2021 Off-season FO / Coaching / Saleh to the Jets - Page 9

[Forge]

Jesus...his injury guarantee is 11.6 million. Like 70% of his base. I can't believe that they gave him that 3 years into his contract with his injury history. That's rough. 

[NinerNation21]

@ForgeWhat's this about?

[Forge]

2 minutes ago, NinerNation21 said:

@ForgeWhat's this about?

He's a troll just having fun with people. That's all he does. That's why I posted the oh my god gif 😂

[NinerNation21]

1 minute ago, Forge said:

He's a troll just having fun with people. That's all he does. That's why I posted the oh my god gif 😂

Ah, got it. Can't wait to see what trolly thing he'll tweet that will set 49ers' twitter ablaze.

[Forge]

1 hour ago, NinerNation21 said:

Ah, got it. Can't wait to see what trolly thing he'll tweet that will set 49ers' twitter ablaze.

He's a guy that just kind of mocks the entire twitter community. Says things just to get a rise out of the 9er twitterverse. Some of it is pretty funny. 

[Forge]

There is no way we are getting out from under Dee Ford this year. I can't believe that we injury guaranteed that much of his salary. Holy hell. If it were like 5 million, I think that there would have been a chance that he just retired with an injury settlement. No way in hell he's doing that with basically a lock that he's getting all 15 million this year. 

[Forge]

That's interesting. Akash also says that he was better against pressure than he was from a clean pocket in 2020, though I feel like that may be a case of small sample size playing some havoc because I'm pretty sure in 2019 he was awful against pressure and awesome in a clean pocket (though I could be remembering reading stuff wrong) 

[Forge]

Just largely confirms what most of us already knew for the most part. 

[Forge]

Just saw that we added ghost / voidable years to Tomlinson's contract. God I hate this direction that they decided to go. The restructure wasn't big enough for it to really mean anything, but they are seriously adding ghost years to every damn contract that they can. I don't know how they look at the Eagles' financial situation and find this to be a smart move. 

[GW21]

52 minutes ago, Forge said:

Just saw that we added ghost / voidable years to Tomlinson's contract. God I hate this direction that they decided to go. The restructure wasn't big enough for it to really mean anything, but they are seriously adding ghost years to every damn contract that they can. I don't know how they look at the Eagles' financial situation and find this to be a smart move. 

What does it matter? Serious question. It looks like we can cut hit without it costing us anything after his age 30 season. 

[Forge]

1 hour ago, GW21 said:

What does it matter? Serious question. It looks like we can cut hit without it costing us anything after his age 30 season. 

HIs doesn't, as I said.  The restructure on him is nominal so the ghost years are no biggie (like 300K each...that is how broke we were last year). But they are doing it a lot and I complain about it every time I find out we did it with someone else because it's a horrible habit to get into. It's a terrible way to manage the cap. This is why Philadelphia is in the mess they are in. Look at the guys on the last year of their deal in Philly. Old Vets like Graham, Jackson, Kelce. They can't save any money with those guys even when cutting / trading because they have voidable years that wash it out. When a guy gets the last year of his deal, you should typically be able to recoup almost their entire salary if you cut them, not be underwater on their deal.

Even if their contract runs out, they still have dead money on the table. Like this year, Jet and Kwon account for 5% of our cap because of those type of moves. Doesn't sound like a lot, but it's 2 guys. They aren't on the roster but both were left with voidable years (this would have happened with Kwon regardless of the trade last year or not; it actually just would have been higher this year without the trade, which is why i think we did it last year). But now think about that on a bigger scale because some of those guys are still on the roster.  

And our cap problems don't go away this year. People haven't started looking at it yet, but for 22, we have over 140 million committed to nineteen guys. And that's before accounting for Warner's extension which should come through this year. So you're probably looking at something along the lines of 150 million for 20 guys. 

If you want to do it, it probably makes more sense to do it with one guy (QB) than it does to a bunch of others. This is why the Saints cap is so easy to navigate despite them being 100 million over the cap. They often added voidable years to Brees, but I don't know of them doing that with anyone else. This basically just allowed them to keep stringing it along and they'll do it again this year with his retirement. 

I hate to quote him because I think he's a tool, but this is very, very accurate: 

 

So basically, on their own, each individual move doesn't seem like a big deal. Its more about the fact that we are consistently doing it and adding these burdens to our cap. Think back to 2017-18. Remember all those contracts we gave out and we were like, "oh that's terrible...but who cares if we overpaid these guys, we have a ton of cap space. This deal isn't a big deal". But then you realize that you could have rolled that cap over and you wasted 4 million on Cooper not to play a down. All that money and cap on Malcolm Smith. Overpaying Juice by 250%. Jet. The list goes on. On their own, each of those is no big deal, but when you start to add them all together, their cumulative effect takes its toll. 

We haven't gotten to Philly level of badness with regards to the voidable years (and you can attribute that to Philly going all in on their window, as they did this with big money deals), but when you consider the contracts, consider the voidable years on players who were likely never going to get through their deals to begin with...it's a bad look at how we are managing contracts. 

I'm just an ardent, ardent opponent of managing your cap in this way. I think that there are times where it may be necessary, but this should not be the norm. And for us it feels like we are more or less making it the norm. Right now, we have done it with Jet, Kwon, Richburg, Tomlinson. I expect us to do it with Ford this year, and we did it on the new deals for Jimmie Ward, AA...it's a lot. Right now the only saving grace is that they aren't doing it with expensive signing bonuses / salaries. 

[GW21]

3 hours ago, Forge said:

HIs doesn't, as I said.  The restructure on him is nominal so the ghost years are no biggie (like 300K each...that is how broke we were last year). But they are doing it a lot and I complain about it every time I find out we did it with someone else because it's a horrible habit to get into. It's a terrible way to manage the cap. This is why Philadelphia is in the mess they are in. Look at the guys on the last year of their deal in Philly. Old Vets like Graham, Jackson, Kelce. They can't save any money with those guys even when cutting / trading because they have voidable years that wash it out. When a guy gets the last year of his deal, you should typically be able to recoup almost their entire salary if you cut them, not be underwater on their deal.

Even if their contract runs out, they still have dead money on the table. Like this year, Jet and Kwon account for 5% of our cap because of those type of moves. Doesn't sound like a lot, but it's 2 guys. They aren't on the roster but both were left with voidable years (this would have happened with Kwon regardless of the trade last year or not; it actually just would have been higher this year without the trade, which is why i think we did it last year). But now think about that on a bigger scale because some of those guys are still on the roster.  

And our cap problems don't go away this year. People haven't started looking at it yet, but for 22, we have over 140 million committed to nineteen guys. And that's before accounting for Warner's extension which should come through this year. So you're probably looking at something along the lines of 150 million for 20 guys. 

If you want to do it, it probably makes more sense to do it with one guy (QB) than it does to a bunch of others. This is why the Saints cap is so easy to navigate despite them being 100 million over the cap. They often added voidable years to Brees, but I don't know of them doing that with anyone else. This basically just allowed them to keep stringing it along and they'll do it again this year with his retirement. 

I hate to quote him because I think he's a tool, but this is very, very accurate: 

 

So basically, on their own, each individual move doesn't seem like a big deal. Its more about the fact that we are consistently doing it and adding these burdens to our cap. Think back to 2017-18. Remember all those contracts we gave out and we were like, "oh that's terrible...but who cares if we overpaid these guys, we have a ton of cap space. This deal isn't a big deal". But then you realize that you could have rolled that cap over and you wasted 4 million on Cooper not to play a down. All that money and cap on Malcolm Smith. Overpaying Juice by 250%. Jet. The list goes on. On their own, each of those is no big deal, but when you start to add them all together, their cumulative effect takes its toll. 

We haven't gotten to Philly level of badness with regards to the voidable years (and you can attribute that to Philly going all in on their window, as they did this with big money deals), but when you consider the contracts, consider the voidable years on players who were likely never going to get through their deals to begin with...it's a bad look at how we are managing contracts. 

I'm just an ardent, ardent opponent of managing your cap in this way. I think that there are times where it may be necessary, but this should not be the norm. And for us it feels like we are more or less making it the norm. Right now, we have done it with Jet, Kwon, Richburg, Tomlinson. I expect us to do it with Ford this year, and we did it on the new deals for Jimmie Ward, AA...it's a lot. Right now the only saving grace is that they aren't doing it with expensive signing bonuses / salaries. 

I guess I missed the part saying it didn’t really matter in this case. I’m still amazed that we restructured Ford, Alexander, and Richburg. 

[Forge]

So I'm not sure where he got this from, but yikes if true. 

Anyone else realize he averages over seven sacks allowed per season? I'm really curious to know what he's looking at from an extension standpoint

[Forge]

Just now, GW21 said:

I guess I missed the part saying it didn’t really matter in this case. I’m still amazed that we restructured Ford, Alexander, and Richburg. 

Yeah, his is no big deal. It's just frustrating to see such a bag habit being repeated over and over, especially as the cap tightens for us, you know? 

[GW21]

1 minute ago, Forge said:

So I'm not sure where he got this from, but yikes if true. 

Anyone else realize he averages over seven sacks allowed per season? I'm really curious to know what he's looking at from an extension standpoint

I’m pretty sure Skule blew more in that one game against the Packers.