DingoLadd Posted October 7, 2017 Share Posted October 7, 2017 Obviously I'd like to avoid the "Cam newton is this" nonsense and just want to talk about him as an actual player. When Cam is at his best, he's a 15-1 MVP Caliber QB. At his worst he can barely complete 50% of his passes and struggles to make plays outside of runs. I think he's somewhere between the 8th best QB and the 14th best personally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas5737 Posted October 7, 2017 Share Posted October 7, 2017 Yeah it depends on the year. Sometimes (well, once) he played like a top 5 QB and sometimes (last year) he played like a bottom 10 QB. Usually he is probably around a middle of the pack QB as a passer but gets bonus points as a RB. Overall he probably settles in around 12 or so in value. Great homerun threat and can keep drives alive with his feet but just not as consistent as the top 10 QBs in a normal year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwibrown Posted October 7, 2017 Share Posted October 7, 2017 I think he has given positive return on investment with the number 1 overall pick. winning seasons, MVP, Super Bowl appearances, positive leadership at times, face of the franchise. a lot of positive traits there. He is a hard QB to judge though, below average passer but can hit the big play. best running QB since vick. Very inconsistent, so I would put him 15-16. His best is top 5. I think he does give his team boost, a guy that makes players around him better. So I think he is worth more to a team than numbers alone. The opposite of TO, who had amazing numbers but was cancerous to the teams he was on after a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iamcanadian Posted October 7, 2017 Share Posted October 7, 2017 5 hours ago, Thomas5737 said: Yeah it depends on the year. Sometimes (well, once) he played like a top 5 QB and sometimes (last year) he played like a bottom 10 QB. Usually he is probably around a middle of the pack QB as a passer but gets bonus points as a RB. Overall he probably settles in around 12 or so in value. Great homerun threat and can keep drives alive with his feet but just not as consistent as the top 10 QBs in a normal year. People seem to forget that losing teams in the SB usually stink the following year, so putting down Newton for following that script seems ridiculous to me. IMO, he is clearly a top 10 QB and as those above him retire, he could easily become a top 5 QB. Stats aside, he is a winner and that is all that matters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soko Posted October 7, 2017 Share Posted October 7, 2017 37 minutes ago, Iamcanadian said: People seem to forget that losing teams in the SB usually stink the following year, so putting down Newton for following that script seems ridiculous to me. IMO, he is clearly a top 10 QB and as those above him retire, he could easily become a top 5 QB. Stats aside, he is a winner and that is all that matters. It’s ridiculous to hold a guy responsible for playing poorly because he lost the year prior? Atlanta is tied for the division lead. Denver got to the playoffs after getting waxed against Seattle. Seattle made the playoffs after a heartbreaking loss to NE. New England made it after their loss to the Giants in 2011-2012, and likely would have made it in 08-09 if Brady stayed healthy. In recent history, it’s not unlikely for a super bowl loser to play reasonably well the following season. The Panthers has a ton of overachieving players (including Cam) that came back down to Earth in 2016. As far as him being a top 10 quarterback, I don’t see it. Brady, Rodgers, Brees, Big Ben, Rivers, Wilson, healthy Luck, Carr, Mariota, Stafford, and Ryan are all much better quarterbacks. As far as him being a winner...57-44 isn’t really a record to write home about, especially considering a fluke 15-1 season. Cam is a great athlete that plays QB and occasionally flashes some consistency at passing the football, but not well enough to take you far on a regular basis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DingoLadd Posted October 7, 2017 Author Share Posted October 7, 2017 10 minutes ago, Yin-Yang said: It’s ridiculous to hold a guy responsible for playing poorly because he lost the year prior? Atlanta is tied for the division lead. Denver got to the playoffs after getting waxed against Seattle. Seattle made the playoffs after a heartbreaking loss to NE. New England made it after their loss to the Giants in 2011-2012, and likely would have made it in 08-09 if Brady stayed healthy. In recent history, it’s not unlikely for a super bowl loser to play reasonably well the following season. The Panthers has a ton of overachieving players (including Cam) that came back down to Earth in 2016. As far as him being a top 10 quarterback, I don’t see it. Brady, Rodgers, Brees, Big Ben, Rivers, Wilson, healthy Luck, Carr, Mariota, Stafford, and Ryan are all much better quarterbacks. As far as him being a winner...57-44 isn’t really a record to write home about, especially considering a fluke 15-1 season. Cam is a great athlete that plays QB and occasionally flashes some consistency at passing the football, but not well enough to take you far on a regular basis. I will never get that "15-1 is a fluke" I could get it if the panthers choked in the playoffs or Cam wasn't actually good that season. But he was the MVP, legitimately played like a top 5 QB the entire year, won 2 playoff games and almost won a SB. How is that a fluke? what more does he need to prove? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
43M Posted October 7, 2017 Share Posted October 7, 2017 Top 5 playmaker in the entire league but his shortcomings as a passer leave way too much to be desired. When he is on, he is unstoppable, but he isnt only nearly enough to be a top 5 or even a consistent top 10 QB. As Yin-Yang stated Brady, Rodgers, Brees, Big Ben, Rivers, Wilson, healthy Luck, Carr, Mariota, Stafford, Ryan and Ill add Cousins and Alex Smith are all guys that are either CONSISTENTLY better than Cam or OFTEN better. THAT DOESNT MEAN MORE TALENTED.....just that they are better QBs, mainly because they are all better pure passers. Cam can be the best QB in the league when he is on....but his inconsistencies put him in the 8 to 13 range IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
43M Posted October 7, 2017 Share Posted October 7, 2017 2 hours ago, DingoLadd said: I will never get that "15-1 is a fluke" I could get it if the panthers choked in the playoffs or Cam wasn't actually good that season. But he was the MVP, legitimately played like a top 5 QB the entire year, won 2 playoff games and almost won a SB. How is that a fluke? what more does he need to prove? I dont know if fluke is the right word, but several players on that Carolina team, including Cam, had career years all at the same time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jlowe22 Posted October 7, 2017 Share Posted October 7, 2017 Cam just isn't a good enough passer, or isn't consistent enough to be considered a good passer. I expect him to age poorly in this league as his athleticism declines. He's capable of being both the best QB in the league and the worst any given Sunday. He usually winds up somewhere around the middle, and I would rank him 15ish. When he's on his game, I'd rank him top 5-8. He won MVP in 2015 but I don't see him having another year like that again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iknowcool Posted October 7, 2017 Share Posted October 7, 2017 5 hours ago, Yin-Yang said: As far as him being a winner...57-44 isn’t really a record to write home about, especially considering a fluke 15-1 season. Cam is a great athlete that plays QB and occasionally flashes some consistency at passing the football, but not well enough to take you far on a regular basis. That is because we sucked in 2011 and 2012, Newton's first two seasons. Since then, Newton is tied with Rodgers for the 4th most wins by a QB. So we have been pretty good on a regular basis with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malik Posted October 7, 2017 Share Posted October 7, 2017 If you ignore the people who have personal biases about Cam for whatever reasons I don't think he's overrated or underrated. We all mostly agree that he is a tremendously talented athlete that is a mediocre passer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheKillerNacho Posted October 7, 2017 Share Posted October 7, 2017 I voted Top 10 but I don't blame people for voting Top 15. He's honestly in the 9th-14th range for me. Definitely one of the most dynamic QBs in the league though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iknowcool Posted October 7, 2017 Share Posted October 7, 2017 Keenum over Newton? I don't even think @El ramster would agree with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jlowe22 Posted October 7, 2017 Share Posted October 7, 2017 6 minutes ago, iknowcool said: Keenum over Newton? I don't even think Rammy would agree with that. I think he means in the same tier, and I agree with you that I would not take Keenum over Newton. Also, some of the other guys he mentioned a tier above Newton may turn out to be worse in the long term. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iknowcool Posted October 7, 2017 Share Posted October 7, 2017 I think it is equally as laughable to put him in the same tier as well. Keenum isn't a starting caliber QB. He is, at best, a placeholder until you can find somebody better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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