2020 GDT Week #14 Steelers at Bills

[MOSteelers56]

This is the first time in any of Ben's annual "I'm going to retire" schtick that I actually want him to actually do it. We're stuck with Ben as the QB. He doesn't move around as well, he hinders our run game, he throws stupid picks, he is too in love with the short passing game, and he's going to cost us way too much. We could probably win a SB with Ben, but his salary would need to be half of what it is now. 

[43M]

34 minutes ago, MOSteelers56 said:

I think we're just getting gassed more than not adjusting. Or they go hand in hand. I don't think it's all on lack of adjustments. Plus, how many adjustments can we feasibly make with no linebackers?

Last week we got toasted by McKissic and Logan Thomas.

This week, Stephon Diggs running crossing routes.

We lost our two fastest LBs to serious knee injuries....then another backup ILB.    

If we were moving the ball more and keeping it away from opposing offenses, it wouldnt be as much of a problem.   Now that teams have basically figured out how to shut us down....its a major issue.

[August4th]

2 minutes ago, MOSteelers56 said:

This is the first time in any of Ben's annual "I'm going to retire" schtick that I actually want him to actually do it. We're stuck with Ben as the QB. He doesn't move around as well, he hinders our run game, he throws stupid picks, he is too in love with the short passing game, and he's going to cost us way too much. We could probably win a SB with Ben, but his salary would need to be half of what it is now. 

ben retiring would make it easier to bring back Juju, Bud and others

they can find a QB to do what Ben is doing but at a cheaper price. Ben is turning into a case keenum type QB, but without the ability to do Playaction..so he might be turning into something worse..

[August4th]

on a more positive note

I like what I was seeing from Higmsith. He was getting a good amount of pressure last night in the 1st half. he looks like a vet out there, not a 3rd RD rookie making his first few starts. hopefully he keeps improving going forward.

Edited December 14, 2020 by August4th

[Dcash4]

48 minutes ago, MOSteelers56 said:

What is your guess as to why they stopped? I didn't notice us doing it in the first half of the season, but I'm not very good at recognizing schemes. I basically just watch the games. I don't understand the schemes watching live without having someone break it down. 

To answer the bold, we really seem to have reverted back to the 2018 "Ben Ball". I have no clue why we have actually gotten away from the early season stuff - we have completely lost motion and multi-receiver runs. Anything we gave Canada credit for early has disappeared - which is troubling, because the success has disappeared with it.  

Fichtner has a simple offense. A lot of it is driven on single receiver route concepts. That's a problem in the NFL, especially when you don't have a long list of variety (we don't). Unless you have an AB stud, you need multiple facets happening in route combo. Even then with AB, you portion the talent off to one side, give option routes to the lone and on the backside run the route games with 2/3 receiving options. We had success in 2018 putting up numbers because AB was all world and JuJu was dangerous as a number 2. Talent was lifting up scheme. We don't have those kinds of talents anymore to allow our scheme to be sub-par. [Edit: Meant to finish my thought. We put up numbers but still failed often in situation football when Scheme needs to beat scheme.]

Way, way waywayway too often we are running single receiver concepts. The crosser "pick/screens", but only one receiver is the main threat. Watch the way KC runs the mesh concept. Its for multiple reads at different levels of the field.  Those slant screens we have loved on 3rd and short are a great check at the line, but 1) we are way to obvious now and 2) it leaves you no outlet if the first look isn't there. Just think of it like when you would play back yard football -- its really just, okay...you run a go, lets have the slot run an out, the TE, just set up and find green and the backside X run a go. The receivers have a route, Ben picks his favorite, that's where the ball is supposed to go. There's no reading post snap, there's no moving defenders, there's no complexity. It's high school level stuff and after 10+ weeks of tape is pretty easy to see why it fails against NFL coaching. 

Take the last interception. It was a crosser to Diontea. But the look was NEVER there. They had a non-threat route by JuJu, they had Ebron AND Samuels blocking, we had 2 defenders in the box in the middle of the field BECAUSE Ebron and Samuels were inside....blocking... and the safety on Washington's side crept up leaving a pressed Washington and then the offside safety being the lone guy to get to the middle of the field (he's not gonna get there...). It's a single receiver route -- Ben is going Johnson all the way, and it never had a shot. Should have known from the jump. Should have immediately known to go to Washington - snap, hold the safety, let it go. Instead we snap....Im throwing to Johnson because that's the play....man, its really not there...where do I go? Oh, Washington -- 5 minutes too late. 

I hate when Ben goes long on 3rd and short, but my driving force behind it is that we had no stick options. JuJu's "route" was 2 yards shy...because he was never supposed to get it. Apparently Randy is very confident in his playcalling abilities that the first look will be there to the point where your best receiver is a non-factor in the biggest drive of the game. Johnsons running a crosser short of the sticks cause, duh!, Ebron and Samuels are probably meant to leak....but where? In front of the crosser? That's fantastic design. And that leaves only Washington as the bail out -- deep ball....on 3rd and 4...in a game changing possession....with Ben Roethlisberger....a 17 year vet....yikes. 

The biggest issue is we are not smart enough, or we dont care enough to get smarter, to create concepts that put defenders at a decision. Its baffling to me that we have an NFL offense when we are clearly no better than a high school coach level. 

Something I saw that was also concerning watching some of the game back. Our whole receiving core is bad at getting off the line. The ball is in Ben's hands before all of our guys break 1 yard off the line. But Claypool? Whoof. He doesn't look like he even knows the ball is snapped. Ben is hitting his hitch before guys break 5 yards. So we run a short passing attack in which guys cannot get to their routes and lack the ability to separate on their own. We are very smart. 

But dont worry -- better execution will help. 

Edited December 14, 2020 by Dcash4
Added a thought I forgot to finish

[warfelg]

39 minutes ago, MOSteelers56 said:

What is your guess as to why they stopped? I didn't notice us doing it in the first half of the season, but I'm not very good at recognizing schemes. I basically just watch the games. I don't understand the schemes watching live without having someone break it down. 

All honesty: Ben. I think he felt that his options were limited. 

[warfelg]

7 minutes ago, Dcash4 said:

But dont worry -- better execution will help. 

I mean honestly it is execution at all levels.  WR's running crisper routes, Ben making good reads, the OL blocking well, and the offensive staff executing a game plan.  

 

I'm tired of seeing a gameplan that looks like it should work, followed by 2/3 busted plays, then total abandonment of that gameplan.  The first 3 plays last night were there and it was player execution that failed.  Juju was drawing White all night and they did nothing to put them in a bind via groupings, or anything else.  Then Ben kept forcing it at the other corner who had safety and inside help.  The bubble to DJ on the first play showed the opening was there to do things like that but then he dropped it.  His comeback on the 3rd play was there but he didn't get deep enough and stopped his route almost leading to a pick-6.  I'm tired of most of these plays working, the players screwing up, then the coaches being like "whatever".

I think it's part of the problem with this team right now.  They know if they don't execute well in the first few snaps then they will just go to the same old tired crap of an offense.  So they stress so much about making a play that they don't just let the game flow.  Diontae is great in space but he's trying too hard to make plays after the catch, so I would bring him on a sweep at some time and hand it to him or do the under shovel pass they did to Juju and Heath in the past.  Basically make it really simple to get the ball in his hands and let him go.  James Washington needs to get a few more outs and comeback passes his way for Ben to get a hold of how good he is.  They need to start using Claypool as a decoy with Juju stacked under him running an out.  When guys go deep we need more posts, corners, slugo's, double moves.  We run the same 5 routes with the same 7 yard break point: go, slant, cross, out, comeback.  So opposing defenses sit on that and wait for it.

I'm tired of this lousy excuse of an offensive staff saying "oh we got playmakers" and then doing jack to help them make plays, putting way too much on their shoulders.

[warfelg]

And right on cue there's the Steelers PR guy Ed Bouchette making excuses for Ben and saying he's not done. lol

[43M]

26 minutes ago, warfelg said:

And right on cue there's the Steelers PR guy Ed Bouchette making excuses for Ben and saying he's not done. lol

Douchette has nothing of value to say, yet he acts like he knows everything.

Honestly not sure who I dislike more....him or Mark Madden.     At least with Madden, pretty much no one takes him seriously.   Alot of Yinzers think Douchette is all knowing.   

[warfelg]

1 minute ago, 43M said:

Douchette has nothing of value to say, yet he acts like he knows everything.

Honestly not sure who I dislike more....him or Mark Madden.     At least with Madden, pretty much no one takes him seriously.   Alot of Yinzers think Douchette is all knowing.   

For me it's Mark Madden.  At least Bouchette admits when he's wrong.  Mark Madden just calls you out and blocks you.

[Dcash4]

11 minutes ago, warfelg said:

I mean honestly it is execution at all levels.  WR's running crisper routes, Ben making good reads, the OL blocking well, and the offensive staff executing a game plan. 

You're right, but I consider scheme and execution to be two separate pieces that work in conjunction with each other. Execution is the physical, Scheme is the mental. One can't work - properly or consistently - without the other. It doesn't matter about your execution if the play is flawed from the jump. Both teams are meant to execute. And when both teams execute their plans well, you need to have a better plan to execute. Our problem is that we are bad at both aspects. 

I agree with what you say about seemingly abandoning the game plan at first sign of trouble, but I also don't think Fichtner/Ben's game plan is very deep. There is far too big a feel of "we run X because we run X" instead of "we run X because you run Y" . What other teams do doesn't seem to dictate how we call plays, which is why we so often see repeated plays (even back to back, two weeks in a row now at the end of the game). 

I gotta stop thinking about this offense...its making me very frustrated. 

[warfelg]

Saw what you will about Geoff Schwartz (god does he homer the Chiefs and his brother) but he makes a good point:

 

Edited December 14, 2020 by warfelg

[August4th]

1 hour ago, warfelg said:

Saw what you will about Geoff Schwartz (god does he homer the Chiefs and his brother) but he makes a good point:

 

I agree with him on the lack of "easy" plays in this offense. we rarely see a 20-25 yard pass play to a wide open receiver in this offense.A successful screen pass for us is in the 8-11 yards range..we NEVER see one of these million WR screens pop off for 30 yards like the one screen pass the DC team ran against us last week. we have to work for every yard in this offense

Edited December 14, 2020 by August4th

[Shady Slim]

as meh as ben has been these past couple of weeks and he hasn't been great it's been teamwide issues, he's not the only issue in this side which is what some of the more anti-ben parts of the fanbase would have you think

as august says just above, we haven't had chunk plays coming out of good play design.

the line has meant the rush offense can't get going

the d is banged up everywhere and we were missing our two fastest linebackers - losing bud was absolutely huge

and ofc the drops on offense which, as meh as ben's been, would make the guy look a lot better if they went to hand!!

@warfelg has got it absolutely right when he says it's down to the execution - the saints and brees, and, heck, us earlier in the season, showed you can roll through teams with a quarterback who doesn't have the deep ball he used to have. but even if ben's arm was as good as ten years ago, the way that we're failing to execute basic plays and outscheme guys on offense means we'd have the same predicament

[DR43]

My mock draft:

1. Travis Etienne RB Clemson

2. Jamie Newman QB Georgia

3. Jabril Cox OLB LSU

4. Dillon Radunz OT N Dakota State

7a. Ty Fryfogle WR Indiana

7b. Tariq Castro-Fields CB Penn State

7c. Palaie Gaoteote IV ILB USC