ThatJaxxenGuy Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 I’m way more inclined to blame proven bum Bruce Arians over Tom Brady right now, but I will say I think the Bucs are one of the teams who suffer the most from having no offseason. The team finally looked like it was going to start gelling then they signed Antonio Brown and now that’s another guy’s reads and timings to figure out as well Brady seems to understand you have to forcefeed Brown if you don’t want the crazy to come out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_James Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 13 hours ago, RUGmen said: Funny how much better the offense looked in the 2nd half. Seems to be a reoccurring theme of Leftwich calling most plays in the first and then in the second it’s Brady’s NE show. Hopefully they come out of the bye and take the NE offensive identity and run with it. Chiefs just took their foot off the gas in the second half. With an offense this potentially explosive, they set up Tom Brady to have another storyline 4'th quarter come from behind victory. He just doesn't have those in him anymore. And Brady throwing two second half picks was never part of the NE show. Slow starts and costly turnovers, that is the story of 2020 Tom Brady when you separate the signal from the noise imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChazStandard Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 7 minutes ago, Saint_James said: Chiefs just took their foot off the gas in the second half. With an offense this potentially explosive, they set up Tom Brady to have another storyline 4'th quarter come from behind victory. He just doesn't have those in him anymore. And Brady throwing two second half picks was never part of the NE show. Slow starts and costly turnovers, that is the story of 2020 Tom Brady when you separate the signal from the noise imo. I mean, he got them within 3, it's not his fault the D couldn't get KC off the field in the final 3 minutes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtmmike Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 Yeah could not have happen to a nicer guy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUGmen Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 45 minutes ago, Saint_James said: Chiefs just took their foot off the gas in the second half. With an offense this potentially explosive, they set up Tom Brady to have another storyline 4'th quarter come from behind victory. He just doesn't have those in him anymore. And Brady throwing two second half picks was never part of the NE show. Slow starts and costly turnovers, that is the story of 2020 Tom Brady when you separate the signal from the noise imo. Foot off the gas? Really? Go ask Andy Reid if his defense decided to step off the gas after the 1st half up 20-7 to Tom Brady. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_James Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 2 minutes ago, RUGmen said: Foot off the gas? Really? Go ask Andy Reid if his defense decided to step off the gas after the 1st half up 20-7 to Tom Brady. His defense got two second-half turnovers. Not sure what you even mean. The offense went into milk-clock mode to protect their lead and win the game. They weren't trying to pile up points in the second half obviously. Tampa Bay has a good defense, but it ain't THAT good.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asciimo Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 21 minutes ago, Saint_James said: His defense got two second-half turnovers. Not sure what you even mean. The offense went into milk-clock mode to protect their lead and win the game. They weren't trying to pile up points in the second half obviously. Tampa Bay has a good defense, but it ain't THAT good.... yeah, no. been dismantled now by any decent QB not named rodgers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_James Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 2 hours ago, ET80 said: I'm listening to Sean Salisbury - he's mentioned how the Bucs don't do much (if any) pre snap motion. They'll motion a RB from out wide into the shotgun, but that's the extent of it. Part of Brady's MO in reading pre-snap was motioning guys to see how the defense responds. Brady then identifies where the opening is and adjusts to that, dropping passes to the horizontal routes, which will eventually open up the deep crosser and corner routes. Bruce Arians isn't even thinking that direction right now, and Brady looks hesitant due to it. If this is going to work, Arians needs to go to this. Doesn't any quarterback have the option to motion a player pre-snap on his own accord? I am not saying you are wrong, I'm honestly asking the question. If this is a problem with their offense, and I agree that it could be, doesn't Tom Brady of all people have the autonomy to motion a guy if he wants to? Like audibles, I was under the impression that motioning players is something that established quarterbacks can execute pre-snap if they determine the need depending on defense alignment etc etc Are we seriously supposed to accept that the Bruce Arians offense simply does not allow for such a thing? Or that Tom can not do that? I cannot believe that. That feels like more excuse-making by Camp Brady in the national media, but I'm willing to be convinced otherwise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 6 minutes ago, Saint_James said: Doesn't any quarterback have the option to motion a player pre-snap on his own accord? I am not saying you are wrong, I'm honestly asking the question. If this is a problem with their offense, and I agree that it could be, doesn't Tom Brady of all people have the autonomy to motion a guy if he wants to? Like audibles, I was under the impression that motioning players is something that established quarterbacks can execute pre-snap if they determine the need depending on defense alignment etc etc Depends on the coach, to be honest. Routes are designed to be on the strong or weak side - does that throw off the play if you send a guy to the opposite side of the field? I think some coaches are good with a QB motioning their guys, but I don't know if Arians is one of those guys. Based on the feedback of others, I'm leaning towards no, he doesn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AFlaccoSeagulls Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, ET80 said: I'm listening to Sean Salisbury - he's mentioned how the Bucs don't do much (if any) pre snap motion. They'll motion a RB from out wide into the shotgun, but that's the extent of it. Part of Brady's MO in reading pre-snap was motioning guys to see how the defense responds. Brady then identifies where the opening is and adjusts to that, dropping passes to the horizontal routes, which will eventually open up the deep crosser and corner routes. Bruce Arians isn't even thinking that direction right now, and Brady looks hesitant due to it. If this is going to work, Arians needs to go to this. Just to back this up, through week 4 (that's the most recent I can find...), the Bucs were 30th in the NFL in pre-snap motion rates: https://imgur.com/a/LdjbDAc Last year, the Bucs finished 25th (or were 25th as of November 25th): https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/28170117/pre-snap-motion-given-ravens-edge-why-more-teams-use-it I think to be honest I can toot my horn a little bit here, because Brady is just not a fit in Arians' scheme. The red flags were there from the beginning. Arians loves to go deep - Tom doesn't have the arm to consistently do that. Tom, at this stage in his career, thrives in a short, timing passing game where he can pick apart matchups - that's not the offense Arians runs. Everyone should've been able to see this coming from a mile away unless Arians was going to change his entire scheme for 2 years of 45 year-old Tom Brady. It just didn't add up, and the longer the season goes on, the worse it's going to get especially as all of those FA signing egos start to come out (Antonio Brown, chiefly). Edited November 30, 2020 by AFlaccoSeagulls 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_James Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 29 minutes ago, ET80 said: Depends on the coach, to be honest. Routes are designed to be on the strong or weak side - does that throw off the play if you send a guy to the opposite side of the field? I think some coaches are good with a QB motioning their guys, but I don't know if Arians is one of those guys. Based on the feedback of others, I'm leaning towards no, he doesn't. Good point although if all they run is fly-routes, does it matter? Not sure. I just have a hard time believing Tom Brady has the clout in Tampa Bay to get players signed the coach doesn't even want, but he can't do something as simple as motion a guy....I don't know, just seems suspect. Bruce Arians is many thing, but a liar doesn't seem to be one of them. He's pretty much admitted Brady has free reign to pick/call the plays he wants in most cases. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 9 minutes ago, Saint_James said: I just have a hard time believing Tom Brady has the clout in Tampa Bay to get players signed the coach doesn't even want, but he can't do something as simple as motion a guy....I don't know, just seems suspect Maybe it's just me... but I actually think there's a bit of a power struggle between Brady and Arians. Brady uses his pull to bring in guys like Gronk and AB, Arians (and OC Byron Leftwich) design plays that makes it difficult to do the things Brady likes, Brady then looks bad, Arians talks trash... Meanwhile, you have guys like Mike Evans and Ndonkeykong Suh who just wanna play football. It just... FEELS like something is not right there. Both guys have very big egos, Arians is naturally abrasive, Brady is subtle with his disapproval... I get the feeling they're not very good with one another. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_James Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 1 minute ago, ET80 said: Maybe it's just me... but I actually think there's a bit of a power struggle between Brady and Arians. Brady uses his pull to bring in guys like Gronk and AB, Arians (and OC Byron Leftwich) design plays that makes it difficult to do the things Brady likes, Brady then looks bad, Arians talks trash... Meanwhile, you have guys like Mike Evans and Ndonkeykong Suh who just wanna play football. It just... FEELS like something is not right there. Both guys have very big egos, Arians is naturally abrasive, Brady is subtle with his disapproval... I get the feeling they're not very good with one another. Oh you are 100% there, something is NOT right at all down there in Tampa. Not sure how much of this stuff is true, but it's a wonderful soap opera so far! It just feels like everyone wants to throw Arians under the bus when they have given Tom EVERYTHING he wanted. But maybe that's part of the problem? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chiefer Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 27 minutes ago, ET80 said: Maybe it's just me... but I actually think there's a bit of a power struggle between Brady and Arians. Brady uses his pull to bring in guys like Gronk and AB, Arians (and OC Byron Leftwich) design plays that makes it difficult to do the things Brady likes, Brady then looks bad, Arians talks trash... Meanwhile, you have guys like Mike Evans and Ndonkeykong Suh who just wanna play football. It just... FEELS like something is not right there. Both guys have very big egos, Arians is naturally abrasive, Brady is subtle with his disapproval... I get the feeling they're not very good with one another. Just smells like incompetence, how about just creating a game plan to win the game? Work with what you’ve got, and create a team around that. Petty squabbles and power plays, There’s a reason Arians QBs always hit career interception totals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted November 30, 2020 Author Share Posted November 30, 2020 It’s not that Tampas D is bad, they are actually a Top 3 Defense according to DVOA, however they keep playing man to man coverage with no safety help against these strong armed QBs. Any bucs fan wanna explain that? No other team does that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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