diehardlionfan Posted January 14, 2021 Share Posted January 14, 2021 1 minute ago, Karnage84 said: I... don't know how to feel about this. If true they better hire an experienced head coach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted January 14, 2021 Share Posted January 14, 2021 Just now, diehardlionfan said: The Lions have a long history of hiring inexperienced people and failing. Holmes is Quinn the second. Someone with experience in one aspect of football operations that rose to run one aspect of a teams operation. I don’t want a college scouting director or a pro personnel director to become GM. Welcome to Quintricia Vol 2: Welcome Holmes 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diehardlionfan Posted January 14, 2021 Share Posted January 14, 2021 Just now, Karnage84 said: Welcome to Quintricia Vol 2: Welcome Holmes Same old Lions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diehardlionfan Posted January 14, 2021 Share Posted January 14, 2021 12 hours ago, BZski said: He’s not my first choice but I think he must have made a great impression. While Titans offense is a little boring they did put up numbers. I would be intrigued by what he would do for our offense. My first choice for HC is Dan Campbell which a lot of people are lukewarm on. If rumours are true about hiring Holmes then I expect this will be the next hire. An in person interview seems to be the golden ticket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted January 14, 2021 Share Posted January 14, 2021 Jeff Risdon - "[Holmes] is probably the best college scout out there." Maybe this is an indication that we are going to work towards tearing things down and rebuilding through the draft as opposed to trying to correct the defense and running with the current set up on offense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted January 14, 2021 Share Posted January 14, 2021 Just now, diehardlionfan said: If rumours are true about hiring Holmes then I expect this will be the next hire. An in person interview seems to be the golden ticket. I mean... at least we aren't the Texans hiring a GM out of left field that we haven't even interviewed and against the advice of the search firm we paid millions of dollars to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TL-TwoWinsAway Posted January 14, 2021 Share Posted January 14, 2021 8 minutes ago, Karnage84 said: Jeff Risdon - "[Holmes] is probably the best college scout out there." Maybe this is an indication that we are going to work towards tearing things down and rebuilding through the draft as opposed to trying to correct the defense and running with the current set up on offense. Perhaps, but I don't think it ever hurts to have a great drafter at GM, regardless of the state of your team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diehardlionfan Posted January 14, 2021 Share Posted January 14, 2021 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Karnage84 said: Jeff Risdon - "[Holmes] is probably the best college scout out there." Maybe this is an indication that we are going to work towards tearing things down and rebuilding through the draft as opposed to trying to correct the defense and running with the current set up on offense. 9 minutes ago, Karnage84 said: I mean... at least we aren't the Texans hiring a GM out of left field that we haven't even interviewed and against the advice of the search firm we paid millions of dollars to. That’s a great consolation prize.😥 So one man feels he’s the best college scout out there. I wonder how he will be with hiring coaches and other personnel? I wonder how he will do assessing pro players? I wonder about cap management? How will he do with trades? I wonder how much of his success at one aspect of football is because of his scouts excellence? Its hard to forecast. So much for the Lions claiming they wanted experience. So much for the additional in person interviews they were going to conduct. One constant is anything the organization says is fluff. The biggest positive is they have a GM in place which will allow the HC search to proceed in earnest. Edited January 14, 2021 by diehardlionfan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sllim Pickens Posted January 14, 2021 Share Posted January 14, 2021 4 minutes ago, diehardlionfan said: No, I want someone like Ed Dodds who has been in charge of all aspects of player personnel previously and has experience as an assistant GM. The Lions have a long history of hiring inexperienced people and failing. Holmes is Quinn the second. Someone with experience in one aspect of football operations that rose to run one aspect of a teams operation. I don’t want a college scouting director or a pro personnel director to become GM. As for Cowher he didn’t just wake up and become stupid. Many people pursue different avenues of their career. Unlike most broadcasters he has been highly successful as an NFL head coach. He’s kept in touch with the game and has contacts throughout the football world. I worked in a highly technical rapidly changing environment and stepped away for five years to pursue another interest and returned. Many people do it. Spielman was hired as an advisor not a GM yet many here touted him for GM. He’s a broadcaster as well but lacks any hands on experience with an NFL franchise. Cowher offers the complete resume. The Lions need to get this right. They’ve been a pathetic excuse for a football franchise my entire life. They don’t need to continue making the same tired mistakes of the past. As for a GM that has failed in the past that’s not what I want at all. If they hire an ex GM I would hope it’s someone that has clearly had success at building a franchise that has won. No team stays on top forever The fact the Lions are interviewing everyone under the sun for the job openings is a reflection of how incompetent the franchise has been. Once again it appears, from my perspective they are trying to be the smartest guys in the room and find some individual they perceive as a hidden gem rather than finding someone that is qualified and hire him. Competent organizations identify qualified individuals and make their move. They don’t have to always search outside the organization and conduct a huge list of interviews. Everyone seems to discredit or undervalue experience. The world is full of examples of incompetence that is directly related to inexperience. Holmes may prove to be a great GM but it’s the same path the Lions took in hiring Quinn. These guys have advanced from scout to lead one organizational silo but lack the breadth of experience required. Some teams get lucky hiring individuals like this but the Lions have zero history of being able to identify the right candidates. As a result they should be hiring someone with broad experience. In addition these individuals running a silo don’t have final say in anything. Quinn came from a highly successful organization. It meant nothing because he didn’t have authority. Holmes is the same thing just a different silo. The reality of the Lions is they are trying to hire someone with more football knowledge and experience than anyone currently in the organization. They are uniquely unqualified to hire a GM so it’s paramount they choose someone with more experience. It’s the reality if an organization that has a president with zero football acumen. One last point. I believe I said I want someone with experience. I also added to that saying they need experience in the GM or HC roles however an experienced GM or HC would mitigate some of the risk and allow the hiring of an inexperienced HC or GM. So, if they were to hire Holmes I would hope they then hire an experienced HC. The last thing this organization needs is a first time GM and a first time HC. Once again, we’ve seen how that works out. Well a director of one aspect of scouting is an AGM. Its like an athletic director has 4 assistant athletic directors under them that do various roles. Holmes (who appears to be the choice) has been in the league 18 years (same as Dodds) in various roles and worked his way up, similarly to Dodds. He was with a team that went to the Super Bowl with their key players being guys they drafted. Now I can agree Dodds would be a solid choice, but he really doesn't have any more experience than Holmes. Saying he is Quinn 2.0 is using history to evaluate the current candidates, which smart corporations don't do. Just because one person who was on a team who was successful with the greatest coach in history, who hired a defensive coordinator that ran that genius coaches system instead of creating his own, doesn't mean the next situation will go bad. You can look at Lions history and hiring experienced has gone bad, hiring rookie has gone bad, and neither really have gone well. So if you want to base it on Lions history alone, we just shouldn't hire anyone because they will fail. Holmes comes from a situation with a young, inexperienced head coach and their GM was a pro scout and director of player personnel prior to being a GM. So it worked there. It worked in SF. It has worked many times. And I get that Cowher isn't just out of football, but has absolutely zero experience on the business side or scouting side. How would his experience as a coach in a league that was very different 15 years ago mean he is qualified to be a GM or more. Now I am not saying I wouldn't give it a shot, similarly to Spielman, I am just confused on you wanting experience but then wanting guys who are very unexperienced. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millenhater Posted January 14, 2021 Share Posted January 14, 2021 Well we also just gave the Rams two 3rd round picks for this. That alone makes me think this was a bad idea. Seriously I don't care if Dodds didn't do well in his interview that is the guy we should have gone after. I feel like this is going to end badly... So is Arthur Smith the head coach then? The fact that they rushed to interview him twice so quickly makes me feel he is the one. I'm pretty sure all of your coaching candidates are link to the GM candidates, that is why we are interview them both separately. It's a package deal. If you like the GM but you don't like their HC then they are out. I'm not sure Smith or Holmes really do it for me. They aren't terrible but I think we will look to replace them in 4 years... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TL-TwoWinsAway Posted January 14, 2021 Share Posted January 14, 2021 2 minutes ago, Millenhater said: Well we also just gave the Rams two 3rd round picks for this. That alone makes me think this was a bad idea. Seriously I don't care if Dodds didn't do well in his interview that is the guy we should have gone after. I feel like this is going to end badly... So is Arthur Smith the head coach then? The fact that they rushed to interview him twice so quickly makes me feel he is the one. I'm pretty sure all of your coaching candidates are link to the GM candidates, that is why we are interview them both separately. It's a package deal. If you like the GM but you don't like their HC then they are out. I'm not sure Smith or Holmes really do it for me. They aren't terrible but I think we will look to replace them in 4 years... Out of curiosity: if it's the right GM, and his former team happens to get some picks, why is that a bad thing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyguy1609 Posted January 14, 2021 Share Posted January 14, 2021 I think with this hire means stafford will be here for a lil bit longer IMO esp seeing brees & Brady in the playoffs this yr. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teude Posted January 14, 2021 Share Posted January 14, 2021 5 minutes ago, Millenhater said: Well we also just gave the Rams two 3rd round picks for this. That alone makes me think this was a bad idea. Seriously I don't care if Dodds didn't do well in his interview that is the guy we should have gone after. I feel like this is going to end badly... So is Arthur Smith the head coach then? The fact that they rushed to interview him twice so quickly makes me feel he is the one. I'm pretty sure all of your coaching candidates are link to the GM candidates, that is why we are interview them both separately. It's a package deal. If you like the GM but you don't like their HC then they are out. I'm not sure Smith or Holmes really do it for me. They aren't terrible but I think we will look to replace them in 4 years... Lions didn't give away any picks. ------- Jourdan Rodrigue Twitterissä: "Lions fans, if interested, these are the kind of progressive evaluation and draft practices Brad Holmes was key in helping implement w/ Rams. Cognitive bias-removal in talent eval, data as a tool, decision-making psychology and much more. https://t.co/RLPdj0v6jO" / Twitter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millenhater Posted January 14, 2021 Share Posted January 14, 2021 2 minutes ago, TL-TwoWinsAway said: Out of curiosity: if it's the right GM, and his former team happens to get some picks, why is that a bad thing? It's helping a conference rival and I don't think he was the best choice. It think he will be average. we really needed to swing for the fences on this one. obviously if it turns out i'm wrong and he's the next Ballard or Newsome than it will ok. I just don't know if I see that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millenhater Posted January 14, 2021 Share Posted January 14, 2021 2 minutes ago, teude said: Lions didn't give away any picks. ------- Jourdan Rodrigue Twitterissä: "Lions fans, if interested, these are the kind of progressive evaluation and draft practices Brad Holmes was key in helping implement w/ Rams. Cognitive bias-removal in talent eval, data as a tool, decision-making psychology and much more. https://t.co/RLPdj0v6jO" / Twitter I get that we didn't give any away but we allowed another team to get them and that's even more of a chance that talent doesn't slip to us in the 4th or that a team we compete with can continue to get talent to build their roster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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