thebestever6 Posted October 28, 2020 Share Posted October 28, 2020 3 minutes ago, RUGmen said: 7-9 is the new 12-4, folks. Peyton led the 2012 Broncos to 12-4 with the same personel as the year before and so many wins came by a last second victory. They were 8-8 the year before let's not act like it hasn't happened. I never said it was 12-4 lot of season to be played I wouldn't mark them for 12-4 yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apparition Posted October 28, 2020 Share Posted October 28, 2020 2 minutes ago, thebestever6 said: Dude they're running a completely different offense with Newton like common and Brady I thought was poor last season with the talent around him don't see it being better this year had he stayed even with the covid opt outs. He left at the perfect time. That being said the Patriots are getting overly criticized by your narrative. They went from a 25 million per year qb to a running qb who is past his experation date making 7 mill per year The whole issue, from where I'm sitting, is that they were only really running a completely different offense for the first two weeks of the season. Since then they've been trying to make Cam play like Brady and the results have been disastrous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebestever6 Posted October 28, 2020 Share Posted October 28, 2020 1 minute ago, RUGmen said: I’m not even sure what you’re trying to prove here by stating the Broncos going 8-8? If anything, that does not help you’re argument. So the Broncos went 8-8 with Tim Tebow and the Bucs went 7-9 with Winston? No I'm saying when you take a hall of fame qb and put him on a underachieving football team 12-4 is really doable it has happened. I don't know why it's hard to admit the bucs were talented before brady Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebestever6 Posted October 28, 2020 Share Posted October 28, 2020 2 minutes ago, Starless said: The whole issue, from where I'm sitting, is that they were only really running a completely different offense for the first two weeks of the season. Since then they've been trying to make Cam play like Brady and the results have been disastrous. Well you can't expect much else I mean the week they played denver they got one day of practice that's crazy. And has anyone ever changed a qb as late in their career as Newton is? It doesn't happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUGmen Posted October 28, 2020 Share Posted October 28, 2020 Just now, thebestever6 said: No I'm saying when you take a hall of fame qb and put him on a underachieving football team 12-4 is really doable it has happened. I don't know why it's hard to admit the bucs were talented before brady I don’t think anyone is saying they aren’t. It’s the people discrediting how Brady is playing. Sure the Bucs have good players but again, people are acting as if this is a Durant joining a 70 wins GSW team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apparition Posted October 28, 2020 Share Posted October 28, 2020 Just now, thebestever6 said: Well you can't expect much else I mean the week they played denver they got one day of practice that's crazy. And has anyone ever changed a qb as late in their career as Newton is? It doesn't happen. Are you kidding? It's not uncommon at all. Kurt Warner joined the Cardinals at 34, after everyone said he was done, and he took them to a Super Bowl Rich Gannon joined the Raiders at 34 and won an MVP award + took them to a Super Bowl Joe Montana was traded to the Chiefs at 37 and played at a high level Favre had one of his best seasons with the Vikings at 40 And we all know about Peyton Manning Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebestever6 Posted October 28, 2020 Share Posted October 28, 2020 Just now, RUGmen said: I don’t think anyone is saying they aren’t. It’s the people discrediting how Brady is playing. Sure the Bucs have good players but again, people are acting as if this is a Durant joining a 70 wins GSW team. I don't see how I made it that or other people have made it that . It's remarkable he's playing at this level at this age. And Basketball is a totally different ball game when it comes to Superstars changing league landscape. It's probably the closest thing you can come to that. Titans were trash before When they had Mariota and look like a new team since Tannehill so it has not only happened with the one overall pick from 2015 but the number two as well. Teams can turn around with qb play Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebestever6 Posted October 28, 2020 Share Posted October 28, 2020 1 minute ago, Starless said: Are you kidding? It's not uncommon at all. Kurt Warner joined the Cardinals at 34, after everyone said he was done, and he took them to a Super Bowl Rich Gannon joined the Raiders at 34 and won an MVP award + took them to a Super Bowl Joe Montana was traded to the Chiefs at 37 and played at a high level Favre had one of his best seasons with the Vikings at 40 And we all know about Peyton Manning I'm saying Cam and the type of qb he is I don't believe a player has changed their stripes this late in their career . Maybe Randall Cunningham is the closest I've seen but he had that ability in Philly poor offensive coaching imo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apparition Posted October 28, 2020 Share Posted October 28, 2020 Just now, thebestever6 said: I'm saying Cam and the type of qb he is I don't believe a player has changed their stripes this late in their career . Maybe Randall Cunningham is the closest I've seen but he had that ability in Philly poor offensive coaching imo That's less common, but guys like Staubach, Tarkenton, Montana, Gannon and Rodgers all came to rely on their mobility less as they got older, and still played at a very high level. But that's really beside the point. Cam is still an effective runner. If the Pats had better talent around him, I would understand trying to make him throw from the pocket more, but the way the team is built requires him to be a consistent running threat in order to be successful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebestever6 Posted October 28, 2020 Share Posted October 28, 2020 Just now, Starless said: That's less common, but guys like Staubach, Tarkenton, Montana, Gannon and Rodgers all came to rely on their mobility less as they got older, and still played at a very high level. But that's really beside the point. Cam is still an effective runner. If the Pats had better talent around him, I would understand trying to make him throw from the pocket more, but the way the team is built requires him to be a consistent running threat in order to be successful. Cam has never been this guy and never will be this guy. It didn't happen the 9 years in Carolina I don't believe the way those players use their mobility and Cams relying on his as comparable I think it's Apple's and oranges tbh. Cams talent looked like it was eroded two years ago the contract he signed dictates that. Comparing New England's transitional situation to Toms hand picked free agent destination is low hanging fruit and I don't think it's fair at this point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apparition Posted October 28, 2020 Share Posted October 28, 2020 (edited) 3 minutes ago, thebestever6 said: Cam has never been this guy and never will be this guy. It didn't happen the 9 years in Carolina I don't believe the way those players use their mobility and Cams relying on his as comparable I think it's Apple's and oranges tbh. Cams talent looked like it was eroded two years ago the contract he signed dictates that. Comparing New England's transitional situation to Toms hand picked free agent destination is low hanging fruit and I don't think it's fair at this point. I mean, that's not wrong. But at the same time, the coaching staff knew how to play to Brady's strengths much more so than they seem to play to Cam's. And I'd say that's a big reason for why the offense is sputtering to the extent that it is. If Brady were still in New England, I'm not about to say the Pats would be a top-tier offense, because we saw how limited it was last year. But it wouldn't be the utter mess that it currently is. He certainly wouldn't be putting up a 3/11 TD/INT ratio. And yes, I realize that this seems to contradict what I said earlier in the thread. But compare the playcalling in the Pats' first couple of games to that in the last few. Clearly the offense was functioning better when they were letting Cam be Cam. Edited October 28, 2020 by Starless Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebestever6 Posted October 28, 2020 Share Posted October 28, 2020 Just now, Starless said: I mean, that's not wrong. But at the same time, the coaching staff knew how to play to Brady's strengths much more so than they seem to play to Cam's. And I'd say that's a big reason for why the offense is sputtering to the extent that it is. If Brady were still in New England, I'm not about to say the Pats would be a top-tier offense, because we saw how limited it was last year. But it wouldn't be the utter mess that it currently is. He certainly wouldn't be putting up a 3/11 TD/INT ratio. Oh I'm sure Brady would be better still think that team overall with opt outs and lack of talent on offense would struggle, also their pass rush hasn't impressed me but hightower opted out. That's an elite coaching staff I don't even think it's playing to a players strength anymore. Cam at his peak was the main chess piece to an offense, he just simply isn't that guy anymore.its like trying to beat a dead horse. If you were to criticize bill B not having a plan at qb post brady I'd agree. But I don't see it indicative of him as a coach at all. I'm shocked that bringing in a washed up qb to run a completely different style of offense took precedent over anything else shows you how much faith they have in Stidham. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChazStandard Posted October 28, 2020 Share Posted October 28, 2020 51 minutes ago, thebestever6 said: Dude they're running a completely different offense with Newton like common and Brady I thought was poor last season with the talent around him don't see it being better this year had he stayed even with the covid opt outs. He left at the perfect time. That being said the Patriots are getting overly criticized by your narrative. They went from a 25 million per year qb to a running qb who is past his experation date making 7 mill per year Brady took essentially this same NE roster - minus a couple more starters on the OL - to the 7th ranked scoring offense and 12-4. But for a couple of plays they could have been 14-2 and secured a bye, and if Edelman could catch they might have won that WC game. Without him they're 2-4 and have the 29th ranked scoring offense. Brady was anything but poor last year. Just like he wasn't poor in 2006 or 2013, it's just sometimes and offense is too devoid of talent to get over the hump. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebestever6 Posted October 28, 2020 Share Posted October 28, 2020 3 minutes ago, ChazStandard said: Brady took essentially this same NE roster - minus a couple more starters on the OL - to the 7th ranked scoring offense and 12-4. But for a couple of plays they could have been 14-2 and secured a bye, and if Edelman could catch they might have won that WC game. Without him they're 2-4 and have the 29th ranked scoring offense. Brady was anything but poor last year. Just like he wasn't poor in 2006 or 2013, it's just sometimes and offense is too devoid of talent to get over the hump. His Qbr was 54 last year lowest since the metric was established he was poor by his standards . And Edleman can catch dude was superbowl mvp and made the best catch I've seen iñ that Falcons superbowl. Let's not act like he's Wes welker and won that playoff game the titans physically took that game. Brady ended his career with a pick 6 in that playoff game. 29th scoring offense with a qb who has been on IR the last few years got it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebestever6 Posted October 28, 2020 Share Posted October 28, 2020 New England's odds to make the superbowl before the season +2200 Tampa Bay +1200. Gosh the narratives get so twisted on this site I'm down arguing tom brady and Bill B it's a losing battle like talking to a wall Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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