AKRNA Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 1 hour ago, germ-x said: Yep. Said it a few weeks ago, but that’s how he answered after the Patriots game when he let them back in it. All of his post game interviews are terrible. He acts as if it’s so easy, when his play on the field is obviously struggling mightily. I’ve used this comparison with Mayfield (and I think Lock is the physically more talented player) but like Renck, Lock plays like he’s Mahomes/Favre/Rodgers/Wilson when he needs to play more like a game manager. The quicker Lock realizes he isn’t a special type of talent the quicker his career gets on track. When he refers to himself as a "gunslinger" it makes me want to gag. Favre, Elway and others were gunslingers. In the pocket, rolling left or right, running for their lives, and throw a 50 yard frozen rope on target. Lock? He's more like Barney Fife. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
germ-x Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 I think people are over using Shurmur as a scapegoat for Locks poor play. Shurmur can improve, but it’s also the job of the QB after a play call to put the play call in a position to have success. This isn’t college. But a play call naturally has a 1st read, but the pre snap look of a defense can and does change that. Lock’s a homerun hitter, he’s said it himself in press conferences and interviews. He wants to sling it and that’s his read 1. He needs to get away from that and play QB. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AkronsWitness Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 5 minutes ago, germ-x said: I think people are over using Shurmur as a scapegoat for Locks poor play. Shurmur can improve, but it’s also the job of the QB after a play call to put the play call in a position to have success. This isn’t college. But a play call naturally has a 1st read, but the pre snap look of a defense can and does change that. Lock’s a homerun hitter, he’s said it himself in press conferences and interviews. He wants to sling it and that’s his read 1. He needs to get away from that and play QB. Whats mind blowing is that we heard all offseason that this offense is going to be fast as hell and explosive. I dont recall any of the WRs or TEs burning defenses deep or guys like Hamler/Jeudy running free making plays in the open field. Thats what I dont understand. We have the horses (pun) to be explosive, but the plays are just not there. Any play that is made downfield is usually a jump ball contested catch. Not guys hitting seams and taking a 10 yard slant 60 yards to the house. Not sure if thats on playcalling or Lock or both. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
germ-x Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 27 minutes ago, AkronsWitness said: Whats mind blowing is that we heard all offseason that this offense is going to be fast as hell and explosive. I dont recall any of the WRs or TEs burning defenses deep or guys like Hamler/Jeudy running free making plays in the open field. Thats what I dont understand. We have the horses (pun) to be explosive, but the plays are just not there. Any play that is made downfield is usually a jump ball contested catch. Not guys hitting seams and taking a 10 yard slant 60 yards to the house. Not sure if thats on playcalling or Lock or both. Don’t disagree. I only watched until half time today and watched all of last week, but am surprised there hasn’t been more of an effort to get Hamler or Jeudy in space. Hamler’s a guy that even if he can’t run routes you manufacture a few touches a game for. Shurmur hasn’t been perfect and his style of the WCO is more vertical than Shanahan’s. It’s the NFL though, plays and reads change at the LOS and I question whether Lock is doing that and I think that’s justifiable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
broncosfan_101 Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 Lock’s play is discouraging. Shurmur’s playcalling and scheming hasn’t put the offence in enough positions to succeed. But with the way the interior of the offensive line is playing, especially in pass pro...I don’t know if there’s an OC/QB combo that could overcome it. They are awful. When Glasgow’s back, I’d think long and hard about playing him at centre to try and settle things in the middle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AkronsWitness Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 Just now, germ-x said: Don’t disagree. I only watched until half time today and watched all of last week, but am surprised there hasn’t been more of an effort to get Hamler or Jeudy in space. Hamler’s a guy that even if he can’t run routes you manufacture a few touches a game for. Shurmur hasn’t been perfect and his style of the WCO is more vertical than Shanahan’s. It’s the NFL though, plays and reads change at the LOS and I question whether Lock is doing that and I think that’s justifiable. For sure, Lock is def. not reading the defenses at the LOS but thats my issue with the coaches. They need to recognize this and make the adjustments necessary to help him improve. Dont just keep asking him to run the same offense over and over and over again when he clearly is struggling doing some of the things in it. Unfortunatly coordinators usually dont make these types of changes because they feel the need to prove a point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AkronsWitness Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 2 minutes ago, broncosfan_101 said: Lock’s play is discouraging. Shurmur’s playcalling and scheming hasn’t put the offence in enough positions to succeed. But with the way the interior of the offensive line is playing, especially in pass pro...I don’t know if there’s an OC/QB combo that could overcome it. They are awful. When Glasgow’s back, I’d think long and hard about playing him at centre to try and settle things in the middle. agreed, Lock doesnt trust the OL and thats a big reason why hes always drifting out of the pocket and falling away after his first read. I would love to see some more misdirection in the playcalling to keep defenses on their heels because right now they are just pinning their ears back and blitzing knowing that the Broncos OL is trash and Lock struggles with multiple reads. Either way, I think the Broncos will look back at this season and wonder why they parted ways with Scangs in favor of Shurmer. Scangarellos offense was much more decisive and designed to get 1 player open to minimize the reads Lock had to make. It was simple and filled with bootlegs and play action. Shurmers is more drop back, read the defense and make the correct throw. Much more fitting for a veteran QB than a rookie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AKRNA Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 7 minutes ago, broncosfan_101 said: Lock’s play is discouraging. Shurmur’s playcalling and scheming hasn’t put the offence in enough positions to succeed. But with the way the interior of the offensive line is playing, especially in pass pro...I don’t know if there’s an OC/QB combo that could overcome it. They are awful. When Glasgow’s back, I’d think long and hard about playing him at centre to try and settle things in the middle. I think any solution that involves replacing Cush with Schlottman or Glasgow at center would yield great and immediate results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AKRNA Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 6 minutes ago, AkronsWitness said: For sure, Lock is def. not reading the defenses at the LOS but thats my issue with the coaches. They need to recognize this and make the adjustments necessary to help him improve. Dont just keep asking him to run the same offense over and over and over again when he clearly is struggling doing some of the things in it. Unfortunatly coordinators usually dont make these types of changes because they feel the need to prove a point. He's struggling doing everything! IMO he can't run an NFL offense. I think it was @bMiller031 that gave a great summary of his play every down. 1) 1st read 2) checkdown 3) panic and roll right. I would much rather go back to Rypien. He doesn't have the physical skills but he understands and can run the offense, something I don't think Lock will ever be able to do. I'm sure Locks a great sandlot QB, "cut left at the F-150 and I'll hit you by the fire hydrant" but the NFL is beyond his grasp. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AkronsWitness Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 Just now, AKRNA said: He's struggling doing everything! IMO he can't run an NFL offense. I think it was @bMiller031 that gave a great summary of his play every down. 1) 1st read 2) checkdown 3) panic and roll right. I would much rather go back to Rypien. He doesn't have the physical skills but he understands and can run the offense, something I don't think Lock will ever be able to do. I'm sure Locks a great sandlot QB, "cut left at the F-150 and I'll hit you by the fire hydrant" but the NFL is beyond his grasp. Thats fair but Lock has arm talent that Rypien doesnt possess. Going to Rypien is like going back to Trevor Siemian. Sure he can do the little stuff well, but hes not winning you any games or maximizing the offense. Im willing to give Lock this year (maybe next depending) and if he doesnt get better then the Broncos need to look at a different option. At the end of the day Lock is only making his what, 11th start next week? Im not jumping ship on a guy just yet who had no meaningful reps his rookie year as a backup, has been through 2 different systems in 2 years, didnt have a normal offseason this year and is playing with a offense missing multiple starting OL players and Courtland Sutton. Hes in a bad situation right now, really bad and the Broncos are looking to him to bail everyone out. I understand he needs work and hasnt helped his cause, but Im betting on him to improve as the season moves forward and he gets more games under his belt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroncoBruin Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 (edited) They still need to see this season through with Drew. It guarantees nothing next year, but you have to get as much tape as possible. Shurmur is a more proven asset in the NFL than Drew at this point but there are also a couple Shurmur things that are driving me nuts: 1. The 2nd and 10 runs, particularly with Melvin Gordon! My god. This was something a Giants fan friend warned me about and he’s leaned on it more and more. Setting Drew up for 3rd and 7+ consistently. The numbers will tell you 2nd and long is the worst situation to run the football. Really hasn’t been much creativity with the run game in general. Use more motion, it can move LBs and give your run play a better angle! 2. Reminiscent of 2017 McCoy, no adjustments when the 11 personnel clearly cannot function with our pass pro. Simple blitzes are killing this offense . You can’t block with 5, or block with 5 + Lindsay which is basically the same thing. When you need to evaluate Lock, the most important thing at this point is giving him time to see the field. Cushenberry, Schlottmann and Rodgers was a nightmare of a right side for a QB who wants to scramble to his right all the time. Edited November 9, 2020 by BroncoBruin 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lomaxgrUK Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 (edited) 6 hours ago, AKRNA said: He's struggling doing everything! IMO he can't run an NFL offense. I think it was @bMiller031 that gave a great summary of his play every down. 1) 1st read 2) checkdown 3) panic and roll right. I would much rather go back to Rypien. He doesn't have the physical skills but he understands and can run the offense, something I don't think Lock will ever be able to do. I'm sure Locks a great sandlot QB, "cut left at the F-150 and I'll hit you by the fire hydrant" but the NFL is beyond his grasp. I get what you mean, but Rypien isn't the answer. He simply doesn't have the base level talent. If this was a team competing then this may be a valid argument. But this team isn't competing for a title. Lock does the have base level talent to be a starting NFL QB so that alone, for a team in our situation, is reason for him to keep playing. It's refreshing to be on this forum. Twitter is a cesspit of people having such strong opinions either in defense of Lock, or overly criticising him. Sans a couple of people, everyone else seems to agree: * Lock isn't playing well enough the first 3 quarters * The scheme isn't designed to highlight his skillset * His OL (as a unit) are letting him down * Injuries have killed us I haven't given up on Drew. It can take time for young players to figure out the NFL. It certainly did for Josh Allen. It's just so incredibly difficult when you look at young QBs like Mahomes, Jackson, Burrow, Herbert who seemed to figure 'it' out so much quicker. Edited November 9, 2020 by lomaxgrUK 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebestever6 Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 Weren't slow starts an issue last year as well I'm encouraged by Lock still Battling Paxton Lynch would have been crying on the sidelines rather than coming back Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebestever6 Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 Tom Brady like Lock has no ground game last night so even the Goat plays bad 209 yards 3 ints need an identity Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
broncos67 Posted November 9, 2020 Share Posted November 9, 2020 It was mentioned above, and I mentioned it earlier, but it's astounding how we're not scheming guys like Jeudy/Hamler to get open in space and let their natural talent/speed shine in this offense. Granted, I get that Sutton got hurt early in the season and that threw a wrench in things, but there needs to be some adaptation all around. I very much think Lock needs to improve- at this point he looks barely passable as a starter in the NFL. But, he's still young and the offense around him is too. This is why I personally put more of the onus on Shurmur. He was brought in to help guide a young QB/team as Vic's handpicked guy, and so far, nothing. The run-run-pass sequence is destroying our momentum. It's a huge issue. I'm seeing next to no involvement with RBs in the passing game. Just weird playcalling all around. For example, have we thrown a screen this year? I can't remember one. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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