Let's Talk About.. Derek Carr

[SteelKing728]

6 hours ago, El Ramster said:

100% and I’m taking Mr.Teddy..

2020 is wild. Whaaaaaat.

I like you now. Crap.

[NYRaider]

43 minutes ago, SteelKing728 said:

Derek Carr or Teddy Bridgewater. Go.

Give me Carr the guy that has thrown for 4,000+ yards in each of the previous two seasons with great WR's such as Hunter Renfrow, Zay Jones, Jordy Nelson, and Seth Roberts. 

Hats off to Teddy though he has been playing really well this season. Leading up to our game against them I told Raiders fans that they had a chance to be one of the most dynamic offenses in the league this season and got laughed at. Teddy's in a good spot with a collection of versatile weapons and Anderson/Moore is probably the most underrated WR duo in the league. 

[thebestever6]

It's weird I saw a bunch of stats since 2015 and Carr's up there or higher than a lot of universally respected QBs. Like Russ and Rodgers.

I just feel like whenever I watch Carr live I can tell when he's about to make a mistake like a fumble or pick. I swear happens all the time. Like when he fumbled against the pats I called something was coming the way before.

Idk if it's body language or the game moves too fast some stretches for him but it happens a lot when I watch him.

 

Rodgers, Mahomes, Wilson I can never predict it's like they have ice running through their veigns .

[raidersedge]

I think its awesome Carr and Bridgewater are playing well and the debate is still relevant.

[Soko]

Cant wait to cross reference this thread with the one from earlier talking about how bad Carr was.

[thebestever6]

Serious question if David Carr ended up being a Carson Palmer or Matt Ryan type of talent and had that success does Derek Carr get looked at dirrently? 

[ronjon1990]

3 hours ago, NYRaider said:

The crazy thing is that Carr had a career high in yards and y/a in 2018, set another career high in yards and y/a in 2019, and is on pace to set another career high in both categories this season. In 2016 when he was considered an MVP level QB his y/a was 7.0 while it was 7.3 in 2018, 7.9 in 2019, and 8.2 in 2020. Even when we had Cooper and Crabtree neither of those guys were an elite deep threat WR. Ruggs has as many 45+ yard receptions in 6 healthy quarters as Cooper had in 2016 and 2017 combined. 

The Cooper fanboys were the worst, weren't they?

The guy dropped everything and his body language/effort were almost always lacking. But because he came in with such high fanfare, his mere presence was enough for people to turn on Carr. 

Cooper was a lot like Jared Cook, imo. My biggest criticism of Cook is that he'll make a huge catch and then seem to take entire quarters off. I've never been a huge fan. Cook puts up stats, but I've just never been impressed with his overall effort. Cooper has the talent, but as I said, I often felt like he was just itching to get out of Oakland. 

Prior to Jacobs, Carr was about the only heart and soul we had, particularly on offense. Now, guys like Carr, Jacobs, and Waller all seem to love actually "being Raiders". It's a bit unquantifiable, but I think there's something to be said about guys who buy into a team and guys chasing paychecks. The Patriots have built their culture around it though, while teams constantly shelling out big FA money tend to flame out. 

I'll forever be a Carr fan, even if critical, based on his passion for the team alone. After years of being the team guys didn't want to go to, it's so refreshing. Like others have said, he'll probably always be a bit conservative, but I'm fine with that. How many of the superstar QBs have won Superbowls during monster years/career years? It's why I don't think a mega star 40td, 5000 yd guy is necessary to get there. 

Mahomes, Brady, Foles, Manning, and Flacco are the last 5 SB QBs. Despite the name recognition of Mahomes, Brady, and Manning as superstar QBs, only one of the combined 6 SBs came during a megastar season (Manning, 2014). So when people say "Carr can't win a SB", I have no choice but to laugh loudly.

[BayRaider]

1 hour ago, thebestever6 said:

Serious question if David Carr ended up being a Carson Palmer or Matt Ryan type of talent and had that success does Derek Carr get looked at dirrently? 

I feel Carr mentally checks out certain games, or even certain plays, like he’s just not there. That’s why I’m hoping he does this performance all 16 games. I mean he can have a bad game but he needs to be way more consistent. 

[kramxel]

Talk about an overreaction thread!

2 weeks ago he was widely considered the checkdown king, after BB double covered his checkdown on a lot of plays. Now all of a sudden, everyone goes 180 and he's a top QB... Hilarious! 

His major issue is that he doesn't take opportunities down the field. 

Against a Chiefs' secondary that blew all the coverages, and just had an horrendous level of safety play he had guys running wide open and took advantage of it (good for him, showing he does have the vision), but I doubt they'll get the same gaping oportunities again. 

Will he throw those deep shots when there's actually someone covering? 

The answer to that question, for the majority of his career, has been NO, and until he starts doing it consistently, I can't rate him above what he has shown through the years: the checkdown king. 

 

[Darbsk]

11 hours ago, thebestever6 said:

Serious question if David Carr ended up being a Carson Palmer or Matt Ryan type of talent and had that success does Derek Carr get looked at dirrently? 

Definitely, and he gets taken in the first round of that 2014 draft by somebody too! It changes everything.

[Darbsk]

3 minutes ago, kramxel said:

Talk about an overreaction thread!

2 weeks ago he was widely considered the checkdown king, after BB double covered his checkdown on a lot of plays. Now all of a sudden, everyone goes 180 and he's a top QB... Hilarious!

Did you actually see the New England game though?

Carr was playing without Trent Brown and Richie Incognito, two great players on the OL and also without his #1, #2 and #3 receivers who were all injured. Williams on IR, Ruggs with a hamstring and Edwards with an ankle. So he's on his #4, 5 and 6 receivers and Belichick tries to take away the best target in TE Darren Waller which makes total sense. Waller was hardly the 'checkdown' option, more like head and shoulders our best receiver.

Context is everything.

[Hunter2_1]

17 hours ago, RaidersAreOne said:

Starting to get some more attention, especially after taking down the Chiefs.

Not bad for a 'check down king'

[kramxel]

1 hour ago, Darbsk said:

Did you actually see the New England game though?

Carr was playing without Trent Brown and Richie Incognito, two great players on the OL and also without his #1, #2 and #3 receivers who were all injured. Williams on IR, Ruggs with a hamstring and Edwards with an ankle. So he's on his #4, 5 and 6 receivers and Belichick tries to take away the best target in TE Darren Waller which makes total sense. Waller was hardly the 'checkdown' option, more like head and shoulders our best receiver.

Context is everything.

"Context is everything" after ignoring the half of my post that established said context. 

This isn't about 1 game, Carr has been in the league for years, with a large sample size to evaluate him. Not just a string of good games to start a season. 

He's earned that label for a reason. 

 

[Darbsk]

16 minutes ago, kramxel said:

"Context is everything" after ignoring the half of my post that established said context. 

This isn't about 1 game, Carr has been in the league for years, with a large sample size to evaluate him. Not just a string of good games to start a season. 

He's earned that label for a reason. 

 

You were the one that specifically referenced that game and Belichick taking away his 'checkdown'. It was a really ill informed post.

That was just your one example, who were his receivers last year? Should he have been dropping bombs to Marcell Ateman and Keelan Doss? How would you have attacked defences given the best wide receiver you had was Hunter Renfrow?

What about the year he had two rookie tackles in way over their heads and was running for his life? Should he gave taken a 5 step drop and gone to Jordy Nelson deep? Or how about Seth Roberts?

As I said, context is everything, the three years he's had a reasonable supporting cast he's gone to the Pro Bowl and played well (apart from when he injured his back). Is he conservative by nature? Yes. Does he need to attack deep more? Probably he does now he has the tools, but he can only work with what he's given too. 

[ronjon1990]

2 hours ago, Darbsk said:

You were the one that specifically referenced that game and Belichick taking away his 'checkdown'. It was a really ill informed post.

That was just your one example, who were his receivers last year? Should he have been dropping bombs to Marcell Ateman and Keelan Doss? How would you have attacked defences given the best wide receiver you had was Hunter Renfrow?

What about the year he had two rookie tackles in way over their heads and was running for his life? Should he gave taken a 5 step drop and gone to Jordy Nelson deep? Or how about Seth Roberts?

As I said, context is everything, the three years he's had a reasonable supporting cast he's gone to the Pro Bowl and played well (apart from when he injured his back). Is he conservative by nature? Yes. Does he need to attack deep more? Probably he does now he has the tools, but he can only work with what he's given too. 

Bro, we had Dwayne Harris at times too. Don't forget that HOF'er!

Clearly if Carr was a decent QB, he would have elevated Issac Whitney, Johnny Holton, Keelan Doss, and Marcell Ateman to HOF status.

Good QBs elevate their teammates.

Who are Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne, Randy Moss, Tyreek Hill, Travis Kelce, Mike Evans, Keenan Allen, Mike Williams, AJ Green, TJ Houshmanzedah, Chad Johnson, Juliio Jones, Davante Adams, Roddy White, Robert Woods, Cooper Kupp, Torry Holt, Issac Bruce, Larry Fitzgerald, Anquan Boldin, etc? Scrubs! Scrubs I tell you. 

Manning, Brady, Mahomes, Rivers, Dalton, Palmer, Ryan, Rodgers, Goff, Warner....those are real QBs. They made their WRs great. If Carr.can't do that with MARCEL ATEMAN AND ZAY JONES, he's a scrub.