Official 2021 QB Thread

[RedandPewterReturns]

3 hours ago, jrry32 said:

I see Zach Wilson as like Russell Wilson. Yeah, he'll leave some plays on the field, but his innate sense for where his guys are while improvising and ability to get the ball to them basically anywhere on the field makes him special. And he is plenty of capable of playing within the structure of an offense too, which is what separates him from some of the improvisers who have failed over the years.

I wouldn't compare him to Russ just yet. To me i think he's more in the Cutler/Baker Mayfield mold. He'll miss the easy read and think he can make the wow throw in double coverage every time instead of taking what the defense gives him. His athleticism is overrated a bit too. He's not as athletic as Russ either nor as accurate. He throws a lot of balls to open receives that are equivalent to jump balls. 

I really think GMs are over thinking Fields. He's easily #2 in this class. Wilson and Lance are boom or bust  but i have Lance at 3 over Wilson. I have Mond over Jones too. Lance atleast takes care of the rock and can make quick decisions and find the open read. Wilson struggles at this. I also think Lance is more coachable and will boom at the next level. I think Wilson is going to flop big time. 

I think the QBs from this draft that will have starting success long term are Lawrence, Fields, Lance, and Mond. 

Mac Jones will be a back up. He may have an Andy Dalton esque career pending where he lands and what the team around him is. The niners are crazy thinking he's an update over Jimmy G. Jimmy G just isn't healthy consistently so I get why they want to move on from him bc he's been sidelined 2 of the last 3 years. 

Wilson to me may have the Darnold like career come year 4.  "do we hang on to him or move on in the draft or sign competition to push him? I'd feel more comfortable drafting Wilson with a Vet in place not having to rush him. Wilson going to the Jets is scary for his development bc I think so many scouts and analysts fall in love with his arm talent but are missing the key components to playing QB. I purely believe Mahomes landing in KC and learning from a QB like Smith who couldn't make the throws and had to rely on timing and anticipation really helped Mahomes develop the mental aspect of his game. 

[showtime]

I'm big on Justin Fields. I have him as the second QB on my draft board. I think if Fields got drafted to a team like the Niners he'll actually have a better career than Trevor Lawrence.

Speaking of QB's and I mean no offense here, but I sure as hell wouldn't want to get drafted by the Jets. Maybe I'm way off base here, but they just seem like they seriously lack talent on offense. I like their head coach, but he was a defensive coordinator. Just doesn't seem like a team I would want to get drafted by if I was a QB.

[jrry32]

8 minutes ago, RedandPewterReturns said:

I wouldn't compare him to Russ just yet. To me i think he's more in the Cutler/Baker Mayfield mold. He'll miss the easy read and think he can make the wow throw in double coverage every time instead of taking what the defense gives him. His athleticism is overrated a bit too. He's not as athletic as Russ either nor as accurate. He throws a lot of balls to open receives that are equivalent to jump balls. 

I couldn't disagree more. He had very few bad decisions this year and showed strong accuracy. He also made plenty of "wow" throws into tight windows. He's a gamer. I'd want him on my team. I think the Jets have a bright future ahead of them with him. Great instincts. Great arm talent. Above average athlete.

I also don't know what you're seeing with Mond. If you want to talk a QB who makes the game look much harder than it is, he's the guy. He spends 10% to 25% of his snaps in most games looking like he has no idea how to play the position. Kid just doesn't look natural, despite the fact that he's a four-year starter.

[ClutchDJ]

Give me Mond over Trask.

Edited April 27, 2021 by ClutchDJ

[CWood21]

35 minutes ago, RedandPewterReturns said:

I really think GMs are over thinking Fields. He's easily #2 in this class. Wilson and Lance are boom or bust  but i have Lance at 3 over Wilson. I have Mond over Jones too. Lance atleast takes care of the rock and can make quick decisions and find the open read. Wilson struggles at this. I also think Lance is more coachable and will boom at the next level. I think Wilson is going to flop big time

They're really not.  He's a good prospect, but he's clearly a tier (if not two) below Trevor Lawrence.  And I think you could argue he's clearly behind Zach Wilson as well.

[Forge]

4 hours ago, jrry32 said:

Hard to argue with that.

I'll hear no slander of QB1

[jrry32]

23 minutes ago, ClutchDJ said:

Give me Mond over Trask.

I'll take Trask. You might be able to convince yourself that Mond has more upside, but I'm taking a guy who is good at playing QB, even if he has physical limitations.

[jrry32]

FWIW, these are my rankings and where I'd take each QB (I might have already posted this):

1. Trevor Lawrence - #1 overall

2. Zach Wilson - #2 overall

3. Justin Fields - Top 10

4. Trey Lance - Top 20 

5. Mac Jones - Top 50

6. Davis Mills - Round 3

7. Kyle Trask - Round 3

8. Kellen Mond - Round 4/5

9. Ian Book - Round 7

10. Sam Ehlinger - Round 7

Lawrence is Andrew Luck/Peyton Manning/John Elway tier as a prospect. He's not flawless, but he has it all and seems like a safe bet. Wilson is more risky, but I love his instincts, arm talent, and mentality. He reminds me of Russell Wilson and Aaron Rodgers in the way he plays the game. Yes, I know those are lofty comparisons.

Fields has A+ talent, but he's a slow processor. That might improve with experience, or it might not. Lance is a boom/bust guy for me. I acknowledge the potential, but he has too many questions for the limited evaluation I can do. Jones is a tough evaluation because of the talent and system. I think he's a mediocre talent, so it'll be paramount for him to end up in basically the perfect spot.

Mills has a starting QB's skillset, but he's inexperienced and injury prone. Sam Bradford is the comparison that jumps to mind for me. Kyle Trask has physical limitations, but he has the instincts, football IQ, and intangibles to be a high-end backup to decent starter. At the high end of the range, think Matt Schaub. But I think he'll more likely pan out like Nick Foles.

I'm not high on the others. Mond has all the physical ability, but he's not a natural. Accuracy comes and goes. Reads come and go. Even the running isn't what you'd expect it to be considering his physical gifts. Book and Ehlinger are backups who can give you a spot start if desperate. Ehlinger reminds me of Jeff Driskel. Big dude, athletic, and solid arm, but he isn't a good thrower. Book is an improvisor who struggles to play within structure.

Edited April 28, 2021 by jrry32

[roger murdock]

I really like Trevor Lawrence and would pick him #1 overall. However...

Aren't we getting a little ahead of ourselves with the hype? 

He has all the tools, he's athletic, he's accurate, he makes pretty good decisions on the football field, he has the arm and the size and the production, etc... I get it. I understand why he's so hyped.

However, did anyone ever watch him in college and think 'This is one of the best college football players I've ever seen'? Cause I sure as hell didn't. To me he always seemed someone who was 80% of the sum of their parts rather than someone who made the best of their natural abilities. This is a sport where Tom Brady and Peyton Manning took way more marginal physical tools to the absolute pinnacle of the profession. This is a sport, and particularly a position, where the most cerebral and natural players thrive rather than the toolsiest. I dont think he showed significant growth at Clemson and with the exception of that game vs Alabama as a Freshmen I never watched him and felt blown away by how well he was playing. He was just a very good albiet forgettable CFB quarterback to me. I'd bet on the field against him in terms of which QB will have the best career from this class. 

Like I'm taking him #1 feeling extremely confident he can be a playoff quality QB. Do people expect him to be an all time great/MVP/HoF type player? 

[jrry32]

2 minutes ago, roger murdock said:

I really like Trevor Lawrence and would pick him #1 overall. However...

Aren't we getting a little ahead of ourselves with the hype? 

He has all the tools, he's athletic, he's accurate, he makes pretty good decisions on the football field, he has the arm and the size and the production, etc... I get it. I understand why he's so hyped.

However, did anyone ever watch him in college and think 'This is one of the best college football players I've ever seen'? Cause I sure as hell didn't. To me he always seemed someone who was 80% of the sum of their parts rather than someone who made the best of their natural abilities. This is a sport where Tom Brady and Peyton Manning took way more marginal physical tools to the absolute pinnacle of the profession. This is a sport, and particularly a position, where the most cerebral and natural players thrive rather than the toolsiest. I dont think he showed significant growth at Clemson and with the exception of that game vs Alabama as a Freshmen I never watched him and felt blown away by how well he was playing. He was just a very good albiet forgettable CFB quarterback to me. I'd bet on the field against him in terms of which QB will have the best career from this class. 

Like I'm taking him #1 feeling extremely confident he can be a playoff quality QB. Do people expect him to be an all time great/MVP/HoF type player? 

I felt he was every bit as good as Andrew Luck in college. No, I didn't think he was one of the best CFB players ever, but that doesn't necessarily mean anything. It's about how a guy's game translates to the NFL. Cam Newton was arguably the best college player I've ever seen. He was an average to above average QB outside of his MVP season. And nobody considered him one of the GOAT prospects. 

[roger murdock]

2 minutes ago, jrry32 said:

I felt he was every bit as good as Andrew Luck in college. No, I didn't think he was one of the best CFB players ever, but that doesn't necessarily mean anything. It's about how a guy's game translates to the NFL. Cam Newton was arguably the best college player I've ever seen. He was an average to above average QB outside of his MVP season. And nobody considered him one of the GOAT prospects. 

I agree with what you wrote in spirit (disagree on him being as good as Luck). 

My main issue is how it translates to the NFL. I'm curious if we view him as this amazing prospect because hes tall and athletic with a good arm who checks every box, or if we view him as this amazing prospect because he's got this unbelievable feel for the game. Because to me, I don't see this natural feel and I do think that will translate to the pros, and negatively. 

Andrew Lucks brain was incredible, the way he ran an offense, could do a hurry up, audible at the line etc. It was Manningesque. Mayfield played with so much poise, quick decision making, swag, accuracy etc. Those two jumped out to me as guys who I couldn't see not becoming stars. 

Lawrence just seems like the complete physical profile with less warts than most guys who have all the tools. 

[jrry32]

1 minute ago, roger murdock said:

I agree with what you wrote in spirit (disagree on him being as good as Luck). 

My main issue is how it translates to the NFL. I'm curious if we view him as this amazing prospect because hes tall and athletic with a good arm who checks every box, or if we view him as this amazing prospect because he's got this unbelievable feel for the game. Because to me, I don't see this natural feel and I do think that will translate to the pros, and negatively. 

Andrew Lucks brain was incredible, the way he ran an offense, could do a hurry up, audible at the line etc. It was Manningesque. Mayfield played with so much poise, quick decision making, swag, accuracy etc. Those two jumped out to me as guys who I couldn't see not becoming stars. 

Lawrence just seems like the complete physical profile with less warts than most guys who have all the tools. 

All of the above. Great tools and a great feel for the game. Watching the way he wrecked Bama as a true freshman, it proved to me how much of a natural he is.

[DoleINGout]

 

[Forge]

25 minutes ago, DoleINGout said:

 

Lol

[RandyMossIsBoss]

What does anyone see in Mac Jones? Has he given reason to believe he possesses elite processing speed or something? That's about the only attribute I could imagine him having that would warrant 1st round, let alone #3, talk (not that I see it, granted that is pretty hard to judge). He's clearly decisive and gets it out quick, but I mean he was also throwing to 1st round WRs behind one of CFB's best OLs. 

In an age of mobile QBs, he is a true statue. That alone is terrifying. Brady is just about the only statue left, and his all time great pocket presence (and excellent OLs) allows him to get away with it. His arm is below average, which right off the bat limits his ceiling.