TheRealMcCoy Posted July 27, 2021 Share Posted July 27, 2021 2 minutes ago, NYRaider said: And not to mention when you look at the one-n-done guys that have come out of non-power house programs they usually don't live up to the hype. How he performed with the bum cast around him only enhances his stock iyam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRealMcCoy Posted July 27, 2021 Share Posted July 27, 2021 3 minutes ago, NYRaider said: When I look at Cade I see a guy that is kind of maxed out physically and had to settle for tough shots to score against college players because he's just an average athlete. I remember when people said this about Luka too lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted July 27, 2021 Author Share Posted July 27, 2021 1 minute ago, TheRealMcCoy said: How he performed with the bum cast around him only enhances his stock iyam. Ben Simmons and Markelle Fultz played better than Cade with worse teams around them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted July 27, 2021 Author Share Posted July 27, 2021 (edited) 4 minutes ago, TheRealMcCoy said: I remember when people said this about Luka too lol. Luka was also the MVP of the 2nd best league in the world at 18 years old. And despite not being a great 3 point shooter was still able to score on better efficiency while having a 2:1 assist to turnover ratio. So even with his lack of elite athleticism/shooting he was still skilled enough to consistently get into the lane and finish. And as I mentioned above flashed elite passing ability. Cade had more turnovers than assists in probably the 4th best power 5 conference in college basketball. And absolutely shrunk in their two NCAA tournament games against Liberty and Oregon State. Edited July 27, 2021 by NYRaider Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRealMcCoy Posted July 27, 2021 Share Posted July 27, 2021 (edited) 6 minutes ago, NYRaider said: Luka was also the MVP of the 2nd best league in the world at 18 years old. And despite not being a great 3 point shooter was still able to score at a higher clip on better efficiency while having a 2:1 assist to turnover ratio. So even with his lack of elite athleticism/shooting he was still skilled enough to consistently get into the lane and finish. And as I mentioned above flashed elite passing ability. Cade had more turnovers than assists in probably the 4th best power 5 conference in college basketball. And absolutely shrunk in their two NCAA tournament games against Liberty and Oregon State. Don't care. Taking Cade ten times out of ten over Jalen. You can have the athleticism. I'll take the dude who is smarter, stronger, better playmaker, better defender, better leader, and arguably better shooter. Green has flashes. His handle will improve I'm sure and he'll probably end up at least being a decent defender, but with those questions I'm just not buying into him as the #1 prospect. I'm taking the guy with the high ceiling and also higher floor. Edited July 27, 2021 by TheRealMcCoy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted July 27, 2021 Author Share Posted July 27, 2021 For comparison at the same age @TheRealMcCoy Luka Doncic (per 36) averaged 21 points, 7.5 rebounds, 6.6 assists, 3.1 turnovers on 46% FG/30% 3FG and won MVP of the Euro League Cade Cunningham this season (35 mpg) averaged 20.0 ppg, 6.2 rebounds, 3.5 assists, 4.0 turnovers on 43% FG, 40% 3FG in the Big 12 Luka as a passer was light years ahead of where Cade currently is and despite being a pretty bad shooter was still able to score at a higher clip against better competition. It reminds me so much of everyone wanting Ben Simmons to be LeBron James, he wasn't, and Cade isn't Luka. He's more comparable to a guy like Joe Johnson, he's not a point guard or a primary ball handler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRealMcCoy Posted July 27, 2021 Share Posted July 27, 2021 Just now, NYRaider said: For comparison at the same age @TheRealMcCoy Luka Doncic (per 36) averaged 21 points, 7.5 rebounds, 6.6 assists, 3.1 turnovers on 46% FG/30% 3FG and won MVP of the Euro League Cade Cunningham this season (35 mpg) averaged 20.0 ppg, 6.2 rebounds, 3.5 assists, 4.0 turnovers on 43% FG, 40% 3FG in the Big 12 Luka as a passer was light years ahead of where Cade currently is and despite being a pretty bad shooter was still able to score at a higher clip against better competition. It reminds me so much of everyone wanting Ben Simmons to be LeBron James, he wasn't, and Cade isn't Luka. He's more comparable to a guy like Joe Johnson, he's not a point guard or a primary ball handler. He doesn't got to be Luka to be great though. Luka is generational like Bron, Giannis, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRealMcCoy Posted July 27, 2021 Share Posted July 27, 2021 Although to be fair Giannis is generational now. He wasn't as a prospect obviously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted July 27, 2021 Author Share Posted July 27, 2021 1 minute ago, TheRealMcCoy said: I'll take the dude who is smarter, stronger, better playmaker, better defender, better leader, and arguably better shooter. Green has flashes. His handle will improve I'm sure and he'll probably end up at least being a decent defender, but with those questions I'm just not buying into him as the #1 prospect. I'm taking the guy with the high ceiling and also higher floor. Smarter/better playmaker yet had a negative assist to turnover ratio against worse competition. Better defender is a wash, Cade wasn't great defensively in the Big 12. And how can you say that he's a better leader? He literally went to Oklahoma State because his brother was getting paid bank and they were funneling money to Cade through him. Did his better leadership show up when it counted? Or did he shoot 9/34 FG against mediocre programs in Liberty and Oregon State while having 4 assists and 5 TO in those two games? You say Green has flashes and Cade did it all year but the numbers say otherwise... Cade this season averaged 20.0 ppg, 6.2 rpg, 3.5 apg, 4.0 topg on 43/40/84 splits at Oklahoma State against the 37th toughest schedule in the country. Jalen this season averaged 18.0 ppg, 4.1 rpg, 2.7 apg, 2.6 topg on 47/37/83 splits playing against professionals. There's absolutely no way that you can argue that Cade has a higher ceiling than Green based on the physical tools alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted July 27, 2021 Author Share Posted July 27, 2021 5 minutes ago, TheRealMcCoy said: He doesn't got to be Luka to be great though. He doesn't have to be Luka to be great, you're the one that just compared him to Luka when he isn't even close to the same player at the same stage of their careers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRealMcCoy Posted July 27, 2021 Share Posted July 27, 2021 2 minutes ago, NYRaider said: There's absolutely no way that you can argue that Cade has a higher ceiling than Green based on the physical tools alone. Green was also playing alongside professionals. Cade was playing with bums on his team. But, I never said Green's ceiling isn't sky high. I'm saying that Cade has a higher floor and is a more well rounded player without a doubt right now and if I'm drafting I can't just go off ceiling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRealMcCoy Posted July 27, 2021 Share Posted July 27, 2021 1 minute ago, NYRaider said: He doesn't have to be Luka to be great, you're the one that just compared him to Luka when he isn't even close to the same player at the same stage of their careers. I'm not comparing him to Luka lol. I'm comparing the criticism Luka got about his athleticism to that Cade is getting. They are both strong and crafty enough to the point it won't really matter that much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRealMcCoy Posted July 27, 2021 Share Posted July 27, 2021 So Green is definitely going #2, right? Draft starts with Cleveland or whoever they trade it to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted July 27, 2021 Author Share Posted July 27, 2021 Just now, TheRealMcCoy said: Green was also playing alongside professionals. Cade was playing with bums on his team. But, I never said Green's ceiling isn't sky high. I'm saying that Cade has a higher floor and is a more well rounded player without a doubt right now and if I'm drafting I can't just go off ceiling. The majority of the G-League Ignite roster was younger players. The NBA players they had on their roster included Jarrett Jack, Bobby Brown, Amir Johnson, and Brandon Ashley. The team wasn't even supposed to play exclusively against G-League teams but covid through them a curve ball so they had to play exclusively against other G-League teams. And the G-League talent pool was stronger this year than in years past because more teams sent younger guys down to play knowing they'd only have to be their for a few weeks as opposed to the typical back and forth between teams in a regular season. We've seen it many times throughout recent draft history, guys who are considered more well rounded/higher floor go higher, and then the guys with elite physical tools develop into better players. Even when you look back at the last 10 draft cycles the only player that went #1 and has been the best player from his draft class is Anthony Davis, and possibly Zion Williamson although you can make a strong case for Ja Morant being better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted July 27, 2021 Author Share Posted July 27, 2021 6 minutes ago, TheRealMcCoy said: I'm comparing the criticism Luka got about his athleticism to that Cade is getting. They are both strong and crafty enough to the point it won't really matter that much. The difference between them though is that Luka was a primary ball handler and a special playmaker, Cade isn't. Luka was still able to score at a high rate on better efficiency than Cade against better competition despite being a below average 3 point shooter. He was a way better ball handler so even despite the fact he wasn't a great athlete he was still able to consistently get to the rim and finish. Cade had to settle for a ton of tough shots to be able to score because he wasn't able to consistently blow past guys with his handle or his quickness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts