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Karnage84

A LOOK AT A POST QUINTRICIA LIONS

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For me, I’d keep our offense in tact. We have a good offense, and I want to see Bevell stay on and expand his playbook.

My focus would be on a solid DC and a motivating HC. This team lacks an identity.  

Who those guys are, I’m not sure. But that would be my focus. 

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As fans we might as well throw a dart at a list of names. We don’t get to explore their personal philosophy, background and a host if other issues. We get to see them coaching teams different than the Lions. The organization has always tried to short change process by selecting the name with buzz attached. 

Rookie GM’s, rookie head coaches, head coaches without head coaching experience. At what point do they stop reinventing the wheel and hire people with a proven track record for the position they’re filling.

Over the past 20 years they haven’t had a GM with experience. Over the same period only Mariucci and Caldwell had head coaching experience. I don’t count Jauron because he was a mid season fill in.

Step 1. Hire a GM with a proven track record.

Step 2. Hire a coach with a successful head coaching pedigree.

Build the team. Inside, outside, front to back.

 

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2 minutes ago, diehardlionfan said:

As fans we might as well throw a dart at a list of names. We don’t get to explore their personal philosophy, background and a host if other issues. We get to see them coaching teams different than the Lions. The organization has always tried to short change process by selecting the name with buzz attached. 

Rookie GM’s, rookie head coaches, head coaches without head coaching experience. At what point do they stop reinventing the wheel and hire people with a proven track record for the position they’re filling.

Over the past 20 years they haven’t had a GM with experience. Over the same period only Mariucci and Caldwell had head coaching experience. I don’t count Jauron because he was a mid season fill in.

Step 1. Hire a GM with a proven track record.

Step 2. Hire a coach with a successful head coaching pedigree.

Build the team. Inside, outside, front to back.

 

All of these guys would become available because they failed somewhere else. Some of these guys learn from their mistakes and go on to very successful careers (Bill Bellichick, Pete Carroll) and other guys move from spot to spot with varying levels of success (Adam Gase, Ron Rivera, Mike McCarthy, Jon Gruden, etc.). It's not that often you're going to wind up with an Andy Reid as a retread. 

I'm not against hiring a former HC but it isn't a for sure solution to our problems either.

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Write me down for a retread.  I like my chances a lot better of him working out vs a first time gm/hc. Speaking of retread, can I have Schwartz back?

If you hire a rookie hc, I firmly believe you better surround him with experienced coordinators.  Preferably ones who were former head coaches themselves.

Edited by LionArkie
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7 minutes ago, LionArkie said:

Write me down for a retread.  I like my chances a lot better of him working out vs a first time gm/hc. Speaking of retread, can I have Schwartz back?

If you hire a rookie hc, I firmly believe you better surround him with experienced coordinators.  Preferably ones who were former head coaches themselves.

What do you guys think about longtime college HC's with no prior NFL experience (a la Kingsbury/Rhule)? 

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Just now, Karnage84 said:

What do you guys think about longtime college HC's with no prior NFL experience (a la Kingsbury/Rhule)? 

I still prefer an NFL coach. I've seen too many successful college hc's fail. The exception I'd make is if they were college hc, went to NFL and failed and then went back to college. I think those guys stand a better chance of succeeding in the NFL than one without any NFL hc experience.

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2 hours ago, Karnage84 said:

All of these guys would become available because they failed somewhere else. Some of these guys learn from their mistakes and go on to very successful careers (Bill Bellichick, Pete Carroll) and other guys move from spot to spot with varying levels of success (Adam Gase, Ron Rivera, Mike McCarthy, Jon Gruden, etc.). It's not that often you're going to wind up with an Andy Reid as a retread. 

I'm not against hiring a former HC but it isn't a for sure solution to our problems either.

Failure isn’t a sign of success so failed coaches aren’t really the answer. I’m not suggesting that a failed coach can’t find success but you can assess their ability in so many ways up to and including simulation. There’s plenty of coaches who find success which ebbs away from them over time. The point is you have to learn how to win and a coach and GM with experience winning in those positions offers a higher likelihood of success earlier. 

You asked about long serving college coaches. I’m not sure length of tenure is a worthwhile consideration. It doesn’t help that there is no parameter defining what you mean by long term.  If I were to select a college head coach I would be looking for the following,

1. Flexibility! The ability to consistently win games with varying team competencies. Winning one year with strong offence then winning with defence. 

2. Must have a resume that commands respect.

3. The ability to react appropriately to circumstances presented in a simulation. The simulation would cover talent assessment (draft and free agency), in game situations, performance analysis, inter personal skills and the labour agreement.

4. A history of positive coaching individuals. By that, assessing recruits throughout college and measuring improvement. An exaggerated example would be a borderline player commencing college who gets drafted high. In short measuring their ability to mentor, teach and lead.

5. A proven ability to improve the college program. I’m much more interested in a college coach who took an inadequate program and turned it around than I am with a coach that hired on with a top school and just continues the schools previous success. An example would be Lincoln Riley. He took over a top program and hasn’t shown near enough to get consideration from me. He hasn’t shown that he can improve the Sooners (they still blow at least one game yearly that should be a gimme), he can only win with offence. So he has more to prove. I would be much more interested in him working as an OC under an experienced head coach.

6. The individual must have demonstrated an ability to overcome adversity and succeed.

7. In depth knowledge of adult learning theory.

8. Minimum 6 years experience as HC with one team.

9. A background free of harassment, sexual assault, violence, domestic or otherwise. 

Thats wher I would be starting.

Edited by diehardlionfan

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RETREADS AROUND THE LEAGUE - Current Team & Position (Team as HC)

I've tried to compile a comprehensive list. Feel free to throw out any other guys. This isn't a list of guys that I want, just a list of anyone that fits the category of: former NFL HC and is still coaching in NFL or college ranks as a coordinator or recently left/retired (N/A). Broadcast guys like Bill Cowher or Tony Dungy aren't listed as they are less likely to step away from TV and into a coaching role. 

OFFENSE

  • Jason Garrett - New York Giants OC (Dallas Cowboys)
  • Pat Shurmur - Denver Broncos OC (Cleveland Browns/New York Giants)
  • Gary Kubiak - Minnesota Vikings Asst HC/OC (Houston Texans/Denver Broncos)
  • Jay Gruden - Jacksonville Jaguars OC (Washington)
  • Josh McDaniels - New England Patriots OC (Denver Broncos)
  • Dirk Koetter - Atlanta Falcons OC (Tampa Bay Buccaneers)
  • Bill O'Brien - Houston Texans HC (Houston Texans)

DEFENSE

  • Todd Bowles - Tampa Bay Buccaneers DC (New York Jets)
  • Jack Del Rio - Washington DC (Jacksonville Jaguars/Oakland Raiders)
  • Leslie Frazier - Buffalo Bills DC (Minnesota Vikings)
  • Wade Phillips - N/A > LA Rams DC (Dallas Cowboys
  • Raheem Morris - Atlanta Falcons DC (Tampa Bay Buccaneers)
  • Chuck Pagano - Chicago Bears DC (Indianapolis Colts)
  • Jim Schwartz - Philadelphia Eagles DC (Detroit Lions)
  • Steve Spagnuolo - Kansas City Chiefs DC (St. Louis Rams)
  • Romeo Crennel - Houston Texans Asst. HC (Cleveland Browns/Kanas City Chiefs)
  • Gus Bradley - Los Angeles Chargers DC (Jacksonville Jaguars)
  • Mike Nolan - Dallas Cowboys DC (San Francisco 49ers)
  • Mike Pettine - Green Bay Packers DC (Cleveland Browns)
  • Dennis Allen - New Orleans Saints DC (Oakland Raiders)
  • Vance Joseph - Arizona Cardinals DC (Denver Broncos)
  • Dan Quinn - Atlanta Falcons HC (Atlanta Falcons)

FORMER NFL HC'S IN NCAA

  • Marvin Lewis - Arizona State co-DC (Cincinnati Bengals)
  • Jim Harbaugh - Michigan Wolverines (San Francisco 49ers)
  • Lovie Smith - Illinois Fighting Illini HC (Chicago Bears)
  • Greg Schiano - Rutgers Scarlet Knights HC (Tampa Bay Buccaneers)
  • Herm Edwards - Arizona State HC (New York Jets)
  • Chip Kelly - UCLA HC (Philadelphia Eagles)
  • Lane Kiffin - Ole Miss HC (Oakland Raiders)
Edited by Karnage84
Added Dan Quinn

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1 minute ago, Lionized said:

I hear Bill O’Brien is available 

My friend just mentioned that.... wow. 

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3 minutes ago, Karnage84 said:

My friend just mentioned that.... wow. 

The dude has back to back division titles and well Patricia.......he’s still around. 

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6 minutes ago, Lionized said:

The dude has back to back division titles and well Patricia.......he’s still around. 

He's had plenty of time to flesh out...Patricia's only been here for 2 full years. Patricia is probably going to be following BoB soon enough.

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19 hours ago, Lionized said:

I hear Bill O’Brien is available 

Another ex Patriot coach that didn’t work out.

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3 hours ago, diehardlionfan said:

Another ex Patriot coach that didn’t work out.

Would be a straight gem to add on for us lions fans. 

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