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The Lions Den: The Anything Thread


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Red Wings and Pistons should start shaking things up here in the next following weeks. I mean everyday now I think there is real potential for them to make moves and gain future assets. Idk what the total haul for either team will be, but both have assets to sell.

 

Pistons: PG Reggie Jackson, PG Ish Smith, SG Luke Kennad, SG Langston Galloway, SG/SF Reggie Bullock, SF Stanley Johnson, C Andre Drummond, Zaza Pachulia.

Red Wings: LW/RW Gustav Nyquist, LW/RW Andreas Anthanisou, LW Thomas Vanek, RW Martin Frk, C Luke Glendenning, C Darren Helm, D Nick Jensen, D Mike Green, D Niklas Kronwall, D Trevor Daley, G Jimmy Howard

 

It'll be a real derelict of duty to not come away with some real assets for the future from either organization. Standing still and doing nothing or just A move... is literally fire-able and will let fans know everything the owners are about for the future. Both teams have too many assets to sell and holes to fill for the future to do just one more or nothing. 

Edited by SimbaWho
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18 hours ago, SimbaWho said:

Red Wings and Pistons should start shaking things up here in the next following weeks. I mean everyday now I think there is real potential for them to make moves and gain future assets. Idk what the total haul for either team will be, but both have assets to sell.

 

Pistons: PG Reggie Jackson, PG Ish Smith, SG Luke Kennad, SG Langston Galloway, SG/SF Reggie Bullock, SF Stanley Johnson, C Andre Drummond, Zaza Pachulia.

Red Wings: LW/RW Gustav Nyquist, LW/RW Andreas Anthanisou, LW Thomas Vanek, RW Martin Frk, C Luke Glendenning, C Darren Helm, D Nick Jensen, D Mike Green, D Niklas Kronwall, D Trevor Daley, G Jimmy Howard

 

It'll be a real derelict of duty to not come away with some real assets for the future from either organization. Standing still and doing nothing or just A move... is literally fire-able and will let fans know everything the owners are about for the future. Both teams have too many assets to sell and holes to fill for the future to do just one more or nothing. 

I don’t follow the Pistons however the Red Wings will certainly be sellers. The problem is, the players they can move aren’t going to yield huge returns. 

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Yeah you right, but still moving a guy like Helm and his contract for a mid rounder is HUGE.

Moving Howard as a rental for anything to a contender and then resigning is also HUGE.

Moving Nyquist for a 1st rounder seems unrealstic but we just seen Tatar moved for more and Nyquist is better. 

Maybe even can see a fish bite on Mike Green for at leats multiple picks, tough sell even for me to pitch a 1st rdp for him. 

 

Everyone else, yeah won't garner much, if they want a real return we'd have to move someone like Mantha but that doesn't make sense imo, basically all fans can see him apart of the future as at least a mid line RW with the potential to grow into a top winger near yearly 30 goal scorer. 

* Even the Pistons assets, they're all low cost moves low gain stuff like player for player swap, 2nd rounders, or even future 2nd round picks. But Pistons put themselves in such a mess that even fetching low end picks like that can really help for their future if they can draft a collection of bench talent or even just 1 really good starter. Pistons have to try and draft well in the next couple of years, they have no choice but to basically be a self made team if they want to compete for playoffs in the next few years. 

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12 minutes ago, SimbaWho said:

* Even the Pistons assets, they're all low cost moves low gain stuff like player for player swap, 2nd rounders, or even future 2nd round picks. But Pistons put themselves in such a mess that even fetching low end picks like that can really help for their future if they can draft a collection of bench talent or even just 1 really good starter. Pistons have to try and draft well in the next couple of years, they have no choice but to basically be a self made team if they want to compete for playoffs in the next few years. 

I think it would be foolish to try and draft their way into the playoffs.  Who really cares about the playoffs anyways?  If you don't have a team that can contend, I feel like there is no point in trying.  We could make a couple moves and work our way into the 6th spot or something, but we aren't winning anything.  We need another elite two pieces.  I say trade everything for future draft picks and hope we get lucky like we did with the Darko pick (not the player picked but the #2 pick in a trade that also netted us Ben Wallace).  I just don't see it with this core.  Trade Blake, trade Drummond, see if someone will take Leuer and Jackson and go for a top pick in this and next years draft plus whatever draft assets we get from moving those guys. 

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8 minutes ago, Sllim Pickens said:

I think it would be foolish to try and draft their way into the playoffs. 

I think maybe you're interpenetrating this statement wrong from me.

I literally agree with everything you're saying. Only way Pistons move back into the playoffs/contention is to draft guys in house and reshape the roster by possibly getting lucky at whatever pick with whatever pick. The picks are a scatter-shot approach pretty much because there isn't a core to build around, so Pistons need to literally create there own through the draft, not signing aging free agents. I also mentioned player swaps because Idk, maybe they get lucky and run into a Olidapo situation like the Pacers did. 

I've had it with this core myself. I'm worried none of these guys can be moved basically. Obviously clearing out cap would be the best because it'd create options but it's hard to invision the Pistons moving Blake or Drummond with no contract really coming back. I'm hoping the staff can get creative with Reggie, where we can pick up an expiring, somehow, but league wide it looks bleak moving him even. There most attractive assets to me are Reggie Bullock and Ish Smith if I'm another team. 

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1 hour ago, SimbaWho said:

I think maybe you're interpenetrating this statement wrong from me.

I literally agree with everything you're saying. Only way Pistons move back into the playoffs/contention is to draft guys in house and reshape the roster by possibly getting lucky at whatever pick with whatever pick. The picks are a scatter-shot approach pretty much because there isn't a core to build around, so Pistons need to literally create there own through the draft, not signing aging free agents. I also mentioned player swaps because Idk, maybe they get lucky and run into a Olidapo situation like the Pacers did. 

I've had it with this core myself. I'm worried none of these guys can be moved basically. Obviously clearing out cap would be the best because it'd create options but it's hard to invision the Pistons moving Blake or Drummond with no contract really coming back. I'm hoping the staff can get creative with Reggie, where we can pick up an expiring, somehow, but league wide it looks bleak moving him even. There most attractive assets to me are Reggie Bullock and Ish Smith if I'm another team. 

That makes sense.  I think Blake still can bring in a decent amount, especially with his resurgence here.  I think he is the third wheel on a great team so wont get elite return but may get more than we gave. 

I know we disagree on Drummond but I still think he can be the missing piece for some teams.  Boston seems like a great landing spot as he doesn't need the ball, Washington would be fun to see him with Beal and Wall, and OKC would also be interesting.  However I am not sure if they can make salaries match for appropriate value there. The problem with all of those teams is the draft pick compensation we get from any of them would likely be late first round.

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17 hours ago, SimbaWho said:

Yeah you right, but still moving a guy like Helm and his contract for a mid rounder is HUGE.

Moving Howard as a rental for anything to a contender and then resigning is also HUGE.

Moving Nyquist for a 1st rounder seems unrealstic but we just seen Tatar moved for more and Nyquist is better. 

Maybe even can see a fish bite on Mike Green for at leats multiple picks, tough sell even for me to pitch a 1st rdp for him. 

 

Everyone else, yeah won't garner much, if they want a real return we'd have to move someone like Mantha but that doesn't make sense imo, basically all fans can see him apart of the future as at least a mid line RW with the potential to grow into a top winger near yearly 30 goal scorer. 

* Even the Pistons assets, they're all low cost moves low gain stuff like player for player swap, 2nd rounders, or even future 2nd round picks. But Pistons put themselves in such a mess that even fetching low end picks like that can really help for their future if they can draft a collection of bench talent or even just 1 really good starter. Pistons have to try and draft well in the next couple of years, they have no choice but to basically be a self made team if they want to compete for playoffs in the next few years. 

Gotcha.

Mid round picks are certainly possible for the Wings.

Anthanisou is the most intriguing player, to me. Lots of rumours that he could end up on McDavids wing.

 

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Hey that'd be no problem by me. Just fork over about four mid rounders... or Bouchard and a Mid rounder, lol. 

 

Shouldn't the Oil worry about a GM first, and long-term HC? Things seem to be real Shakey... Oil need to do something for the fan base/players to show they're serious. Tarasenko or bust imo if I was a Oil fan. Time to go big!

McDavid-Tarasenko would/will cause real fear around the league, the Power Play should be top 10 with just those two. Likely no playoffs this year, I get it, but make the move, use the offseason to settle the front office, and by the start of next season the horses are on the run and the team should have realistic plans for a playoff birth/run. 

 

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1 hour ago, SimbaWho said:

Hey that'd be no problem by me. Just fork over about four mid rounders... or Bouchard and a Mid rounder, lol. 

 

Shouldn't the Oil worry about a GM first, and long-term HC? Things seem to be real Shakey... Oil need to do something for the fan base/players to show they're serious. Tarasenko or bust imo if I was a Oil fan. Time to go big!

McDavid-Tarasenko would/will cause real fear around the league, the Power Play should be top 10 with just those two. Likely no playoffs this year, I get it, but make the move, use the offseason to settle the front office, and by the start of next season the horses are on the run and the team should have realistic plans for a playoff birth/run. 

 

There’s no hurry to hire a GM. That will happen in June most likely. If it happens earlier it will likely be a mistake because all candidates won’t be available until then. Edmonton is a highly desirable job and it’s in their best interests to do a complete search. The new GM needs experience, brains and balls.

The scouting department runs the draft and the head of pro scouting makes trade recommendations. 

Chia took a great deal of heat in Edmonton but it’s not all his fault. The Reinhardt trade was not his move. He received pressure internally to go get him. He played for the Oil Kings (The Oilers own the franchise) and Lowe and MacT loved him.

The two tough pills to swallow for me were the Eberle trade and the Maroon trade. The players didn’t like Maroon so that trade was inevitable. Chia turned Eberle into Strome who was traded for Spooner who cleared waivers and is playing in the AHL. A bad move all around.

His acquisitions of Manning and Petrovic were simply desperation due to injuries. His last gasp as it turns out.

Nicholson needs to do a complete internal audit and keep the OBC out of the process.

Tarasenko is a non starter. Their 1st round pick won’t be traded. I doubt Yamamoto or Puljujarvi are in the mix so they simply don’t have the ammo to swing that deal.

McDavid, Draisaitl, RNH and Nurse aren’t going anywhere. Bouchard may be in play but the return needed won’t likely materialize. He’s the future PP QB and unless they get a top line winger (proven) or a really good dman he won’t be moved. 

In Bakersfield Bear, Jones, Lagesson and Benson are quality pieces but they won’t land a Tarasenko.

The Oilers aren’t as far away as some of the pundits seem to think. People forget they were a favourite to win the Stanley Cup prior to last season. Then Sekera wasn’t ready, Eberle and Maroon were traded and the game became faster which really hurt with guys like Lucic signed at 6 million per year.

The Oilers need a defenceman to QB the power play and wingers with speed that can score a few goals.

They have some trade pieces that will be valuable at the deadline but none that will land what they truly need.

Talbot, Lucic, Kassian, Chiasson, Russell, Benning, Petrovic, Sekera, Khaira, Brodziak will all be available. So it’s likely any trades will be moving size and toughness for skill and speed. Let’s face it none of the players I mentioned will get top flight players back but if they can find wingers with speed McDavid can certainly elevate their game. Kassian and Khaira have size, speed and toughness which will be in high demand amongst some playoff teams.

Lucic I expect will be in Seattle. The Oilers will trade him and a draft pick, retain some salary and open some cap room.

I don’t expect the Oilers to be big players at the trade deadline but that could change if, what I’m hearing remains true, that numerous teams are selling. 

The guy I’m worried they will trade is RNH. He is totally under rated by fans but he’s a very good 2C that can play a complete game and keeps getting better. Given he’s played 3C with castoff wingers against top competition, many nights, and scores just below a PPG pace is amazing. 

So, the Oilers are in tough but have some very good pieces. The tragedy is wasting McDavids early years.

 

 

 

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  • 2 weeks later...
On ‎1‎/‎23‎/‎2019 at 11:31 AM, SimbaWho said:

Red Wings and Pistons should start shaking things up here in the next following weeks. I mean everyday now I think there is real potential for them to make moves and gain future assets. Idk what the total haul for either team will be, but both have assets to sell.

 

Pistons: PG Reggie Jackson, PG Ish Smith, SG Luke Kennad, SG Langston Galloway, SG/SF Reggie Bullock, SF Stanley Johnson, C Andre Drummond, Zaza Pachulia.

Red Wings: LW/RW Gustav Nyquist, LW/RW Andreas Anthanisou, LW Thomas Vanek, RW Martin Frk, C Luke Glendenning, C Darren Helm, D Nick Jensen, D Mike Green, D Niklas Kronwall, D Trevor Daley, G Jimmy Howard

 

It'll be a real derelict of duty to not come away with some real assets for the future from either organization. Standing still and doing nothing or just A move... is literally fire-able and will let fans know everything the owners are about for the future. Both teams have too many assets to sell and holes to fill for the future to do just one more or nothing. 

So far we have flipped Bullock and Stanley for a deep bench SG and a young C who looks about as productive as SJ.  Oh and a second round pick in a couple years.  Great work by this front office so far.  I don't hate either move, just seems very minimal for what they should be doing.

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Don't hate the moves. I feel Bullock had more value, because he comes with his bird rights and was a UFA at the end of the year, but whatever. I actually kind of like Sviatoslav Mykhailiuk, I think his ceiling in a Marco Benelli type player, wing, shooting guard. Doesn't mean he will be that but, he's just that type of player/shooter. Surprised LA traded him but they're looking to compete vs develop. 

Thon Maker swap was alright, Johnson has no future here and no one behind Drummond/Griffin has a large role on this team so Maker can fit in the fold nicely as a big if he works at it. His game foils both our big perfectly and should be able to play both C/PF. 220lbs is lite, but he's 7'1. Really just needs to improve that shoot consistency, cause that's what Pistons really want him to bring to the table. 

Over here sweating they don't trade for Mike Conley unless it unloads a bunch of contract. I think i would do something like Drummond/Jackson/Protected 1st for Gasol/Conley. Long shot... cause Utah is offering a good trade for just Conley. 

I don't expect a MAJOR move, but Ish Smith can be hand for a 2nd round pick. Pistons also have a collection of trade exceptions to work with to add... some sort of talent. They basically have no Small Forwards right now, so, somethings got to give.

 

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1 hour ago, SimbaWho said:

Don't hate the moves. I feel Bullock had more value, because he comes with his bird rights and was a UFA at the end of the year, but whatever. I actually kind of like Sviatoslav Mykhailiuk, I think his ceiling in a Marco Benelli type player, wing, shooting guard. Doesn't mean he will be that but, he's just that type of player/shooter. Surprised LA traded him but they're looking to compete vs develop. 

Thon Maker swap was alright, Johnson has no future here and no one behind Drummond/Griffin has a large role on this team so Maker can fit in the fold nicely as a big if he works at it. His game foils both our big perfectly and should be able to play both C/PF. 220lbs is lite, but he's 7'1. Really just needs to improve that shoot consistency, cause that's what Pistons really want him to bring to the table. 

Over here sweating they don't trade for Mike Conley unless it unloads a bunch of contract. I think i would do something like Drummond/Jackson/Protected 1st for Gasol/Conley. Long shot... cause Utah is offering a good trade for just Conley. 

I don't expect a MAJOR move, but Ish Smith can be hand for a 2nd round pick. Pistons also have a collection of trade exceptions to work with to add... some sort of talent. They basically have no Small Forwards right now, so, somethings got to give.

 

I agree on the Conley deal. Not sure I want him.  He is an upgrade but not enough of one to make a difference on our future.  Other than take us out of the lottery for a 15th overall pick. 

I am still hoping we dump guys.   Get rid of Drummond, send Blake to one of the teams that strikes out this summer on free agents, and start from scratch. 

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