Rolni Posted December 10, 2020 Share Posted December 10, 2020 Is Joe Barry a solid candidate or just a family member? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightmare Posted December 10, 2020 Share Posted December 10, 2020 11 hours ago, Mr Raider said: I disagree. I think for Gunther to stay we need to make the playoffs and win a playoff game. Bare minimum if we miss the playoffs at all it will have to be because the defense improved and the offense fell flat. I think all the time away really hurt Grudens ability to build a staff and caused for heavy reliance on old direct past staff members. After all that time away not a lot of guys want to sign on to that staff. The NFL moves fast, can't imagine a lot of young, up and comers wanted to sign on with a guy a lot of people thought the game had passed by. I think the success we have had (which is to say decent for 3 years into a total rebuild) makes joining the staff more attractive now than it did when Gruden took the job. I have seen/heard comments from Gruden this season that seem incredibly critical of Gunther and like Gruden is less than pleased with the job he has done. And having 3 straight years of a bottom 8 defense statistically with virtually zero improvement despite a heavy investment with high draft picks and big money free agents, gets you fired in the NFL. I think Gruden knows how important consistency in a staff and a system is for players, especially in a rebuild around a ton of young players. But there has to be gradual improvement. There has been none. So unless we win a playoff game or the defense really improves down the stretch I do think Gunther is out. Gruden isn't without flaws. But do you believe he's a coach that think his team should be sitting at 7-5 with one of the better offenses statically in terms of points, 3rd down percentage, TD-INT ratio, etc? I don't. I think he believes his offense is one of the better ones in football and even when they play almost the perfect game the games are still close coming down to the wire. I believe Gruden looks for an upgrade if for no other reason than because he thinks the job he has done with the offense and the praise that should be coming with it is being lost. And that blame has to go on someone. And Gunther is the logical (and IMO) also the correct person to blame. The most compelling question is also kind of being asked in BPs post, will he look to upgrade in the right way or will it be another similar yes man with no real upside? That will put my theory to the test that all the time away really hurt building a great staff. Gruden has done enough to show he still has a place as an NFL coach today (again something I'm not sure a ton of people believed when he was making his original staff) and that could interest a bigger array of candidates. I hope you’re right. I do like the logic, and feel that the blame element of it may be particularly important here. The offense Gruden built and runs won’t be responsible for us missing the playoffs this season, if that does happen. I’m still skeptical, though. I do feel he’s loyal to “his” guys (which PG definitely is), even if he’s the sort of HC that will get angry and call people out. I wonder if he might be reaching out to a Raheem Morris type (also one of his guys, obviously) to see if they’d be up for the job if we had a vacancy. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrOaktown_56 Posted December 10, 2020 Share Posted December 10, 2020 Another great little thread. The offense is getting there. With Trent Brown back, that extra second will be there! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Raider Posted December 10, 2020 Share Posted December 10, 2020 3 hours ago, Nightmare said: I hope you’re right. I do like the logic, and feel that the blame element of it may be particularly important here. The offense Gruden built and runs won’t be responsible for us missing the playoffs this season, if that does happen. I’m still skeptical, though. I do feel he’s loyal to “his” guys (which PG definitely is), even if he’s the sort of HC that will get angry and call people out. I wonder if he might be reaching out to a Raheem Morris type (also one of his guys, obviously) to see if they’d be up for the job if we had a vacancy. Morris to me is the best fit between the guys Grudens is comfortable with and enough of a proven track record of recent success to give me confidence in the defense being a better scheme to take advantage of the talent we do currently have and will hopefully add. He's probably top 2 on my list of guys I consider to be a legitimate option to replace Gunther. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronjon1990 Posted December 11, 2020 Share Posted December 11, 2020 On 12/9/2020 at 3:21 PM, big_palooka said: Does anyone really believe that Gruden will move on from Guenther? It's one of my biggest pet peeves. His coaching staff is a collection of old "Gruden guys' vs. a staff with some potential for growth. In the past he championed guys like Jay Gruden, McVay, Shanahan, Morris, Tomlin. Now we have Greg Olson who inspires next to nothing. "Good friend Paul Guenther" some old retreads from his Tampa staff like Morton, Wilson, Marinelli, etc. I still find it funny that in all his time away, this is the best staff he could put together on return. Yeah. Monte Kiffin isn't doing much other than sitting around Oxford. Sarcasm aside, he probably has to. We just haven't shown improvement despite investing considerably on D. At some point, the players are going to mentally give up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OG_C2X Posted December 11, 2020 Share Posted December 11, 2020 (edited) 8 hours ago, Rolni said: Is Joe Barry a solid candidate or just a family member? Joe Barry was in Tampa with Gruden. Is the AHC and Linebackers coach in LAR and has been a DC before. Bonus points: Cory Littleton is his guy!! Edited December 11, 2020 by OG_C2X Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakdb36 Posted December 11, 2020 Share Posted December 11, 2020 (edited) On 12/9/2020 at 10:21 PM, big_palooka said: Does anyone really believe that Gruden will move on from Guenther? It's one of my biggest pet peeves. His coaching staff is a collection of old "Gruden guys' vs. a staff with some potential for growth. In the past he championed guys like Jay Gruden, McVay, Shanahan, Morris, Tomlin. Now we have Greg Olson who inspires next to nothing. "Good friend Paul Guenther" some old retreads from his Tampa staff like Morton, Wilson, Marinelli, etc. I still find it funny that in all his time away, this is the best staff he could put together on return. If the staff was only made of young, potentially up and coming but mostly unknown coaches, you'd say how could he not bring in more experienced guys. Thing is there are some young coaches on this staff but how could we know what they'll become at this point? For example, Frank Smith has done a great job with the TEs and is 39 years old. I have no idea if he's going to land a bigger role in the future but how could you know he won't? Did you already know McVay was going to become a HC when he was an offensive assistant under Gruden? I'm sure you had never heard his name at the time. Edited December 11, 2020 by oakdb36 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Posted December 12, 2020 Share Posted December 12, 2020 Totally forgot the thread topic reading through this last page lol. DC is still my guy. Just wanted to say it again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 Last 2 weeks have been rough for Carr. He needs to finish strong these last 4 games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankie2Gunz Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 3 hours ago, big_palooka said: Last 2 weeks have been rough for Carr. He needs to finish strong these last 4 games. He had 400 yards and 4 TD's last week against the Jets. Was he flawless, no he was not but what more do you expect from the guy? He did everything possible to put us ina position to win. Russell Wilson has hit a rough patch lately, Josh Allen had a few terrible games in the middle of the year, Lamar jackson has been terrible throwing the ball all year. You guys expect perfection from Carr and I think that is illogical. If last week was "rough" for Carr (400 yards and 4TD's) , tell me what you expect for him to finish strong? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 15 minutes ago, Frankie2Gunz said: He had 400 yards and 4 TD's last week against the Jets. Was he flawless, no he was not but what more do you expect from the guy? He did everything possible to put us ina position to win. Russell Wilson has hit a rough patch lately, Josh Allen had a few terrible games in the middle of the year, Lamar jackson has been terrible throwing the ball all year. You guys expect perfection from Carr and I think that is illogical. If last week was "rough" for Carr (400 yards and 4TD's) , tell me what you expect for him to finish strong? Quoting stats really doesn't mean anything, does it? And you are for whatever reason misrepresenting his stats. He was 381 and3 TDs last week. And a big part of that came on the last minute hail marry. Over the last 2 weeks, he's missed some throws. When they can't rely on the running game and he starts to get pressure he reverts back to some bad habits. I don't expect Carr perfection. I do expect him to show he can play at a high level in December when the games matter. And I expect him to elevate his game when the running game isn't there for him. Today will be a big test. The Colts don't give up yards on the ground and they take away the TE. I want to see how Carr plays today under these circumstances. I am a Carr guy and I find nothing wrong with saying he needs to finish strong down the stretch as last year, he folded down the stretch. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frankie2Gunz Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 3 minutes ago, big_palooka said: Quoting stats really doesn't mean anything, does it? And you are for whatever reason misrepresenting his stats. He was 381 and3 TDs last week. And a big part of that came on the last minute hail marry. Over the last 2 weeks, he's missed some throws. When they can't rely on the running game and he starts to get pressure he reverts back to some bad habits. I don't expect Carr perfection. I do expect him to show he can play at a high level in December when the games matter. And I expect him to elevate his game when the running game isn't there for him. Today will be a big test. The Colts don't give up yards on the ground and they take away the TE. I want to see how Carr plays today under these circumstances. I am a Carr guy and I find nothing wrong with saying he needs to finish strong down the stretch as last year, he folded down the stretch. 386 and 4TD's to be exact (he had one rushing and yes those count). "He missed throws" Totally subjective and with no context given. Nearly every QB that is pressured looks bad, I'm not sure what you point is. I would also not say that Carr folded down the stretch last year, the TD passes weren't there but once again who was he throwing the ball too? Guys who are now unemployed or should be (Rico Gafford, Ateman, Zay Jones) and other bums who I cant remember. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drfrey13 Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 28 minutes ago, big_palooka said: Quoting stats really doesn't mean anything, does it? And you are for whatever reason misrepresenting his stats. He was 381 and3 TDs last week. And a big part of that came on the last minute hail marry. Over the last 2 weeks, he's missed some throws. When they can't rely on the running game and he starts to get pressure he reverts back to some bad habits. I don't expect Carr perfection. I do expect him to show he can play at a high level in December when the games matter. And I expect him to elevate his game when the running game isn't there for him. Today will be a big test. The Colts don't give up yards on the ground and they take away the TE. I want to see how Carr plays today under these circumstances. I am a Carr guy and I find nothing wrong with saying he needs to finish strong down the stretch as last year, he folded down the stretch. Thankfully the Colts have Rivers at QB which is good for us. In 2018-19 the Rivers led offenses have averaged 22 points against our defense which was well below our averages those years. If we can force him into some bad throws we should win the TO battle which leaves it up to the offense in this game. Indy is a good team but we have a shot if Carr and the offense can sustain drives. Both of my keys are highly dependent on Abram and Jacobs playing. Wish we had Heath back there since he seems to have a nose for the ball more so than anyone else on the defense. Time to tell Beasley to go hit the QB. Hit him hard, hit him late I do not care. He needs to know we are coming after him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted December 13, 2020 Share Posted December 13, 2020 3 hours ago, Frankie2Gunz said: 386 and 4TD's to be exact (he had one rushing and yes those count). "He missed throws" Totally subjective and with no context given. Nearly every QB that is pressured looks bad, I'm not sure what you point is. I would also not say that Carr folded down the stretch last year, the TD passes weren't there but once again who was he throwing the ball too? Guys who are now unemployed or should be (Rico Gafford, Ateman, Zay Jones) and other bums who I cant remember. Arguing with you about Carr is wasted key strokes I've noticed, so I'll save them until I see what he does today. My point is, he has to play well down the stretch. That's it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolni Posted December 14, 2020 Share Posted December 14, 2020 On 12/11/2020 at 3:10 AM, OG_C2X said: Joe Barry was in Tampa with Gruden. Is the AHC and Linebackers coach in LAR and has been a DC before. Bonus points: Cory Littleton is his guy!! I "knew" that after a google search, my question is whether he is a good DC candidate or not? How successful was he as a DC? How much of this years Rams D is on him? Etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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