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Lions fire HC Matt Patricia & GM Bob Quinn; Darrell Bevell to be interim HC


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3 minutes ago, ET80 said:

I'm thinking it's more semantics than anything, but sure. With a QB of Rodgers' calibur, you'd expect more to show for it outside of Regular Season successes.

The general public hold this against Manning - sure, he's a first ballot HoFer and is a legendary QB, but he never did quote what was expected. It's that one blemish to his career, and people are quick to bring it up when discussing Manning.

All I am asking - why does Rodgers not get the same scrutiny? Manning won 2x the SBs, went to 4x the SBs - and that's while dealing with Belly and Brady. Who was Rodgers' great nemesis in that timeframe? Why didn't he become the big bully in the NFC, like Brady?

I think it's skewed because of the amount of success that Tom Brady had.  Peyton Manning won ONE Super Bowl prior to him leaving Indianapolis.  Drew Brees has won ONE championship.  The top QBs don't always win championships.  I'm not sure the difference between a Super Bowl appearance is much different than a Championship appearance.  I believe in Payton Manning's career in Indianapolis, he had four AFC Championship appearances in 13 seasons.  Aaron Rodgers has 4 appearances in 12 seasons.

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1 minute ago, CWood21 said:

I thought the discussion that Rodgers and the Packers have underachieved.

Yes, because, with one of the best QBs in NFL history, they reached only one Super Bowl during Rodgers' 11 years. (For context, this entire conversation was initially about "Super Bowl wins" being the measure of a successful team.)

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58 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

Peyton Manning won ONE Super Bowl prior to him leaving Indianapolis.

But he made it to two, and then another two in Denver (with another ring). You can't ignore that - those things happened

So, why is the narrative so against Manning, but nary a peep against Rodgers?

Let me try this - Rodgers or Favre? End result would tell you Favre, but how do you see it?

58 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

Drew Brees has won ONE championship.

Bluntly speaking, Brees is in the same discussion - but at least he's got an out, as he was pretty much robbed from a SB appearance:

nfc championship nfl GIF

58 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

I'm not sure the difference between a Super Bowl appearance is much different than a Championship appearance.

There is - nobody cares that Buffalo won four consecutive AFCCGs they care that they lost four consecutive Super Bowls. History doesn't remember 4th or 3rd place. 

58 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

 I believe in Payton Manning's career in Indianapolis, he had four AFC Championship appearances in 13 seasons.

You're proving my point on CGs right here. You believe, you can't say for certain. I can say for certain he's 1-1 in Super Bowls as a Colt and 1-1 in Super Bowls as a Bronco.

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In other news...

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/lions-fans-reportedly-donate-to-deshaun-watsons-charity-to-thank-him-for-getting-matt-patricia-fired/amp/

As the unofficial agent for Deshaun Watson on this here site, I humbly accept any donations to be made for being a fan of the team that ended Patricia's tenure.

I accept, $20s, $50s, $100s and bags of nickels.

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2 hours ago, ET80 said:

In other news...

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/lions-fans-reportedly-donate-to-deshaun-watsons-charity-to-thank-him-for-getting-matt-patricia-fired/amp/

As the unofficial agent for Deshaun Watson on this here site, I humbly accept any donations to be made for being a fan of the team that ended Patricia's tenure.

I accept, $20s, $50s, $100s and bags of nickels.

74477816.jpg

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Why it failed in Detroit with Matt Patricia. And really for a lot of the BB coaching tree IMO:

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2917777-how-matt-patricias-patriot-way-went-the-wrong-way-in-detroit

Quote

8. I think there is a golden ethos I learned from Bill Parcells about how to treat players. Once you’ve won a title, or won big, you’ve got what Parcells called “a pelt on the wall,” and you can act your way, because if the players don’t like it, the coach will find players who want to play for a winner. But if you haven’t won anything significant, and you feel the coach is disrespectful, there’s going to be a gap between coach and players that can grow into a major problem. This was the money quote Kahler got from former Lions safety Glover Quin on that: “When you are cursing me like I am a little boy—hold on bro, you don’t have to talk to me like that to get your point across. We are partners, we are working together. When you are dealing with grown men, we are going to talk to each other like men. Don’t talk to me like you own me.” Judging by the reaction of former Lions to the firing, Quin was not alone.

 

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On 11/29/2020 at 8:40 AM, Outpost31 said:

It is nearly impossible to find good EDGE talent later in the draft.  Nearly impossible.  There are maybe two or three outliers at EDGE each year.

I'm not trying to trash your whole philosophy, because I do find it interesting and worth considering.  I just wanted to mention that the Vikings have done very well with edge rushers who were selected later in the draft.

D.J. Wonnum - Rookie DE who was drafted in the 4th round.  He is starting to look like he could be a good one.

Danielle Hunter - One of the best pass rushers in the league, picked with the 88th overall pick in the 3rd round.

Everson Griffen - Had several very good years with us.  He was drafted 100th overall, in the 4th round.

Jared Allen - We didn't draft him, but he is a likely Hall of Famer, drafted by the Chiefs in the 4th round.

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On 11/28/2020 at 9:54 PM, ET80 said:

You're ignoring that the Cardinals had two elite QBs in Kurt Warner and Carson Palmer. Does Rivers even beat out two guys who have All Pro resumes during their tenure?

Rivers had LT, V-Jax, Keenan Allen, Antonio Gates, Hunter Henry, etc. too. 

Not like Rivers ever played with a bare cupboard. San Diego had several really good years defensively as well. Yet, Rivers never won a Superbowl. 

The Cardinals had....Fitz and Boldin and then Fitz and Johnson. Why would Rivers have fared better with less? Not to knock him, I just find the "Fitz would have a Superbowl with Rivers" take really puzzling. As you point out, it's not like Warner and Palmer were total scrubs. 

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27 minutes ago, Deadpulse said:

Fitz would have a SB if James Harrison didn't exist. 

That's a great point, Fitz has more SB appearances than Rivers. Rivers had more talent surrounding him, too.

That argument has completed imploded on itself, just a Hindenberg if I've ever seen one.

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On 11/29/2020 at 9:28 PM, ET80 said:

There is - nobody cares that Buffalo won four consecutive AFCCGs they care that they lost four consecutive Super Bowls. History doesn't remember 4th or 3rd place. 

The fact that history somehow holds Troy Aikman over Jim Kelly is laughable to me, and it's 100% due to that ring factor. 

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1 minute ago, MWil23 said:

The fact that history somehow holds Troy Aikman over Jim Kelly is laughable to me, and it's 100% due to that ring factor. 

It's an absolute travesty. Kelly is pretty much superior in every measurable way, save for SBs.

If Kelly wins both non-Cowboys SBs, he's in the GOAT conversation.

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4 minutes ago, ET80 said:

It's an absolute travesty. Kelly is pretty much superior in every measurable way, save for SBs.

If Kelly wins both non-Cowboys SBs, he's in the GOAT conversation.

Throw in other guys criminally underrated like Bruce Smith, Thurman Thomas (he was Marshall Faulk before Marshall Faulk in a different era), Andre Reed, and one of my all time favorite human beings, Marv Levy who was an unbelievable coach, not to mention Ralph Wilson, who by all accounts was a legendary and great owner...I was so happy to see Reich get that ring a few years ago, as well as Don Bebe with the Packers.

I'm getting nostalgic...what can I say? :)

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