strat1080 Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 6 hours ago, incognito_man said: Our defenses are on the same tier, so will come down to which offense plays better. I like us in this one. Haha. Thanks. I needed a laugh. Minnesota is giving up a full yard less per carry and has only given up 1 20+ yard run. We've given up a league worst 7 20+ yard runs. I don't think Minnesota allows a friggin 17 play 9 minute drive against Dallas like our soft defense did. I think both pass defenses are comparable but I do think Minny's secondary is better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strat1080 Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 2 hours ago, packfanfb said: If we had Minny's defense with Rodgers and co, you could book your SB tickets today. Let's say for sake of argument we are on the same "tier" as them (not sure i buy that)...we are near of the bottom of that "tier" and they are closer to the top of it. incognito will forever drink the Capers Kool Aid. Then when we get smoked again in the playoffs we will be back to square one trying to figure out why Dom Capers can never lead a competent defense. That's my problem with Capers defenses. Incompetence. They look like a High School squad against elite QBs and good offenses. You can throw out all the numbers you want but at the end of the day I want a defense that can at least stop the bleeding come playoff time. That's the crazy thing. A lot of times the defense even has solid regular season statistics (think 2009 and 2012) but come playoff time it literally looks like Alabama vs Appalachian State. Supposedly we were a Top 5 defense in 2009 and then Kurt Warner posts probably the best playoff game in NFL history against Capers' defense. We were solid in 2012 and Kapaernick and the 49ers drop almost 600 yards on us. I don't think Matt Ryan even broke a sweat in the NFCCG. Its aggravating. Aaron Rodgers is getting the Dan Marino treatment. This organization can just simply not build a complete team around him. I saw a graphic the other day on The Herd where he compared Top 10 defenses that the elite QBs have played with. Big Ben's had 9. Brady has had 6. P Manning had 5. Brees and Rodgers both have had just 2. Aaron Rodgers keeps leading garbage teams to the playoffs only for them to be completely overmatched by teams that are just simply better. The sad thing is the Packers offense hasn't really invested all that much on the offensive side of the ball. That is the great myth of Peyton Manning. The Colts invested heavily into 1st round picks at RB, WR, and TE yet still fielded credible defenses. The Packers in the meantime have actually been worse than those Colts teams on the defensive side of the ball and haven't invested heavily in offensive skills position. We have a bunch of WRs and TEs that can't get open. I totally agree with Colin Cowherd that this team is basically just an average team. Aaron Rodgers makes guys like Jordy Nelson, Davante Adams, and James Jones have more TD production than the Julio Jones, AJ Greens, and Beckham's of the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incognito_man Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 57 minutes ago, strat1080 said: Haha. Thanks. I needed a laugh. Minnesota is giving up a full yard less per carry and has only given up 1 20+ yard run. We've given up a league worst 7 20+ yard runs. I don't think Minnesota allows a friggin 17 play 9 minute drive against Dallas like our soft defense did. I think both pass defenses are comparable but I do think Minny's secondary is better. You don't really know what you are talking about here. MIN is 19th in yds/drive, GB is 22nd. MIN is 20th in plays/drive, GB is 25th. MIN is 19th in turnovers/drive, GB is 6th. MIN is 9th in pts/drive, GB is 17th. MIN is 15th in DPR, GB is 18th. Same tier virtually across the board. I know a lot of fans want Minnesota's defense to be so much better because it fits their agenda, but it hasn't been so far. Sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incognito_man Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 55 minutes ago, strat1080 said: incognito will forever drink the Capers Kool Aid. Funny how posting facts and being a realist makes one a kool aid drinker to some. Shows how far out of touch those people are. I've never swayed from my opinions on Dom where are factually verifiable: he is an above average DC that excels more than other DCs when he has the right pieces. Most DCs do well with great talent, Dom does even better. He also does an above average job regardless and it's silly to want him fired unless you can replace him with someone you are very confident is better. Not many exist, and most of those that do are employed at either higher levels (HC) or equal levels (DC). It's unfortunate you choose to ignore reality, however. I'll never understand that mindset. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squire12 Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 Points per game allowed: GB 20th, MN 8th Opponents 3rd down conversion %: GB 19th, MN 1st All depends on what statistics you want to look at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 1 hour ago, strat1080 said: incognito will forever drink the Capers Kool Aid. Then when we get smoked again in the playoffs we will be back to square one trying to figure out why Dom Capers can never lead a competent defense. That's my problem with Capers defenses. Incompetence. They look like a High School squad against elite QBs and good offenses. You can throw out all the numbers you want but at the end of the day I want a defense that can at least stop the bleeding come playoff time. That's the crazy thing. A lot of times the defense even has solid regular season statistics (think 2009 and 2012) but come playoff time it literally looks like Alabama vs Appalachian State. Supposedly we were a Top 5 defense in 2009 and then Kurt Warner posts probably the best playoff game in NFL history against Capers' defense. We were solid in 2012 and Kapaernick and the 49ers drop almost 600 yards on us. I don't think Matt Ryan even broke a sweat in the NFCCG. Its aggravating. Aaron Rodgers is getting the Dan Marino treatment. This organization can just simply not build a complete team around him. I saw a graphic the other day on The Herd where he compared Top 10 defenses that the elite QBs have played with. Big Ben's had 9. Brady has had 6. P Manning had 5. Brees and Rodgers both have had just 2. Aaron Rodgers keeps leading garbage teams to the playoffs only for them to be completely overmatched by teams that are just simply better. The sad thing is the Packers offense hasn't really invested all that much on the offensive side of the ball. That is the great myth of Peyton Manning. The Colts invested heavily into 1st round picks at RB, WR, and TE yet still fielded credible defenses. The Packers in the meantime have actually been worse than those Colts teams on the defensive side of the ball and haven't invested heavily in offensive skills position. We have a bunch of WRs and TEs that can't get open. I totally agree with Colin Cowherd that this team is basically just an average team. Aaron Rodgers makes guys like Jordy Nelson, Davante Adams, and James Jones have more TD production than the Julio Jones, AJ Greens, and Beckham's of the league. You can't choose to focus on playoff production and exclusively blame the defense. Those two points just don't jive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incognito_man Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 17 minutes ago, squire12 said: Points per game allowed: GB 20th, MN 8th Opponents 3rd down conversion %: GB 19th, MN 1st All depends on what statistics you want to look at. Actually, MIN is 7th in scoring defense and GB is 14th currently. They flipped spots from last week when GB was 4th and MIN was 9th after MIN drew Chicago and GB drew Dallas. Pretty much same tier in scoring as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaitWhat Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 Agreeing with Colin Cowherd. Quick way to get yourself dismissed as a quack. And tell Cowherd any team sans a superstar QB is going to be average. Proceed to watch the sparks fly out of both ears of that hack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slinky Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 So some Packer fans think our defense is as good as Minny's? I really need to hang out here more during the week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaitWhat Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 And Jordy Nelson is one of the top receivers to ever play the game. Age will start to slow him down inevitably but to try and paint the guy like a goddamn bum just shows a general lack of knowledge about the game of football. Adams is on his way to following a similar career path. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaitWhat Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 Just now, Slinky said: So some Packer fans think our defense is as good as Minny's? I really need to hang out here more during the week. Nah. Keep on moving down the road. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaitWhat Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 1 hour ago, incognito_man said: Funny how posting facts and being a realist makes one a kool aid drinker to some. Shows how far out of touch those people are. I've never swayed from my opinions on Dom where are factually verifiable: he is an above average DC that excels more than other DCs when he has the right pieces. Most DCs do well with great talent, Dom does even better. He also does an above average job regardless and it's silly to want him fired unless you can replace him with someone you are very confident is better. Not many exist, and most of those that do are employed at either higher levels (HC) or equal levels (DC). It's unfortunate you choose to ignore reality, however. I'll never understand that mindset. Lots of these people try and use “THE EYE TEST!!!11” as a serious indicator. Of course pesky facts aren’t going to fit into their narrow views. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incognito_man Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 7 minutes ago, WaitWhat said: Lots of these people try and use “THE EYE TEST!!!11” as a serious indicator. Of course pesky facts aren’t going to fit into their narrow views. And I think most believe that Minnesota's defense should be better. I don't necessarily disagree. The pieces are there, but they aren't playing all that much better so far this year for whatever reason(s). GBs defense has also been more banged up so far, so I expect their play to only improve going forward. We'll see, but so far there's not a lot separating the two units' performance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpeightTheVillain Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 1 hour ago, squire12 said: Points per game allowed: GB 20th, MN 8th Opponents 3rd down conversion %: GB 19th, MN 1st All depends on what statistics you want to look at. He isn't saying GB is better at everything. It cuts both ways. They are generally similar. Yards per Completion - GB 9th, Min 17th Takeaways Per Game - GB 6th, Min 21st I don't get why everyone is slobbing all over Minnesota's defense. They simply haven't been a Top 5 defense this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheOnlyThing Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 57 minutes ago, incognito_man said: Actually, MIN is 7th in scoring defense and GB is 14th currently. They flipped spots from last week when GB was 4th and MIN was 9th after MIN drew Chicago and GB drew Dallas. Pretty much same tier in scoring as well. So the Vikes are a top 1/4 of the NFL team when it comes to scoring D while the Pack is top 1/2. I hope the Pack's D improves enough to become a top 10 (top 1/3) D as the season progresses. However, as the numbers make clear, the Pack's D is not currently in the "same tier" as the Vikes D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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