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MikeT14

Charles working out at LG (update: he’s starting today)

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22 minutes ago, MikeT14 said:

 

 

I'd take anyone over Wes M. at this point. 

 

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He is a development pick and we are practicing him out of position.  Not sure that is such a good idea if we want him to succeed at LT.

Or maybe this means they actually think Christian is the future at LT?  

 

 

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14 minutes ago, offbyone said:

He is a development pick and we are practicing him out of position.  Not sure that is such a good idea if we want him to succeed at LT.

Or maybe this means they actually think Christian is the future at LT?  

You raise a fair point, but I’m okay with starting him out at LG. I don’t think he’s ready to be trusted at LT, and I think they’re pretty aware of that, but I want to see him on the field being challenged with NFL level power and explosion to see how he’s able to hold up.

We’ve made the comparison to another former LSU blocker in La’el Collins — not in play type necessarily, but perhaps in terms of readiness — and I could see Charles potentially taking a similar path to Collins, who started out at RG before kicking out to RT. In an ideal world, that’s where I’d see Charles: an athletic, quality pass protector at RT across the way from a stalwart LT. He would be a real asset in that role.

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1 hour ago, e16bball said:

You raise a fair point, but I’m okay with starting him out at LG. I don’t think he’s ready to be trusted at LT, and I think they’re pretty aware of that, but I want to see him on the field being challenged with NFL level power and explosion to see how he’s able to hold up.

We’ve made the comparison to another former LSU blocker in La’el Collins — not in play type necessarily, but perhaps in terms of readiness — and I could see Charles potentially taking a similar path to Collins, who started out at RG before kicking out to RT. In an ideal world, that’s where I’d see Charles: an athletic, quality pass protector at RT across the way from a stalwart LT. He would be a real asset in that role.

I have no problem if we want him at LG long term to play him there.  I also understand wanting to get him on field, I just don't think this is a good plan if we want him at Tackle long term.

Collins was a mauler coming out of college.  I thought he was a perfect fit at guard.  He was great at guard and maybe it is the injuries but less so when he transitioned to tackle.  Maybe Charles grows to the La'el level level, but he wasn't there coming out of college.  

I also think the line is very side oriented.  If we want him on the right side then we need to play him on the right side.  LG -> RT is a huge difference.  I think transitioning LG->LT is a lot easier.  

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There are worse things than possibly finding your future LG with a 3rd round pick 🤷‍♂️

 

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3 minutes ago, offbyone said:

I have no problem if we want him at LG long term to play him there.  I also understand wanting to get him on field, I just don't think this is a good plan if we want him at Tackle long term.

Collins was a mauler coming out of college.  I thought he was a perfect fit at guard.  He was great at guard and maybe it is the injuries but less so when he transitioned to tackle.  Maybe Charles grows to the La'el level level, but he wasn't there coming out of college.  

I also think the line is very side oriented.  If we want him on the right side then we need to play him on the right side.  LG -> RT is a huge difference.  I think transitioning LG->LT is a lot easier.  

Very good points, I can’t really argue with you strenuously on any of it.

He’s definitely not the same type of player as La’el Collins, certainly not as natural a fit as a traditional OG. This offensive staff is definitely looking for more athletic play from its interior linemen — perhaps they feel he fits their desired mold for an OG, even if he’s not really that traditional OG archetype that we think of? Best I can come up with on that front, though I will say that he has comparatively short arms and there are those who think that will force him inside.

I read some comments from former NFL OLs at the time of the draft (and shortly thereafter) about the process of switching guys from one side of the line to the other, in the context of determining how hard it would be for guys like Wills (right to left) and Thomas (expected left to right, although that issue went by the wayside when Solder opted out) to make the switch. It seemed to be the consensus that it is a process to make the change, but that process usually takes a few weeks or maybe a month or two. I would think we could try to get Charles on the field now, and then (hopefully successfully) transition him to the right side if/when we add a true LT in March or April. 

But mostly, I just selfishly want the chance to finally watch him play 😂

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2 hours ago, offbyone said:

He is a development pick and we are practicing him out of position.  Not sure that is such a good idea if we want him to succeed at LT.

Or maybe this means they actually think Christian is the future at LT?  

 

 

His size has always made me think he would be better at Guard in the NFL than Tackle.  Just take this article for example:

https://www.boltsfromtheblue.com/2020/2/25/21152524/chargers-nfl-combine-draft-2020-wirfs-wills-thomas-becton-jones-bartch 

"For some of the top tackles, there are a few numbers that are kept in mind during these measurement. When it comes to height, scouts want to see guys over 6-foot-4. For weight, over 300 pounds is a solid benchmark, But one of the most polarizing measurements that will turn some scouts off immediately about a potential prospect is their arm length. Scouts have a loose threshold of 34” when it comes to tackles and if they don’t reach this thread, you start hearing murmurings about that player moving inside to guard afterwards."

I tend to agree with the article as far as minimum size requirements for a Tackle.  Here was Charles' measurements at the combine:

https://nflcombineresults.com/playerpage.php?i=30050 

He was 6'4" with 33" arms.  That is Guard size.  

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1 hour ago, MKnight82 said:

His size has always made me think he would be better at Guard in the NFL than Tackle.  Just take this article for example:

https://www.boltsfromtheblue.com/2020/2/25/21152524/chargers-nfl-combine-draft-2020-wirfs-wills-thomas-becton-jones-bartch 

"For some of the top tackles, there are a few numbers that are kept in mind during these measurement. When it comes to height, scouts want to see guys over 6-foot-4. For weight, over 300 pounds is a solid benchmark, But one of the most polarizing measurements that will turn some scouts off immediately about a potential prospect is their arm length. Scouts have a loose threshold of 34” when it comes to tackles and if they don’t reach this thread, you start hearing murmurings about that player moving inside to guard afterwards."

I tend to agree with the article as far as minimum size requirements for a Tackle.  Here was Charles' measurements at the combine:

https://nflcombineresults.com/playerpage.php?i=30050 

He was 6'4" with 33" arms.  That is Guard size.  

Hey we need, LT, LG, C, RG and probably RT in another year.  So we got room for him.  For a prospect like this who is still raw, I just think they need to pick a position from the start and stick with it.  But it would be fun to at least see him on field like @e16bball says.

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They had to do something. Martin is god awful and they know it. It sucks too because it looked like a bad pick at the time and that seems to be the case. 

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I believe Charles’ arm length was one of his biggest knocks coming out. Him playing guard is just fine with me. I’m just looking forward to see what he can do. 

Edited by ARTMONK HOF
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17 hours ago, MikeT14 said:

There are worse things than possibly finding your future LG with a 3rd round pick 🤷‍♂️

 

4th round - even gooder . 

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11 hours ago, ARTMONK HOF said:

I believe Charles’ arm length was one of his biggest knocks coming out. Him playing guard is just fine with me. I’m just looking forward to see what he can do. 

That might have been a knock. But it was the 3 suspensions that dropped him down the boards.

3 year starter at LT in the SEC. He wont be raw like some might be expecting. Even with the switch. Actually think he will be better for it. Having his job right in front not at the end leaving him back peddling/side stepping every other play will be in his favor more. Not expecting a much different rookie season than we saw out of Scherff.

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We need some luck. It would be nice if we found our starting left guard for the near and distant future!

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17 hours ago, offbyone said:

Hey we need, LT, LG, C, RG and probably RT in another year.  So we got room for him.  For a prospect like this who is still raw, I just think they need to pick a position from the start and stick with it.  But it would be fun to at least see him on field like @e16bball says.


Let’s be honest, we WANT a new LT, LG, C and RG but I don’t think it happens that we have 4 new starters next year. We have OLinemen on the left side that are developing and they’re not where they need to be yet. 
 

From what I remember they were working Charles at both LG & LT before he injured his thigh in August. Also, as far as him being a mauler or not, it’s not as big of a deal because we are running a zone blocking scheme now - which is one reason why our run game hasn’t been consistent - these guys are still gelling and learning the ZBS.

I say put Charles in at LG, let’s see what he has, it can’t be worse than Martin and Charles has more upside and natural talent. Martin has been our worst OL by far. Roullier is serviceable at C and we drafted what may be his future replacement in Israel at C, Wes S has also been serviceable and Moses has been good. 
 

I think we have issues with our OL in this new scheme and with what’s been 3 new starters the first month of the season after Scherff went down. We should put that all in perspective, these guys should get better as the season goes on, not worse IMO.

Edited by turtle28

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