Nagy needs to hand over play-calling duties.

[Nads786]

Mike Tice spoke about this during the Jwebb days. He said he couldn’t figure out what plays for even call because of how inconsistent Webb was.

I think the OL is a huge problem, however, this offense seems just too complicated for most teams to run.

Everyone loves Reid but his offenses in Philly were way too pass heavy and challenging to execute.

I think we also have to acknowledge the NFL is more like the NBA then people want to admit. How good does Bellick look right now with a bad QB?

if you don’t have a good QB none of this matters. 

 

 

[Epyon]

12 hours ago, WindyCity said:

This is accurate. You can’t get any rhythm because they don’t block 3 plays in a row well.

I'm not sure they block 3 PEOPLE in a row well, on any given play.

I'd add it's not just the OL either.... our WRs and TEs are doing a piss poor job blocking on the perimeter as well, when we try doing those outside runs, jet sweeps, and receiver screens.

Mooney might be the only person on this entire offensive unit worth keeping right now, and much of that is on hope for the future..... Cohen and Monty I'll give the benefit of the doubt on account of the line being so impressively terrible, but I wouldn't say I'm exactly satisfied with either.  Robinson is our possession receiver, and he's given up multiple tds and turnovers not winning contested balls, also is part of the problem with the blocking, and costs more than he's (imo) worth..... and there honestly isn't another person on the offense I'm happy with.... Daniels and Whitehair are easily the next best two, but from what I've seen this year that isn't a good thing for them, as much as an indictment of everyone else around them being worse. They've been "acceptable" at best.

[Epyon]

3 hours ago, Nads786 said:

I think we also have to acknowledge the NFL is more like the NBA then people want to admit. How good does Bellick look right now with a bad QB?

if you don’t have a good QB none of this matters. 

And a great QB can mask so many other deficiencies. God knows the Packers have fielded a bottom 5 overall ROSTER enough times, and still been playoff contenders despite that.

[JAF-N72EX]

5 hours ago, Nads786 said:

Mike Tice spoke about this during the Jwebb days. He said he couldn’t figure out what plays for even call because of how inconsistent Webb was.

I think the OL is a huge problem, however, this offense seems just too complicated for most teams to run.

Everyone loves Reid but his offenses in Philly were way too pass heavy and challenging to execute.

I think we also have to acknowledge the NFL is more like the NBA then people want to admit. How good does Bellick look right now with a bad QB?

if you don’t have a good QB none of this matters. 

Some people will continue to blame the OL and ignore the plays when the OL does their job only for the QB to make a bad decision. 

[JAF-N72EX]

1 hour ago, Epyon said:

And a great QB can mask so many other deficiencies. God knows the Packers have fielded a bottom 5 overall ROSTER enough times, and still been playoff contenders despite that.

I get what you're saying and I agree, but the Packers are not a good example. They have a had a top OL for the last 10+ years. If they had a real defense, they would've won more SB's with Rodgers.

[gopackgo972]

AJ Green had a pro bowl season in 2017 with Lazor as OC. Let’s see if he can get Allen Robinson going again. 

[Heinz D.]

On 11/14/2020 at 7:11 PM, Nads786 said:

I think the OL is a huge problem, however, this offense seems just too complicated for most teams to run.

Daniels being out for the year, then Pace deciding not to make a move to try to begin to compensate for that means that the OL will be dragging this team down even further than expected for the rest of the year. 

And while I agree that it does appear that the offense is structurally unsound in some ways, it's clear to me that the play calling is far worse than the overall design. And I've harped on that, fairly regularly, for three seasons now. Most of us have wanted Nagy to hand over play-calling duties for some time. Well, it's happened now, and that indicates there is real panic in staff and management. It's nice they've decided to live in the real world (at least partially) with the rest of us. Lazor calling the plays will almost certainly be a boost for the offense. I think most of the members on this forum would be an improvement over Nagy (at times, anyway). Now, it just remains to be seen if that improvement can compensate, somewhat, for Pace's horrible mismanagement of the roster...

[Bigbear72]

11 hours ago, Heinz D. said:

Daniels being out for the year, then Pace deciding not to make a move to try to begin to compensate for that means that the OL will be dragging this team down even further than expected for the rest of the year. 

And while I agree that it does appear that the offense is structurally unsound in some ways, it's clear to me that the play calling is far worse than the overall design. And I've harped on that, fairly regularly, for three seasons now. Most of us have wanted Nagy to hand over play-calling duties for some time. Well, it's happened now, and that indicates there is real panic in staff and management. It's nice they've decided to live in the real world (at least partially) with the rest of us. Lazor calling the plays will almost certainly be a boost for the offense. I think most of the members on this forum would be an improvement over Nagy (at times, anyway). Now, it just remains to be seen if that improvement can compensate, somewhat, for Pace's horrible mismanagement of the roster...

Well...that didn't take long.  The Bears never disappoint me offensively in being disappointing.

Edited November 17, 2020 by Bigbear72

[dll2000]

Stop listening to reporters analysis.   Play callers matter little.

Same mentality that gives you nerdy kid or man designing plays in football movies and saving day.   Its a Hollywood level understanding of a topic.  You get it if a movie or massive reporting has ever been made or done of something you are an expert in.   If you really know something and you see they get it totally wrong, what makes you think they are right when they talk about stuff you don’t know as well?  I digress - just why I am skeptical of everything and anything - especially media narratives on anything.   

There are maybe like 4 truly innovative people in all of football at any one time, everyone else quickly copies them.   Good reason for it, because losing gets you fired and experimentation fails like 10x for every time it succeeds.

Innovative people are crazy and don’t care.   They try things just because.  Mike Leech is best modern example.  

 

 

[JAF-N72EX]

20 hours ago, dll2000 said:

Play callers matter little.

I STRONGLY disagree. Play calling can mean the difference between winning and losing. No matter how you try to spin it.  

[dll2000]

2 hours ago, JAF-N72EX said:

I STRONGLY disagree. Play calling can mean the difference between winning and losing. No matter how you try to spin it.  

Everything can mean difference between winning and losing.

1 missed block or tackle and on and on.  It all matters. 

But big picture, games are usually won and lost before they are played.  

[Heinz D.]

On 11/18/2020 at 6:18 AM, dll2000 said:

Everything can mean difference between winning and losing.

1 missed block or tackle and on and on.  It all matters. 

But big picture, games are usually won and lost before they are played.  

You are intentionally ignoring how completely inept that Nagy's play calling can be, at times. 

Going for a touchdown pass on 3rd and 2 at the 28? 

I mean, c'mon...

[topwop1]

On 11/18/2020 at 4:25 AM, JAF-N72EX said:

I STRONGLY disagree. Play calling can mean the difference between winning and losing. No matter how you try to spin it.  

For anyone who follows him on Twitter, NFL analyst Warren Sharp had some interesting comments to say about the Bears offense on a podcast he did recently. He basically compared it to a chef overcooking a steak again after you sent the first one back to get re-cooked because the first chef also over cooked it.

He said it's absolutely a play calling issue when it comes to this team even though he acknowledges Bears don't have the best OL. 

He mentioned how Bears have a lot of success running out of 12 personnel yet they rarely ever do so for some odd reason despite having numerous tight ends on the team. Says they run too many 3+ WR sets which is killing the offense and making them too predictable.

Also goes on to say that it's such an obvious fix that it frustrates him to see it continue happening game after game after game and that the team is capable of putting out a way better product on offense then they have showed.

Whoever the next GM/HC combo of this team is I hope they will hire guys that believe in taking an analytical approach to this game because it appears these guys don't know what they're doing.

[Sugashane]

3 hours ago, topwop1 said:

Whoever the next GM/HC combo of this team is I hope they will hire guys that believe in taking an analytical approach to this game because it appears these guys don't know what they're doing.

While I believe a lot of coaching is based on gut feeling this hits hard for me. There is so much data to take advantage of and he has a monster budget to work with. Why not take advantage of every aspect to improve? 

In another thread I just made a crack at his I-formation comment, but really it is a serious issue. A good offensive mind will adapt his gameplan around his teams strengths. If you have Lamar Jackson will you suddenly try to go with a complex NE system? Or take Brady and Brees and put them in the BAL system? Hell no. Either get a system installed and keep plugging players in that fit it, or adjust the system to fit the player strengths. 

Analytics are an aid that - if done properly- ignores a LOT of bias to give you evidence. Dont rely on it 100% but at least use it to help. 

[Nads786]

9 hours ago, Sugashane said:

While I believe a lot of coaching is based on gut feeling this hits hard for me. There is so much data to take advantage of and he has a monster budget to work with. Why not take advantage of every aspect to improve? 

In another thread I just made a crack at his I-formation comment, but really it is a serious issue. A good offensive mind will adapt his gameplan around his teams strengths. If you have Lamar Jackson will you suddenly try to go with a complex NE system? Or take Brady and Brees and put them in the BAL system? Hell no. Either get a system installed and keep plugging players in that fit it, or adjust the system to fit the player strengths. 

Analytics are an aid that - if done properly- ignores a LOT of bias to give you evidence. Dont rely on it 100% but at least use it to help. 

I don't think you need analytics to know Lamar Jackson would not be a good fit for NE's scheme. This lack of common sense is what's Nagy's problem. I keep seeing us run out of shotgun formation even though we almost always have zero sucess.

This team was much better offensively under center with a good PA game.