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Fire Pace and Nagy


beardown3231

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6 hours ago, Ty21 said:

“Mark Konkol” former Sun times/current patch.com reporter said Nagy’s been told he’s getting fired after the thanksgiving game. I trust this source with my life

?????  Why would you tell him of his firing in advance?  What does that gain you?

It's not like he's an auto mechanic who can immediately begin looking for a new job.

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6 hours ago, Madmike90 said:

Cornerback Jaylon Johnson, who’s already made his displeasure with Nagy clear earlier this season, appeared to take a shot at Nagy when he addressed the losing streak — and the “rah-rah speeches” that have come with it.

“How many games have we lost in a row? Yeah, there’s nothing to talk about. We aren’t going to beat a dead horse. Like I said, we are all men. Coming in here and saying, ‘We have to figure out a way,’ to me, it’s BS. Like we aren’t going to keep talking. We have to find ways to win, we just have to get it done. Whatever it is. There’s nothing to keep coming in here and talking about, and having all these rah-rah speeches. We’ve had five weeks of rah-rah speeches. I don’t think that talking is anything we need to be doing.”

Get Nagy out of there on Thursday night...he is done.

There is no figuring out a way to get it done.  That opportunity passed about two years ago.

What's been apparent for a very long time is that Matt Nagy's offensive toolbox is actually very small and he has no ability to expand it.  Read the thread I posted on how poorly the way we've done things compares to how Baltimore has done it and you'll know how they beat us Sunday.

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OK.....we know Nagy is a dead man walking.  Whether it takes place right after the Detroit game, next Monday, or after the final game his time as Bears HC has come to an end.  It's terminal.

Now let's focus on Pace.  That seems a bit trickier.

On one side there's his track record of wins vs losses and some of the worst decisions regarding retaining aging vets with poison pill deals that I've ever seen.  In the coming year or two we'll still have tens of millions of dead cap on the books while trying to keep rebuilding a roster that can win.  In addition I believe we only have 32 players under contract for 2022.

On the other side is the trust the McCaskey Family appears to have in him and his move to draft Justin Fields who may finally become the franchise QB we've lacked forever.  I can pretty easily balance out his drafts and FA signings as most of the good having been countered by the bad. So does he deserve more time to hire yet another HC and hopefully get it right this time?

My opinion:  Not without our hiring an Exec VP who should decide his fate.  I posted a thread in which the author suggested either hiring Ozzie Newsome for that role or relying on Newsome's guidance as far as hiring someone else to fill that role.  GMcC and Teddy Bears need to stop using outside consultants or someone the NFL sends their way to make this decision.

They can't seem to get it right themselves so the thought of going to someone who has done it right for so long makes sense.  The problem is would Ozzie Newsome even give them the time of day when they once tried to hire Eric DeCosta away from him?  This is the issue I debated with Mike.  Can the Bears find top exec talent who will agree to work for or even with them.

No doubt there is HC talent to be had but will we continue to seek the wrong skill set in our hiring process?  If we leave Pace along with GMcC and Teddy Bears to do it I can probably be assured that we will just as I can see mistakes in many of names members here have thrown up as who they believe our top prospects should be.  I believe we're ignoring what we truly need.

If we choose to accept that Matt Nagy was when hired THE top HC prospect then along with Dave Wannstadt he'll be the second such "hot prospect" we hired.  Wanny was supposedly a defensive guru whereas Nagy was supposedly an offensive guru.  Look at their W/L records and the rankings of their respective defensive and offensive units.  Both have failed big time.

IMHO talented OC and DC can be found but are not always the best HC material.  Give me a guy whose a strong leader and who can adapt year in and year out to talent he has.  Nagy failed because he could not do that and many others have traveled a similar path and have also failed as HC but were top shelf coordinators.  The Bears need better leadership top to bottom.

I already know the type of guy I would like to see hired next and I have a few ideas for who those guys might be and they more than likely won't top anyone's list as a "hot prospect" yet they've shown an ability to succeed year in and year out wherever they've coached.  IMHO those are who we should be looking at then let them bring in top coordinators to work with.

To sum up.  I've at least somewhat lost faith in even Ryan Pace's ability to find the right guy to replace Matt Nagy and I'm now leaning away from making him an Exec VP as well.  The only reason I suggested it to begin with is it would keep GMcC more comfortable.  Now I think we probably do need to gut the front office and rebuild it so we can more effectively rebuild the team in total.  Leaving Pace to clean up his own mess will only delay the inevitable for him too.

 

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Anyone else finding it really interesting that with all this speculation we have heard zero out of Ryan Pace or anyone in the front office/overtime? You would think if Nagy hadn't been told he was gone after the Lions game there would be some sort of "We will continue to evaluate our options until the end of the season"...

Very strange they have just left him in the wind on his own if it is not the case he is gone.

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58 minutes ago, Madmike90 said:

Anyone else finding it really interesting that with all this speculation we have heard zero out of Ryan Pace or anyone in the front office/overtime? You would think if Nagy hadn't been told he was gone after the Lions game there would be some sort of "We will continue to evaluate our options until the end of the season"...

Very strange they have just left him in the wind on his own if it is not the case he is gone.

Hasn't Pace typically never said anything until the offseason anyways. I think this is on par with him until he actually wants to come out and say what ever the decision is.

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1 hour ago, Madmike90 said:

Anyone else finding it really interesting that with all this speculation we have heard zero out of Ryan Pace or anyone in the front office/overtime? You would think if Nagy hadn't been told he was gone after the Lions game there would be some sort of "We will continue to evaluate our options until the end of the season"...

Very strange they have just left him in the wind on his own if it is not the case he is gone.

Pace and the rest of the front office have always turned into hermits when things are going badly.  Yeah, sure as hell Ryan Pace should be out there speaking with the media as well. Is it his decision not to or is he under orders not to?

The top guys tend to give us their annual State of the Bears presser once a year then climb back in their hidey holes until it's time to spew the next years BS and propaganda.  I guess one could also guess that Pace is not on very solid ground either.

Beyond the knowledge that Nagy will be let go either on Friday, next Monday, or at seasons end anything we know about Pace is pure speculation.  He could also be let go or he could stay on another year.  Or he could become an Exec VP.  We'll know soon enough.

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29 minutes ago, CBears019 said:

After the presser and practice Nagy met with ownership….he then cancelled all afternoon/evening meetings.  Per Biggs.

 

Yeah…he’s gone.

Well then just fire him already. What is the damn point of dragging this **** show on any longer? Just put the guy out of his misery.

What happens is Bears win Thursday, they still going to fire Nagy after the game ? That'll be even more of a bad look.

This organization can't even get right firing someone.

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12 hours ago, Madmike90 said:

Anyone else finding it really interesting that with all this speculation we have heard zero out of Ryan Pace or anyone in the front office/overtime? You would think if Nagy hadn't been told he was gone after the Lions game there would be some sort of "We will continue to evaluate our options until the end of the season"...

Very strange they have just left him in the wind on his own if it is not the case he is gone.

The more distance Pace can put between himself and Nagy, the more likely he survives.

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Going back to Spring.  It was so, so stupid to bring back Pace and Nagy for a lame duck year.   

Double stupid to do it with your new franchise QB in place.

Only positive is Pace had IMO a nice draft to set team up with some key pieces for future.  

Still wondering if Pace stays.  They have to know media and fans will say Nagy was your guy, why are you still here and he isn’t? 

It would be funny to me if Nagy comes out and says Pace forced his hand on some coaching decisions.  I don’t think he will.  I think Pace did.  But I think Nagy was on board.  

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1 hour ago, WindyCity said:

Just fire Nagy already. This is only going to get uglier for him and the team.

This is the cost of that ridiculous press conference last January. Stupid then and even stupider now.

Makes little sense to fire Nagy and keep Pace.

Pace is every bit the problem Nagy if only because he didn't recognize Nagy was a bad coach much earlier

.   I went to just one practice and attended no meetings and red flags were going off for me everywhere (this when he was coming off coach of year in training camp 2019).   I saw many things bad coaches do and little of the things good coaches do.  I was super high on that team and Nagy at time so I was shocked.    I thought it may be a one off and put my rose colored fan glasses on a few days later.  

It wasn't just me either.  I went by myself, but I sat nearby a bunch of HS coaches (wearing their gear).  They were saying and seeing a lot of same things I was.   1)  Wrong teaching.  2)  No player mistake accountability.  3) No teaching.  4)  Not playing or rewarding best performers 5) Little fundamental work with heavy emphasis on scrimmaging without instruction.   All classic bad coach moves.  

Pace got to be there for everything for a year plus.   If he can't see it, he is a problem and can't pick a head coach.   

I wrote all about it here in some very long posts.  I deleted the long ones because I got dogpiled and then doubted myself as I didn't know pro game practices.      

I will concede Nagy did good with last draft.   But he doesn't understand good coaching or team building as a whole.

 

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