bigbadbuff Posted October 5, 2020 Share Posted October 5, 2020 21 minutes ago, wackywabbit said: Don't you dare. But yea, if Allen plays 12 more weeks at a similar or close level, he will move way up. In specific to this site Ravens fans were the most critical/unaccepting/blind to the Josh Allen progress. I’m not and have not graded Allen yet based on this stretch. The Bills fan in me won’t allow me to have something nice until i get concrete evidence. Even if he has a 36/3 or whatever it is TD/int rate over his last 14 games Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Reed Posted October 5, 2020 Share Posted October 5, 2020 4 minutes ago, bigbadbuff said: In specific to this site Ravens fans were the most critical/unaccepting/blind to the Josh Allen progress. I’m not and have not graded Allen yet based on this stretch. The Bills fan in me won’t allow me to have something nice until i get concrete evidence. Even if he has a 36/3 or whatever it is TD/int rate over his last 14 games Pretty sure you’re referring to the one Ravens fan who was just wildly outspoken against Allen - the one I called out earlier in this thread. If there were multiple anti-Allen Ravens fans they certainly didn’t make themselves known on our board very much. Most Ravens fans on the board actually really like Josh Allen and liked him coming out because he reminded us of a more mobile Flacco lol 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbadbuff Posted October 5, 2020 Share Posted October 5, 2020 4 minutes ago, Ray Reed said: Pretty sure you’re referring to the one Ravens fan who was just wildly outspoken against Allen - the one I called out earlier in this thread. If there were multiple anti-Allen Ravens fans they certainly didn’t make themselves known on our board very much. Most Ravens fans on the board actually really like Josh Allen and liked him coming out because he reminded us of a more mobile Flacco lol I get a couple of them confused so it easily could be just one lmao 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyMossIsBoss Posted October 5, 2020 Share Posted October 5, 2020 Are people really ready to call Allen better than Watson after 4 games!? That is so ridiculous... Unless you were particularly low on Watson, or particularly high on Allen, coming into this season. However, most had Warson firmly inside the top 10 if not top 5, and Allen fringe top 15. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
///mcompact Posted October 6, 2020 Share Posted October 6, 2020 I don't know..probably wait until week 8 to vote. Things have a way of shaking loose mid-season. I've always thought Watson was just a tad bit overrated. Allen? He was all over the place rated last year and seems to be playing red hot...like Watson was before. I don't know. It's still to early in their careers, but Allen has a helluva team surrounding him. If it wasn't for his Pedostache, I'd root for him more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ASmithFan1010 Posted October 6, 2020 Share Posted October 6, 2020 Watson. He played KC, BALT, PIT. Allen needs to do it for longer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wackywabbit Posted October 6, 2020 Share Posted October 6, 2020 (edited) 5 hours ago, bigbadbuff said: In specific to this site Ravens fans were the most critical/unaccepting/blind to the Josh Allen progress. Nah, you are confusing a poster or two with a fanbase. I'm a Ravens' fan and I've been on Josh Allen pretty much longer than pretty much any Bills fan (pre-draft), and I have $100 on him to win MVP this year at 50:1 odds. I've been watching him closer than most, so I will call out that he's still got some wild plays every single week, but I love that type of QB. Edited October 6, 2020 by wackywabbit 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sp6488 Posted October 6, 2020 Share Posted October 6, 2020 11 hours ago, SBLIII said: It is a debate. Watson has been overrated for some time now. he can't carry a rubbish team. Top 5 is a stretch imo and Allen is playing like a top 5 QB. I've started wondering if Watson was anointed a bit too early. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted October 6, 2020 Share Posted October 6, 2020 On 10/5/2020 at 10:25 AM, Ray Reed said: Texans fans may get their wish with BoB out after this year, though, and we'll see how Deshaun looks under new leadership/coaching. Grab your hat and put on your church shoes, it's about to get LIT! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trentwannabe Posted October 6, 2020 Share Posted October 6, 2020 Allen needs to do it for more than 4 games to be in the conversation. Maybe win a playoff game too which should be the bare minimum for this team this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drained Posted October 6, 2020 Share Posted October 6, 2020 (edited) 23 hours ago, SBLIII said: It is a debate. Watson has been overrated for some time now. he can't carry a rubbish team. Top 5 is a stretch imo and Allen is playing like a top 5 QB. Watson literally carried out 2018 team out of a 0-3 hole to a 11-5 record. He carried us last season to our first wild card win since like 2015 lol. All he ever does is carry us, have you not looked at the stat for how many times he has practically won us the game by scoring a TD with under 2 minutes to go and then our defense gives up a field goal. We left 25 seconds on the clock against the Saints last season, Deshaun scored a TD in fifteen seconds to get us the win, he threw from our own endzone in two plays, he was insane, this is an age old story and then like always, our defense gave up 40 yards in 25 seconds... FG kicked, game over. He doesn't catch interceptions as well. He can't do everything. He can carry us and has been doing so. He's a top 5 QB. Allen is lucky he has good weapons around him, a good coaching staff and that finally Buffalo has picked it up, Watson walked into a dumpster fire and has tried to tame it. I think hes thoroughly had enough, thank god BoB is gone. Edited October 6, 2020 by Drained Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbadbuff Posted October 6, 2020 Share Posted October 6, 2020 13 minutes ago, Drained said: Watson literally carried out 2018 team out of a 0-3 hole to a 11-5 record. He carried us last season to our first wild card win since like 2015 lol. All he ever does is carry us, have you not looked at the stat for how many times he has practically won us the game by scoring a TD with under 2 minutes to go and then our defense gives up a field goal. We left 25 seconds on the clock against the Saints last season, Deshaun scored a TD in fifteen seconds to get us the win, he threw from our own endzone in two plays, he was insane, this is an age old story and then like always, our defense gave up 40 yards in 25 seconds... FG kicked, game over. He doesn't catch interceptions as well. He can't do everything. He can carry us and has been doing so. He's a top 5 QB. Allen is lucky he has good weapons around him, a good coaching staff and that finally Buffalo has picked it up, Watson walked into a dumpster fire and has tried to tame it. I think hes thoroughly had enough, thank god BoB is gone. agreed with you until the last paragraph, which is you trying to downplay Allen, as if he didn’t walk into a dumpster fire as well. Watson walked into Deandre Hopkins, and into a trash division that Allen didn’t have the pleasure of having. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drained Posted October 6, 2020 Share Posted October 6, 2020 3 minutes ago, bigbadbuff said: agreed with you until the last paragraph, which is you trying to downplay Allen, as if he didn’t walk into a dumpster fire as well. Watson walked into Deandre Hopkins, and into a trash division that Allen didn’t have the pleasure of having. I said hes lucky now. Things have worked out for Allen in Buffalo finally. Watson has performed well despite the incompetency of the front office and coaching staff. That being said yes he did get the pleasure of having Hopkins to throw to and our insanely trash division (that seems on the up now) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diamondbull424 Posted October 6, 2020 Share Posted October 6, 2020 On 10/5/2020 at 1:44 PM, bigbadbuff said: But Ravens fans specifically on this site blamed Josh when he was playing in a God awful offensive situation. I'm not gonna stand for this hypocrisy. If you want to say Watson is better due to body of work, fine. Josh does need to prove it longer, but Watson shouldn't be getting any excuses, especially as a vet compared to Josh in year 1-2 who was getting blasted from the Baltimore fan base. Perhaps I missed a thread, but I’m confused as to where this is coming from. Can’t recall some sort of mass persecution of Allen by Ravens fans. I’d be interested in a link to such a claim. I know I personally defended Josh Allen and his potential this season and some of what I saw from him last season in a thread with a bunch of dunk gifs dispersed throughout (can’t recall what thread). Said I think it was very possible that based on ability he was a top 12-15 QB last season vs the bottom 10 QB that his stats portrayed. Now he seems to have improved further and also now has an OL that you can roast marshmallows behind before he gets touched. Throw in a legit #1 WR and a good receiving core in general? He’s a top 5 QB this season, currently. ——————— In terms of the nature of this question, I think my best answer is indeterminate. I don’t have enough evidence to place Allen above Watson. I think at the moment he’s benefiting from schematic tendencies not yet being figured out. This isn’t to say I think HE and his talent will be “figured out” but rather that defenses haven’t a good grip on how the Bills are exposing them. I’d expect once we get a few clashes within the division and some bye weeks for teams to really analyze the games, we might see a bit more regression to the mean. In theory though, Allen and Watson are similarly difficult to take down with tackles in the pocket, they’re similar in their processing, and decision making. I’d probably give a speed edge to Watson. I’d probably trust Watson more with carrying without fumbling. I find Watson’s overall accuracy to be a bit superior. Allen for sure has the better arm and I wouldn’t really call it close. I feel Allen has an elite trait that can’t be taught or duplicated with that arm, while he could close the gap on the rest of where he lags behind. Yet I still can’t help but feel that if the game were on the line and I was down by 4 points and needed a TD, I could trust Watson a little more to pull through, if he has an elite traits it would likely be located in some sort of intangible clutch gene. Now before the Allen stands say they have the same number of 4th Q comebacks and the same number of GWDs... I sort of feel like, Allen has benefited in such moments from quality coaching while in Watson’s scenarios he was seemingly succeeding in spite of his coaching. Which is why my answer is indeterminate. I need to see Watson with a better OL around him to see if his tendency to bail out of the pocket is a “survival” trait or if it’s just who he is as a QB. When Allen was behind a line that was comparatively bad, his decision making was far more questionable, but he was also younger and less experienced. Gun to my head though? I’ll choose Allen, only because he’s got a great cast of coaches around him that I trust and that would be the tie breaker. But if Watson and the Texans boost their coaching staff with the likes of Eric Bieniemy at HC and Marvin Lewis as a special advisor (retaining Anthony Weaver for DC to learn under Marvin)... Than I‘m sure I flip back to Watson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbadbuff Posted October 6, 2020 Share Posted October 6, 2020 Xmad is the Ravens poster I was thinking of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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