The Pats QB situation

[Apparition]

I wonder if the Pats would be in on Cousins if the Vikings do indeed make him available. Chances are that if it happens, he'll go to SF because Shanny is infatuated with the guy. But what if the Vikings are reluctant to trade him within the conference?

[Deadpulse]

Honestly I pay any price for Watson, but alas I know its a pipe dream

[Crimmage]

2 hours ago, Starless said:

I wonder if the Pats would be in on Cousins if the Vikings do indeed make him available. Chances are that if it happens, he'll go to SF because Shanny is infatuated with the guy. But what if the Vikings are reluctant to trade him within the conference?

I doubt it, Cousins isn't worth the cost. He is mediocre at best. 

BB isn't going to want to give up draft picks and pay 20+ million for him.. someone like Mitch Trubisky at a Mariota type deal seems much more likely at this point. 

[Hunter2_1]

6 hours ago, ChazStandard said:

Supposing its true, it would have nothing to do with BB would it? It would be because of Patricia.

TBH I totally forgot he came back here already. 

 

[Dan33185]

On 2/1/2021 at 12:23 PM, Starless said:

I wonder if the Pats would be in on Cousins if the Vikings do indeed make him available. Chances are that if it happens, he'll go to SF because Shanny is infatuated with the guy. But what if the Vikings are reluctant to trade him within the conference?

As someone who lives in MN, I've seen a lot of Cousins. Zero interest in him going to NE, he can put up great stats when it doesn't matter, but he very rarely comes through when it matters. He's the type of QB who needs everything just perfect around him to succeed, and can very rarely go off script to make a play. Add in that contract, and you have a very average QB at a premium price.

[Crimmage]

So how is everyone feeling about Carson Wentz, now that it appears he is on the trading block? 

• I could see BB giving him a try if Eagles go crazy and somehow throw a pick to get rid of him or the cost is only a conditional 2022 pick so they can focus on adding weapons this offseason. BB loves the idea of buying low on players and fixing them.
• He doesn't have a Jimmy G level injury history ( I thought he missed more games but apparently only missed 3 in 17 and the end of 18) 
• Less than 10 INT a year the 3 years after his rookie season which is nice ( BB highly regards taking care of the ball)
• It's really a matter of if you feel last season is the new him.. or if it was a mirage ( only 57% completion and 15INT in 12 games) 
• My big questions are mental.. what happened last offseason for the eagles to want to draft a QB in the 2nd? and how mentally weak is Wentz that it completely crushed his confidence. 
• Leadership concerns.. as soon as Hurtz took his job the team seemed to rally behind him which kind of gives the feeling that the team didn't like Wentz as a person. 

 

His mental fortitude is the biggest concern .. if he can't handle a guy being drafted high as his backup, he will immediately fold under BB and be an instant bust

The only thing which makes me even consider it is the fact that his contract is really just a 2 year deal.. you could cut him after 2 years with no dead cap. If you draft a 1st round QB you're going to stick with him at least 2-3 years before calling him a bust and moving on.. so it seems that giving Wentz 2 years to prove he is the guy is reasonable ( unless he is a Cam year of not even being able to throw the ball). 

 

He 100% wouldn't be my first option.. but he's a heck of a lot better than resigning Cam or going with a throw away year of Fitzpatrick and hoping to draft someone next year if they can't get their guy in the draft now. 

[Hunter2_1]

10 hours ago, Crimmage said:

So how is everyone feeling about Carson Wentz, now that it appears he is on the trading block? 

• I could see BB giving him a try if Eagles go crazy and somehow throw a pick to get rid of him or the cost is only a conditional 2022 pick so they can focus on adding weapons this offseason. BB loves the idea of buying low on players and fixing them.
• He doesn't have a Jimmy G level injury history ( I thought he missed more games but apparently only missed 3 in 17 and the end of 18) 
• Less than 10 INT a year the 3 years after his rookie season which is nice ( BB highly regards taking care of the ball)
• It's really a matter of if you feel last season is the new him.. or if it was a mirage ( only 57% completion and 15INT in 12 games) 
• My big questions are mental.. what happened last offseason for the eagles to want to draft a QB in the 2nd? and how mentally weak is Wentz that it completely crushed his confidence. 
• Leadership concerns.. as soon as Hurtz took his job the team seemed to rally behind him which kind of gives the feeling that the team didn't like Wentz as a person. 

 

His mental fortitude is the biggest concern .. if he can't handle a guy being drafted high as his backup, he will immediately fold under BB and be an instant bust

The only thing which makes me even consider it is the fact that his contract is really just a 2 year deal.. you could cut him after 2 years with no dead cap. If you draft a 1st round QB you're going to stick with him at least 2-3 years before calling him a bust and moving on.. so it seems that giving Wentz 2 years to prove he is the guy is reasonable ( unless he is a Cam year of not even being able to throw the ball). 

 

He 100% wouldn't be my first option.. but he's a heck of a lot better than resigning Cam or going with a throw away year of Fitzpatrick and hoping to draft someone next year if they can't get their guy in the draft now. 

Not sure. I look at the last season, and he was literally the worst QB in the league. It wasn't just mental either, his mechanics are all over the place. His front foot was pointing 45 degrees AWAY from where he was throwing, which tied his hips up, which meant his accuracy was terrible.

I haven't looked at the financial situation either, I'll leave that to smarter people. 

 

Would we be getting the 2017 Wentz, or the turnover machine 2020 Wentz? Is this gamble worth a high pick?

 

"His 24 turnover-worthy plays led the NFL despite him being benched in Week 13, and he had the worst ball-location accuracy (47.0%) in the league, too."

He'd prefer to go to Indie as well

Edited February 5, 2021 by Hunter2_1

[m haynes]

14 hours ago, Crimmage said:

My big questions are mental.. what happened last offseason for the eagles to want to draft a QB in the 2nd? and how mentally weak is Wentz that it completely crushed his confidence

14 hours ago, Crimmage said:

His mental fortitude is the biggest concern .. if he can't handle a guy being drafted high as his backup, he will immediately fold under BB and be an instant bust

14 hours ago, Crimmage said:

Leadership concerns.. as soon as Hurtz took his job the team seemed to rally behind him which kind of gives the feeling that the team didn't like Wentz as a person. 

IMO This all started when he got injured the 1st time. His backup comes in and goes off and he there at a young age watching. He knows that he has to come back strong however he has to deal mentally with injury and playing again. Worst case scenario happens, he rusty and unsure of him self. Now more added pressure within himself and all outside forces. Than they draft a guy in the second rd which adds more. Very tough to deal with and it showed.

I look at this like Jim Plunkett. He never had a chance had to regroup and came back to be a champion. Yes it took a long time however he had to fix his mind and his body and thats not the case with CW.

I'm not sure BB will be any problem. He is straight. He works you and he's in your corner. None of the pat him on the back crap while doing everything else behind his back.

I played for coaches that were very demanding however you knew it was to make you a better player. I also had the other side of the coin and my play suffered. Looking at the Eagles, to me the owner wants him for the money reason only, the coaching staff on the other side of the coin. We're with you CW but do everything but stand in his corner and that also rubs off on the team. Coaches hates him so I will !! 

I have no idea if they can fix CW however if BB does trade for him I have no problems other than they better ( fan part of the brain) be right. I have to assume they know what their doing and have done their do diligence.

To me, what the difference it's only two years and its better than taking in a short term fix FA. I don't care about cap space ramifications. They are building and I assume it will take 2 years to become competitive in the east and NFL.

Last They better rob Phily if they make the trade. I'm not giving up draft choices to make it happen. Something like the Lyons but a smaller scale.

 

Edited February 5, 2021 by m haynes

[m haynes]

41 minutes ago, m haynes said:

IMO This all started when he got injured the 1st time. His backup comes in and goes off and he there at a young age watching. He knows that he has to come back strong however he has to deal mentally with injury and playing again. Worst case scenario happens, he rusty and unsure of him self. Now more added pressure within himself and all outside forces. Than they draft a guy in the second rd which adds more. Very tough to deal with and it showed.

I look at this like Jim Plunkett. He never had a chance had to regroup and came back to be a champion. Yes it took a long time however he had to fix his mind and his body and thats not the case with CW.

I'm not sure BB will be any problem. He is straight. He works you and he's in your corner. None of the pat him on the back crap while doing everything else behind his back.

I played for coaches that were very demanding however you knew it was to make you a better player. I also had the other side of the coin and my play suffered. Looking at the Eagles, to me the owner wants him for the money reason only, the coaching staff on the other side of the coin. We're with you CW but do everything but stand in his corner and that also rubs off on the team. Coaches hates him so I will !! 

I have no idea if they can fix CW however if BB does trade for him I have no problems other than they better ( fan part of the brain) be right. I have to assume they know what their doing and have done their do diligence.

To me, what the difference it's only two years and its better than taking in a short term fix FA. I don't care about cap space ramifications. They are building and I assume it will take 2 years to become competitive in the east and NFL.

Last They better rob Phily if they make the trade. I'm not giving up draft choices to make it happen. Something like the Lyons but a smaller scale.

 

Follow up on my comment. Philly won't trade unless they get equal value with starts with a 1st RD pick!!!!!!!!! HHHHHHHHHHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHAAAAAA!!!

[JiffyJag]

Obviously nobody asked me, but if I had a say in the Pats QB situation I think I'd kick the tires on Minshew, who I would assume can be acquired with a 3rd/4th round pick, rather than settle on a QB at 15 unless a guy like Lance is somehow still on the board (even though I don't think Lance is ready to be a starter right out of the gate). 

[Crimmage]

1 hour ago, Jaguarfan said:

Obviously nobody asked me, but if I had a say in the Pats QB situation I think I'd kick the tires on Minshew, who I would assume can be acquired with a 3rd/4th round pick, rather than settle on a QB at 15 unless a guy like Lance is somehow still on the board (even though I don't think Lance is ready to be a starter right out of the gate). 

Couldn't agree more.. If they take Lance I think that's even more of a reason to grab Minshew.. you could have him start for 2 seasons then hand off the Lance at that point ( he needs at least 2 seasons imo).

What I think is most likely is the Jaguars will wanting to move up to 15 and grab a playmaker like Kyle Pitts/Waddle for Lawrence. If that's the case Minshew could then become part of a package to get up to 15. 

 

BB loves 2nd round picks and the Jags have two of them so it seems like the perfect opportunity for both teams to help each other out. 

 

Something along the lines of 15+Pats 3rd for 33, 45 & Minshew . I've been on the Minshew train for a long time and would rather have a season with him + more picks than reach for a QB at 15.

Edited February 5, 2021 by Crimmage

[The Third Rider]

4 hours ago, m haynes said:

Follow up on my comment. Philly won't trade unless they get equal value with starts with a 1st RD pick!!!!!!!!! HHHHHHHHHHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHAAAAAA!!!

Isnt he do 35 million next season?? they would have to offer their first to even consider taking him. lol

[IheartMyV8]

His contract is something like 4/98M left.  OTC says a post-june trade leaves PHI with 9M dead and 25M saved (before that is 33/800k) so I can see the move, but to get someone to take it on is gonna cost em I'd imagine.  I'm not sure what our options would be with a restructure.  I didn't see him play this past season but if it's as bad as everyone says it is, I don't see committing 25M/yr cap to it as being prudent.  That's half of what our assumed cap space is going to be and we have some big ol' holes to shore up.

[Crimmage]

Hilarious,  Mitch may be a better future QB at this point than Wentz.. and they may actually give up a 1st rounder + players. 

 

I would have considered Wentz as a reclamation project if Philly was going to toss over some picks for the trouble.. but a team is actually going to take a gamble on him getting back to form, pay his 20+ million a season contract, AND give up a good trade package.. I'll stick to hoping for Minshew in exchange for a 4th lol

[Hunter2_1]

On 2/5/2021 at 5:32 PM, Jaguarfan said:

Obviously nobody asked me, but if I had a say in the Pats QB situation I think I'd kick the tires on Minshew, who I would assume can be acquired with a 3rd/4th round pick, rather than settle on a QB at 15 unless a guy like Lance is somehow still on the board (even though I don't think Lance is ready to be a starter right out of the gate). 

There are a few in here that would agree with you