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2021 NFL Draft Thread


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43 minutes ago, ovfd55 said:

@e16bball Is your 2nd group of QB big enough you think we'd be better to Pull a Bengals and draft a spot of need/BPA like they did with Green and take a QB that falls into 2nd like they did with Dalton? Or is there clear cut 3/4 ranked QBs for you?

For me, at the moment, I have Wilson and Lance ranked a good bit above Trask and Jones. In that order. 

I’m also just not a big believer in playing value games with QB. Every other position, I love that kind of stuff...recognizing positional depth and players’ comparative value to give the best combo of overall talent, and I even love trying to find ways to slide up and down the board to try to land in the best areas before a particular tier of talent drops off. I really wanted to find a way into the pick 45-50 range last season, for example, because that’s where I expected that 3rd tier of WR talent to drop off. 

But with QB, I think the position is just so much more important than anything else. I’m not willing to sacrifice the quality of the QB prospect for any reason, not even a big upgrade at a different position. I want the best guy I can get my hands on, because if you miss on the QB, not much else really matters in the grand scheme. 

In a practical sense, though, I’m really only considering my three top guys to be options for us. I don’t want Lance because I don’t believe we’ll develop him correctly, and I don’t want Trask or Jones because I just don’t think they’re special prospects. If Trask had at least an NFL-average arm, I’d probably be singing a different tune on him, but I just don’t think he does. So for me, if the draft was next week and we missed on Lawrence, Fields, and Wilson, I’d just look elsewhere (Sewell or Chase or Parsons or whoever ends up as LT2 or even my guy Devonta Smith) and keep building the offensive core and come back looking for a QB next year. 

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1 hour ago, e16bball said:

For me, at the moment, I have Wilson and Lance ranked a good bit above Trask and Jones. In that order. 

I’m also just not a big believer in playing value games with QB. Every other position, I love that kind of stuff...recognizing positional depth and players’ comparative value to give the best combo of overall talent, and I even love trying to find ways to slide up and down the board to try to land in the best areas before a particular tier of talent drops off. I really wanted to find a way into the pick 45-50 range last season, for example, because that’s where I expected that 3rd tier of WR talent to drop off. 

But with QB, I think the position is just so much more important than anything else. I’m not willing to sacrifice the quality of the QB prospect for any reason, not even a big upgrade at a different position. I want the best guy I can get my hands on, because if you miss on the QB, not much else really matters in the grand scheme. 

In a practical sense, though, I’m really only considering my three top guys to be options for us. I don’t want Lance because I don’t believe we’ll develop him correctly, and I don’t want Trask or Jones because I just don’t think they’re special prospects. If Trask had at least an NFL-average arm, I’d probably be singing a different tune on him, but I just don’t think he does. So for me, if the draft was next week and we missed on Lawrence, Fields, and Wilson, I’d just look elsewhere (Sewell or Chase or Parsons or whoever ends up as LT2 or even my guy Devonta Smith) and keep building the offensive core and come back looking for a QB next year. 

I agree with almost everything said here if you think a qb is/can be elite take him round one, just don't settle cause you have to have one if not sure.

I've had the same line of thinking on Lance this whole season til the last 2 weeks, If Alex is back and starts next year I'd e more okay with Lance cause I'd think it give him a good learning spot. Don't trust us to get it to work but I'd be more okay with it,then if we had Kyle Allen in front of him.

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1 hour ago, e16bball said:

For me, at the moment, I have Wilson and Lance ranked a good bit above Trask and Jones. In that order. 

I’m also just not a big believer in playing value games with QB. Every other position, I love that kind of stuff...recognizing positional depth and players’ comparative value to give the best combo of overall talent, and I even love trying to find ways to slide up and down the board to try to land in the best areas before a particular tier of talent drops off. I really wanted to find a way into the pick 45-50 range last season, for example, because that’s where I expected that 3rd tier of WR talent to drop off. 

But with QB, I think the position is just so much more important than anything else. I’m not willing to sacrifice the quality of the QB prospect for any reason, not even a big upgrade at a different position. I want the best guy I can get my hands on, because if you miss on the QB, not much else really matters in the grand scheme. 

In a practical sense, though, I’m really only considering my three top guys to be options for us. I don’t want Lance because I don’t believe we’ll develop him correctly, and I don’t want Trask or Jones because I just don’t think they’re special prospects. If Trask had at least an NFL-average arm, I’d probably be singing a different tune on him, but I just don’t think he does. So for me, if the draft was next week and we missed on Lawrence, Fields, and Wilson, I’d just look elsewhere (Sewell or Chase or Parsons or whoever ends up as LT2 or even my guy Devonta Smith) and keep building the offensive core and come back looking for a QB next year. 

Havent seen you touch on Jamie Newman yet. What do you think? And if there in the 3rd, would you take a shot?

Im not that high on him myself. But I think hed most likely turn out better than what we got in Haskins & Allen.

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2 hours ago, PARROTHEAD said:

Havent seen you touch on Jamie Newman yet. What do you think? And if there in the 3rd, would you take a shot?

Im not that high on him myself. But I think hed most likely turn out better than what we got in Haskins & Allen.

Jamie Newman is a guy that honestly, I just don’t see it with him. I never really have. 

As a passer, he’s always seemed really inconsistent to me. I’m not great with footwork and mechanics, but it looks iffy on a lot of these drops and he’s got this slingshot thing he does on the throwing motion a lot of times that I personally don’t like. Some sort of Philip Rivers or Cam Newton type deal. Anyway, he has the Haskins “high” miss in his bag and he also seems to struggle throwing it outside the numbers (always drifting out of bounds on him). Just doesn’t have nearly the accuracy and ball placement you see with these other guys. I feel like he’s totally locked in on his first read a lot of the time, and that causes him problems as well. Some really ill-advised throws. And I don’t think he’s even as good a runner as everyone seems to think he is — he’s a fine runner for a QB, but he’s not going to be any kind of game changer in the NFL with his legs. 

To me, he’s a guy who definitely looks the part and who had one of the best WRs going in Sage Surratt who helped him put up some numbers. And he poured it on against weaker squads that he could dominate with his talent (a la Drew Lock, as one example). But I’m not sure Wake isn’t a better passing team with Hartman in there this year — give him Surratt and he’s probably killing kids out there. Anyway, I feel like Newman’s definitely not an NFL ready QB, and I don’t see the big upside there either. Maybe that’s just me, but I don’t see it. For me, he’s a day 3 pick. Not really the early part of day 3 either. Among guys I’ve talked about tonight, I don’t think I’d hesitate to take Purdy over him, for one. 

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8 hours ago, PARROTHEAD said:

Havent seen you touch on Jamie Newman yet. What do you think? And if there in the 3rd, would you take a shot?

Im not that high on him myself. But I think hed most likely turn out better than what we got in Haskins & Allen.

Having spent months with Quincy Avery by the time the draft rolls around, I think he's definitely worth a shot.  Probably ends up being a third rounder.  Spending 7 months with Avery, then being coached up by Zampese and sitting behind Alex Smith for a year (assuming that actually takes place) and I think Newman could be worth it.  

Now, if we have a 1-3 pick?  We absolutely don't do it, but if we luck into the division, yes, it is something to consider.  

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42 minutes ago, naptownskinsfan said:

Having spent months with Quincy Avery by the time the draft rolls around, I think he's definitely worth a shot.  Probably ends up being a third rounder.  Spending 7 months with Avery, then being coached up by Zampese and sitting behind Alex Smith for a year (assuming that actually takes place) and I think Newman could be worth it.  

Now, if we have a 1-3 pick?  We absolutely don't do it, but if we luck into the division, yes, it is something to consider.  

Who’s Quincy Avery?

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12 hours ago, ovfd55 said:

@e16bball Is your 2nd group of QB big enough you think we'd be better to Pull a Bengals and draft a spot of need/BPA like they did with Green and take a QB that falls into 2nd like they did with Dalton? Or is there clear cut 3/4 ranked QBs for you?

I like that idea should we end up in the 3 to 10 range which is very likely. Im warming up to that. Getting one of those other needs and coming back with a good QB prospect to develop in round 2 behind Alex for another year or maybe 2 depending on how Alex continues to play.

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3 minutes ago, ARTMONK HOF said:

QB coach 

Is he like a independent QB coach? Like the guys who work with prospects and pro players in the offseason when they aren’t allowed to work with their team?  Just wondering what the guys claim to fame is, who’d he coach that became something special when he wasn’t before after his coaching?

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23 minutes ago, turtle28 said:

Is he like a independent QB coach? Like the guys who work with prospects and pro players in the offseason when they aren’t allowed to work with their team?  Just wondering what the guys claim to fame is, who’d he coach that became something special when he wasn’t before after his coaching?

Private QB Coach. Worked with Watson, Haskins, Jalen Hurts and Fields among others. I believe strictly with black QBs

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14 hours ago, e16bball said:

I think it’s the combo of limited mobility and fringy arm strength. It kind of puts a ceiling on what he can accomplish in today’s NFL game. 

That’s not to say you can’t succeed in the NFL without both legs and a big arm. But you’ve really got to be elite in all the other areas: accuracy, touch, intelligence, quick release, etc. And that’s an awful lot to ask of a young kid, to come in and immediately be at least above average in each of those areas. He’s got very solid accuracy and really impressive touch, but it’s a different kind of monster to immediately grasp a full passing scheme (including protections) in the NFL from a mental standpoint.

To me, he’s the kind of guy best served by going to a good team with an aging star QB coming back for one more ride. Whether that’s TB or NO or PIT or IND, I think that’s where he needs to be. It’s weird, because I also think that’s the best fit for someone like Lance, and they’re on absolute opposite ends of the spectrum as players — but to me, Trask is going to need an established team with quality talent around him AND some time to keep learning, because he’s going to need to be extremely prepared and outstanding in the mental game, given his physical shortcomings. As the heir apparent to a guy like Brees or Brady, in a very well established offensive system with good players to distribute the ball to, I think that’s his best shot to become a very good starter. 

Where is all this criticism about his "Arm" coming from? Have you watched much of Kyle Trask? I have not seen a throw that he cannot make at the next level. Curious what you are seeing that I am not.
 

The scouting profiles I am reading on-line seem to indicate that his arm is strong. 
 

https://walterfootball.com/scoutingreport2021ktrask.php

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12 minutes ago, Troublez said:

Where is all this criticism about his "Arm" coming from? Have you watched much of Kyle Trask? I have not seen a throw that he cannot make at the next level. Curious what you are seeing that I am not.
 

The scouting profiles I am reading on-line seem to indicate that his arm is strong. 
 

https://walterfootball.com/scoutingreport2021ktrask.php

He didnt have the velocity last season. From the SI article on him. He was throwing just with his arm. And spent a lot of time learning to put his body into throws. Which has him pushing the ball with more force down field.

My only concern with something like that. Is when the pressure is heavy. Will he resort back and float some ints. Thats where an arm thats naturally strong on its own is helpful.

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