Raiders Offense Thread 2.0:

[jimkelly02]

Just now, NYRaider said:

Which is why we drafted Bryan Edwards. Gruden just refuses to use our young guys he'd rather play Zay Jones and Jason Witten over Edwards/Moreau. 

again did you not read my entire message? Cuz I clearly said maybe that can be Edwards.  Was it you who predicted Edwards would have 800 yds?  (Honestly I can’t remember).  I Do like Edwards but Iike I accurately predicted predraft hes Raw and would Have little impact year 1.  I see him playing moderately well year 2 and blooming in year 3.  

And he’s Moreau should have a way bigger role in this offense, he could be a high end TE2.

But ultimately we still need a Reliable chain moving outside WR whose ready game 1 of ‘21.

[NYRaider]

Our offense will always be meh as long as Gruden is calling the plays and Carr is our starter. 

[dante9876]

15 minutes ago, jimkelly02 said:

again did you not read my entire message? Cuz I clearly said maybe that can be Edwards.  Was it you who predicted Edwards would have 800 yds?  (Honestly I can’t remember).  I Do like Edwards but Iike I accurately predicted predraft hes Raw and would Have little impact year 1.  I see him playing moderately well year 2 and blooming in year 3.  

And he’s Moreau should have a way bigger role in this offense, he could be a high end TE2.

But ultimately we still need a Reliable chain moving outside WR whose ready game 1 of ‘21.

Dont like using 3 round picks on guys who gonna take 3 years to contribute on a team that had so many needs. Edwards don't got to be a baller, but if he can't contribute in week 16. That's a tough sale. 

[jimkelly02]

4 minutes ago, dante9876 said:

Dont like using 3 round picks on guys who gonna take 3 years to contribute on a team that had so many needs. Edwards don't got to be a baller, but if he can't contribute in week 16. That's a tough sale. 

I’d say my opinion falls and in between yours and nyraiders.

I do like the Edwards pick but knew he Couldn’t contribute much year 1.... and won’t peak til Year 3.  But I do like the draft selection.

ultimately what im Talking about if brining in A veteran to Bridge the gap.... someone who won’t break the bank but is also good. 
 

Again we don’t need a WR1.... im Not saying sign Kenny Golliday or JuJu or Allen Robinson..... we just need a big , reliable target at outside WR to move the chains and In the RedZone.   Basically what Tyrell Williams was suppose to give us.

[NCOUGHMAN]

Just now, jimkelly02 said:

I’d say my opinion falls and in between yours and nyraiders.

I do like the Edwards pick but knew he Couldn’t contribute much year 1.... and won’t peak til Year 3.  But I do like the draft selection.

ultimately what im Talking about if brining in A veteran to Bridge the gap.... someone who won’t break the bank but is also good. 
 

Again we don’t need a WR1.... im Not saying sign Kenny Golliday or JuJu or Allen Robinson..... we just need a big , reliable target at outside WR to move the chains and In the RedZone.   Basically what Tyrell Williams was suppose to give us.

Ty will killed the dynamics of our offense also Trent and richie. 50$ dollars for 4 games by Trent and 1 from richie. 5 games between 3 guys being paid big bucks

[dante9876]

1 minute ago, jimkelly02 said:

I’d say my opinion falls and in between yours and nyraiders.

I do like the Edwards pick but knew he Couldn’t contribute much year 1.... and won’t peak til Year 3.  But I do like the draft selection.

ultimately what im Talking about if brining in A veteran to Bridge the gap.... someone who won’t break the bank but is also good. 
 

Again we don’t need a WR1.... im Not saying sign Kenny Golliday or JuJu or Allen Robinson..... we just need a big , reliable target at outside WR to move the chains and In the RedZone.   Basically what Tyrell Williams was suppose to give us.

Yeah I guess when a guy has a 10 year deal. You can develop a team this way. I mean we drafting guys who won't be able to fully contribute until gruden 5th or 6th year as the coach. 

[Frankie2Gunz]

1 hour ago, jimkelly02 said:

All draft process and training camp i said Ruggs isn’t a high volume target WR and was chastised for it.  Im still happy with Ruggs don’t get me Wrong.  I think As He developed he’ll really open up the offense.  But ultimately we Do need a high volume WR ..... which is why I was so high on us drafting Ceedee Lamb.  Overall I’m not upset with Ruggs.... cuz I think he can become a dangerous and dynamic WR.... but we do need to Add a higher volume target WR to this offense.  Allen Robinson would be amazing but he’ll be too expensive.  Ultimately I don’t thinK we need a True every game High Volume Target because of the depth we have with Renfrow, Agholor, and edwards..... we really just need an outside WR who can move the chains consistently.  When it’s 3rd down we only go to Waller or Renfrow.  Can Edwards develop into The big physical WR we all dreamed he’d be?  Idk I think He’s got the ability to But like I always said he’s raw.  He Was massively underdeveloped in college.

 

We were both on the same page about Ruggs before the year as none of us saw him as a high volume WR.  I was hoping that Edwards would show glimpses of being that guy this year but that clearly hasn't happened.  I do like Ruggs long term but to really take advantage of his skills he needs a high volume WR next to him.  We both wanted Lamb and he has shown so far that he is the best of the top 3 selected.  Jefferson would have been nice after a trade down or taking Kinlaw at 12 ( I also stated how I wanted him as a potential target at 12 as well).

I think we had discussed Juju as a potential option after the season, I don't think you liked him coming here and he has had a down season.  How would you feel about landing him on a 2 year $24 million deal.  12 per year for a 24 year old WR who has shown he can be that high volume target wouldn't be a bad move.  Robinson and Golliday will most likely not hit the market.  What are your thoughts?

[jimkelly02]

26 minutes ago, dante9876 said:

Yeah I guess when a guy has a 10 year deal. You can develop a team this way. I mean we drafting guys who won't be able to fully contribute until gruden 5th or 6th year as the coach. 

I agree and disagree a bit.  I think your stretching it a bit though.... to be honest.  Edwards can contribute year 2 and peak year 3..... that’s what most 3rd round picks do.  To expect a 3rd round rookie to stand out year 1 is crazy.  I’d guess without looking only 2-4 3rd round rookies do that any given year.

remember Edwards was drafted to replace tyrell Williams in ‘21..... and not to be this 700/800 Rookie wr many on this board magically imagined he’d become as soon as williams Went to iR.

Edited December 27, 2020 by jimkelly02

[dante9876]

4 minutes ago, jimkelly02 said:

I agree and disagree a bit.  I think your stretching it a bit though.... to be honest.  Edwards can contribute year 2 and peak year 3..... that’s what most 3rd round picks do.  To expect a 3rd round rookie to stand out year 1 is crazy.  I’d guess without looking only 2-4 3rd round rookies do that any given year.

See you keep saying stand out. We not asking for that. Contribute. Get snaps over zay Jones. Moreau playing over witten. I guarantee with out looking I can find 3 round picks from last two drafts that have contributed more than  edwards muse and bowden did for raiders this year. Honestly it wouldn't be hard at all since edwards only one who actually has played a snap for raiders. 

[jimkelly02]

16 minutes ago, Frankie2Gunz said:

We were both on the same page about Ruggs before the year as none of us saw him as a high volume WR.  I was hoping that Edwards would show glimpses of being that guy this year but that clearly hasn't happened.  I do like Ruggs long term but to really take advantage of his skills he needs a high volume WR next to him.  We both wanted Lamb and he has shown so far that he is the best of the top 3 selected.  Jefferson would have been nice after a trade down or taking Kinlaw at 12 ( I also stated how I wanted him as a potential target at 12 as well).

I think we had discussed Juju as a potential option after the season, I don't think you liked him coming here and he has had a down season.  How would you feel about landing him on a 2 year $24 million deal.  12 per year for a 24 year old WR who has shown he can be that high volume target wouldn't be a bad move.  Robinson and Golliday will most likely not hit the market.  What are your thoughts?

I never dislike Juju... I just liked golliday and Allen Robinson more.

I’d like juju a lot but think he’s somewhat a product of Big Ben.  I’d prefer a big physicaL WR like golliday or Robinson to throw fades too and go to in clutch situations and goal line.  
 

I just don’t think we can afford to put 12M towards a WR like juju next year.  We won’t have a ton of cap room cuz of Mayocks somewhat mismanagement and we would be way better served signing a FS Like a Justin Simmons for 15/16M then Juju for 12m or give Leonard Williams 17-19M.

So juju at 12m as an isolated idea is fantastic but in the big picture we need to spend that money on defense.

Edited December 27, 2020 by jimkelly02

[jimkelly02]

3 minutes ago, dante9876 said:

See you keep saying stand out. We not asking for that. Contribute. Get snaps over zay Jones. Moreau playing over witten. I guarantee with out looking I can find 3 round picks from last two drafts that have contributed more than  edwards muse and bowden did for raiders this year. Honestly it wouldn't be hard at all since edwards only one who actually has played a snap for raiders. 

I’m barely disagreeing with you.... and this is becoming a game of Symantec’s and definitions.

muse and Bowden were horrible picks.... i Agree.  What I said was it’s rare to find 1st year starters in round 3..... and drafting Edwards in the 3rd to develop wasn’t a bad move.  

[Frankie2Gunz]

Just now, jimkelly02 said:

I never dislike Juju... I just liked golliday and Allen Robinson more.

I’d like juju a lot but think he’s somewhat a product of Big Ben.  I’d prefer a big physicaL WR like golliday or Robinson to throw fades too and go to in clutch situations and goal line.  
 

I just don’t think we can afford to put 12M towards a WR like juju next year.  We won’t have a ton of cap room cuz of Mayocks somewhat mismanagement and we would be way better served signing a FS Like a Justin Simmons for 15/16M then Juju for 12m or give Leonard Williams 17-19M.

It's pretty sad that we need so much help.  We can use a stud at nearly every position. 

No doubt D needs to be the focal point of the offseason but on the flip side I highly doubt LW hits the market.  I would take him at $17 any day of the week over Juju as an interior disruptor would make a greater impact for this team.  A high volume WR would be a nice luxury but I would also be content rolling into next season with our current WR corp minus Williams.  I would love to see Edwards take the next step in his progression as I think he has a lot of potential.    

[Bitty 2.0]

1 hour ago, jimkelly02 said:

again did you not read my entire message? Cuz I clearly said maybe that can be Edwards.  Was it you who predicted Edwards would have 800 yds?  (Honestly I can’t remember).  I Do like Edwards but Iike I accurately predicted predraft hes Raw and would Have little impact year 1.  I see him playing moderately well year 2 and blooming in year 3.  

And he’s Moreau should have a way bigger role in this offense, he could be a high end TE2.

But ultimately we still need a Reliable chain moving outside WR whose ready game 1 of ‘21.

WTF Let's put this to rest once and for all 

Ruggs and Edwards got hurt and other players stepped up and took there playing time. That's it. Nelson is one of the top deep threats in the NFL and all I read is Garden doesn't know what he doing because he's not given Ruggs the ball. 

Some of the posters here would rather have Waller give up receptions so that they can see what Edwards has.

Edited December 27, 2020 by Bitty 2.0

[jimkelly02]

6 minutes ago, dante9876 said:

See you keep saying stand out. We not asking for that. Contribute. Get snaps over zay Jones. Moreau playing over witten. I guarantee with out looking I can find 3 round picks from last two drafts that have contributed more than  edwards muse and bowden did for raiders this year. Honestly it wouldn't be hard at all since edwards only one who actually has played a snap for raiders. 

And I’ve been incredibly high on Moreau and was against the Witten deal from day 1.... but understood the value of his leadership on Waller and Moreau..... but yes he shouldn’t be taking a single snap from Moreau.  Moreau could be A top level TE2 If we just give him snaps and get Of the way.

[jimkelly02]

Just now, Bitty 2.0 said:

WTF Let's put this to rest once and for all 

Ruggs and Edwards got hurt and other players stepped up and took there playing time. That's it. Nelson is one of the top deep threats in the NFL and all I read is Garden doesn't know what he doing because he's not given Ruggs the ball. 

Ummm what are you talking about?  I don’t even remember you being in this conversation so Im Confused as to Your hostility....

Ruggs and Edwards just didn’t get hurt..... Ruggs was underused all year, and Edwards was hurt early and then came back and barely played cuz he wasn’t ready.  That happens when your very raw cuz your college offense threw 50% of your targets as screens.  Edwards is a talent but needed time to develop his route tree.  I’ve said that since day 1.

and Nelson should have been used on crossing routes and slants too.... Gruden held him Back too.

Honestly. I don’t know how this passing game has been successful given how bland it’s been and how players aren’t being used correctly..... or wait cuz Waller has carried the team.