. He's the only big that can handle him and he has a better team around him. So if I had to pick in a 1:1 its fairly easily AD. If I had to pick to build a team around its fairly easily Jokic. If AD had a guy who can score 50 twice in a series, and 40 in a game 7, his job becomes a lot easier. Jokic is definitely "the guy", but he's not a YOLO RAMBO ONE MAN ARMY GUNS CAN'T HARM ME COME AT ME BRO type of "the guy". It's not really an apples to apples comparison. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddy_z34 Posted September 16, 2020 Share Posted September 16, 2020 2 minutes ago, resilient part 2 said: The Pelicans might disagree with this!! Pelicans also didnt have a Murray, Milsap, Porter Jr around AD like Denver has around Jokic. AD and the Pelicans were doing what Jokic and Denver were doing, 1 and dones in the playoffs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
resilient part 2 Posted September 16, 2020 Author Share Posted September 16, 2020 Just now, Mossburg said: Was AD not considered one of the league's best even when they sucked? Yes, but he also was a big part of that "dumpster fire" as well. In other words neither player really elevated any bad teams .. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mossburg Posted September 16, 2020 Share Posted September 16, 2020 Just now, resilient part 2 said: Yes, but he also was a big part of that "dumpster fire" as well. In other words neither player really elevated any bad teams .. No player elevates bad teams alone. LeBron probably closest there is, and look what happened last year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roger murdock Posted September 16, 2020 Share Posted September 16, 2020 Just now, Mossburg said: If AD had a guy who can score 50 twice in a series, and 40 in a game 7, his job becomes a lot easier. Jokic is definitely "the guy", but he's not a YOLO RAMBO ONE MAN ARMY GUNS CAN'T HARM ME COME AT ME BRO type of "the guy". It's not really an apples to apples comparison. Part of the reason Murray scores so well is the spacing and passing Jokic provides is lightyears better than AD. I really don't think the supporting cast argument is a big win for Jokic. Jokic is just a way better playmaker for his teammates. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
resilient part 2 Posted September 16, 2020 Author Share Posted September 16, 2020 Just now, buddy_z34 said: Pelicans also didnt have a Murray, Milsap, Porter Jr around AD like Denver has around Jokic. AD and the Pelicans were doing what Jokic and Denver were doing, 1 and dones in the playoffs. all true, yet you seem hesitant to pull the trigger.. just say AD.. and you won't be wrong...it is all opinion when it is that close. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mossburg Posted September 16, 2020 Share Posted September 16, 2020 Just now, roger murdock said: Part of the reason Murray scores so well is the spacing and passing Jokic provides is lightyears better than AD. I really don't think the supporting cast argument is a big win for Jokic. Jokic is just a way better playmaker for his teammates. That part is not debatable, but you can't plug a random into Murray's position and expect historic production. Odds are if his production is less than historic they are out in the 1st, regardless of how well Jokic facilitated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddy_z34 Posted September 16, 2020 Share Posted September 16, 2020 Just now, resilient part 2 said: all true, yet you seem hesitant to pull the trigger.. just say AD.. and you won't be wrong...it is all opinion when it is that close. I did say AD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
resilient part 2 Posted September 16, 2020 Author Share Posted September 16, 2020 Just now, Mossburg said: No player elevates bad teams alone. LeBron probably closest there is, and look what happened last year. my obligatory - insert Larry Legend.. but I get your point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
resilient part 2 Posted September 16, 2020 Author Share Posted September 16, 2020 Just now, buddy_z34 said: I did say AD my bad.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddy_z34 Posted September 16, 2020 Share Posted September 16, 2020 19 minutes ago, buddy_z34 said: It depends, who's the coach and what's the roster around them. So I'll make it easy on us and say AD over Jokic. Only because I feel he's more versatile and would be able to fit and adjust his game with whomever the coach is and how he decides to play. Small ball, big ball, slow or fast, defensive minded or offensive minded coach. The margin isnt that much though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roger murdock Posted September 16, 2020 Share Posted September 16, 2020 1 minute ago, Mossburg said: That part is not debatable, but you can't plug a random into Murray's position and expect historic production. Odds are if his production is less than historic they are out in the 1st, regardless of how well Jokic facilitated. The stupidest argument ever. Murray isn't a top-20 player in the NBA. Hes probably somewhere like the 25th-35th best player. You are allowed to have teammates who have good games. Maybe if he had someone worse instead of Murray they get the 5 seed and Jokic feasts on the Rockets who dont have anyone who can do anything vs him. Its just a stupid argument. Its not like he got carried Jokic was amazing that first series. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddy_z34 Posted September 16, 2020 Share Posted September 16, 2020 1 minute ago, resilient part 2 said: my obligatory - insert Larry Legend.. but I get your point. How many HoFers did he play with?? 😜 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
resilient part 2 Posted September 16, 2020 Author Share Posted September 16, 2020 (edited) 3 minutes ago, buddy_z34 said: How many HoFers did he play with?? 😜 OH NO, you didn't.. Larry Bird went to the last place Boston Celtics, who had 27? wins and went on to win 60+ his rookie year. BEFORE McHale, Parrish and DJ.. Did it in college as well.. #therealGOAT Edited September 16, 2020 by resilient part 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mossburg Posted September 16, 2020 Share Posted September 16, 2020 2 minutes ago, roger murdock said: The stupidest argument ever. Murray isn't a top-20 player in the NBA. Hes probably somewhere like the 25th-35th best player. You are allowed to have teammates who have good games. Maybe if he had someone worse instead of Murray they get the 5 seed and Jokic feasts on the Rockets who dont have anyone who can do anything vs him. Its just a stupid argument. Its not like he got carried Jokic was amazing that first series. I don't care where you rank Murray. Fact is he had one of the greatest series we have ever seen in the 1st round, with a plethora of clutch monster plays. Period. That was needed to win a series that was decided on basically the last possession of a game 7. If you think a lot of players could have done that because Jokic was their teammate, please feel free to make that case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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