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Fire Pace and Nagy


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Matt Nagy is the Jared Goff of head coaches...we need a Matt Stafford...

You can look at the amount of wins but honestly what does 7 or 8 wins and a 1st round playoff loss actually matter at this point? Is that enough for us? Because personally I don't think it is...

Not only that but hat is Nagy actually doing for us right now? We are starting to find a bit of an identity on offence using more WCO and zone blocking schemes...which is the exact opposite of what Nagy preaches in his scheme...the defence is starting to play better especially the front seven...which Nagy has nothing to do with...he is nothing more than a figure head at this point and as good a guy as I think he is...it's not enough.

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5 hours ago, Madmike90 said:

Matt Nagy is the Jared Goff of head coaches...we need a Matt Stafford...

You can look at the amount of wins but honestly what does 7 or 8 wins and a 1st round playoff loss actually matter at this point? Is that enough for us? Because personally I don't think it is...

Not only that but hat is Nagy actually doing for us right now? We are starting to find a bit of an identity on offence using more WCO and zone blocking schemes...which is the exact opposite of what Nagy preaches in his scheme...the defence is starting to play better especially the front seven...which Nagy has nothing to do with...he is nothing more than a figure head at this point and as good a guy as I think he is...it's not enough.

This is exactly what my brother and I were talking about. He asked me this - "What does Nagy bring to the table that John Fox didn't?"


Nothing. He is an offensive mind that can't call plays, can't adjust, and has a bottom 2 scoring offense. Fox made a living off getting his coordinators to get things going.  I want a HC that is the foundation of the franchise and Nagy isn't and won't ever be that. Does he get the guys to play hard? So did Lovie. Should we re-hire him? Hell no. That's their job, and has 7, 8, and 9 figure incentives to be the best in the league. 

 

Ride the defense and run game is something any defensive guy can order. The thing is though that the defensive HC can call defenses still too. Lose a DC? Fine, I'm calling the plays still. Developing a QB is what will get the HC a decade of security here. Nagy hasn't been able to elevate a QB's play since he got here. I don't believe that will change with Fields.

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13 hours ago, Sugashane said:

Developing a QB is what will get the HC a decade of security here. Nagy hasn't been able to elevate a QB's play since he got here. I don't believe that will change with Fields.

This is my greatest concern.  With the kind of physical talent Fields has he needs the kind of coaching and schemes that can take advantage of that and Nagy seems ill equipped to do it.

Even as a raw rookie he's shown deadly accuracy throwing downfield yet Nagy's schemes tend to limit that.  This is a guy you can build an offense that can score 30-40 points per game with but will that ever happen if he's playing under Nagy? 

IMHO Nagy coaches "scared".  He's too timid.

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40 minutes ago, soulman said:

IMHO Nagy coaches "scared".  He's too timid.

I call that the "prevent offense." You prevent the majority of bad risks but you also prevent the chances of your offense having a big game.

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1 hour ago, Sugashane said:

I call that the "prevent offense." You prevent the majority of bad risks but you also prevent the chances of your offense having a big game.

Fox specialized in prevent offense with the Bears.

I have always said I would rather go for the win and lose by 40 than make a game look artificially close and respectable.    

I get it though.   It is a type of job protection, short term anyway.   

Media loses its mind if you get blown out and doesn't when you stay down by just 2 scores an entire game.

 

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20 minutes ago, dll2000 said:

Fox specialized in prevent offense with the Bears.

I have always said I would rather go for the win and lose by 40 than make a game look artificially close and respectable.    

I get it though.   It is a type of job protection, short term anyway.   

Media loses its mind if you get blown out and doesn't when you stay down by just 2 scores an entire game.

 

I have the exact same view. I remember exactly why I have that view. Magic Johnson when the Bulls crushed them during the finals. He said something along the line of "Regardless if we lost by one or forty, it's still one-one."

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22 hours ago, Madmike90 said:

Matt Nagy is the Jared Goff of head coaches...we need a Matt Stafford...

You can look at the amount of wins but honestly what does 7 or 8 wins and a 1st round playoff loss actually matter at this point? Is that enough for us? Because personally I don't think it is...

Not only that but hat is Nagy actually doing for us right now? We are starting to find a bit of an identity on offence using more WCO and zone blocking schemes...which is the exact opposite of what Nagy preaches in his scheme...the defence is starting to play better especially the front seven...which Nagy has nothing to do with...he is nothing more than a figure head at this point and as good a guy as I think he is...it's not enough.

I wouldn't be upset if Nagy is canned at all.

But being a good CEO is a valuable thing. Running an NFL team and managing a locker room is hard, and he does that part of the job pretty well.

He is his own worst enemy. If he can stay out of play calling then he may survive.

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3 hours ago, soulman said:

This is my greatest concern.  With the kind of physical talent Fields has he needs the kind of coaching and schemes that can take advantage of that and Nagy seems ill equipped to do it.

Even as a raw rookie he's shown deadly accuracy throwing downfield yet Nagy's schemes tend to limit that.  This is a guy you can build an offense that can score 30-40 points per game with but will that ever happen if he's playing under Nagy? 

IMHO Nagy coaches "scared".  He's too timid.

I do not think he coaches scared in terms of the team and macro decisions. I think he is pretty average in terms of aggressiveness.

I think as a play caller he panics almost immediately and starts running his terrible quick game crap. He needs to stay away from the play sheet, because he really sucks at it.

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58 minutes ago, WindyCity said:

I wouldn't be upset if Nagy is canned at all.

But being a good CEO is a valuable thing. Running an NFL team and managing a locker room is hard, and he does that part of the job pretty well.

He is his own worst enemy. If he can stay out of play calling then he may survive.

Being a good CEO is one thing but it's just not enough IMO.

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1 hour ago, WindyCity said:

I wouldn't be upset if Nagy is canned at all.

But being a good CEO is a valuable thing. Running an NFL team and managing a locker room is hard, and he does that part of the job pretty well.

He is his own worst enemy. If he can stay out of play calling then he may survive.

Phil Jackson was smart enough to leave coaching to Tex Winter and he managed the personalities.

 

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3 hours ago, Sugashane said:

I call that the "prevent offense." You prevent the majority of bad risks but you also prevent the chances of your offense having a big game.

Yup, both Elway and Farve threw far more picks than Jay Cutler but both won Super Bowls.

If you throw deep you're gonna get picked every so often.  Look at the pick DH-C got last Sunday.  It was a well thrown ball the receiver should've had but it went through his hands right into DH-C's hands. 

It was a hell of a play by DH-C and not Carr's fault although it will be recorded in the stats that way.

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1 hour ago, WindyCity said:

I think as a play caller he panics almost immediately and starts running his terrible quick game crap. He needs to stay away from the play sheet, because he really sucks at it.

Getting in a panic with his play calling is exactly what I mean about coaching scared.  Turnovers also get in his head so his play calling often changes after one.  He gets less aggressive reducing his chances of making up for any points scored as a result of the turnover.

Fields said all we needed to hear, as if we even needed that.  Lazor is the picture of calm and tends to get his plays in on time.  Nagy always seems indecisive and we've often had to call time outs to get a play off or the correct personnel on the field for the play call.

I've often said the offense looks like a Chinese Fire Drill (I assume we all know that that is) whereas with Lazor calling the plays it seems far less so.  Nagy may have the same goal to win as every other HC but what he lacks is an ability to lay the foundation to do it.   JMHO

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1 hour ago, dll2000 said:

Phil Jackson was smart enough to leave coaching to Tex Winter and he managed the personalities.

 

He also had Jordan to do that too. Jordan's words meant me in that arena than anyone else's. Fields isn't Jordan but can be Pippen in time. He needs to be developed. 

 

This season may go a long way to show if we have someone who can do that developing. 

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9 hours ago, soulman said:

IMHO Nagy coaches "scared".  He's too timid.

Well...we did see him do the most idiotic thing I've ever seen a HC do. And it fits right into your description, there. 

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