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PFT: Should Gruden be getting more heat?


beardown3231

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3 minutes ago, RaidersAreOne said:

Back to back years we completely choke our playoff position. He's had 3 years to install his vision for the team and all 3 years we've missed the playoffs. Gruden needs to go. 

Sentiment was good but it’s obvious we need a better coaching staff to take us to the playoffs, Gruden isn’t up to it. 

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11 minutes ago, Dessie said:

By your logic every team is wasting their time unless they have a rookie QB.  

No rookie qb “contract window“ Duration. You know rookie qbs get iirc 4 year deals as first rounders and 3yr as 2nd rounders iirc. Do ya homework Russ, flacco, pat etc etc Big Ben etc 

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4 minutes ago, NCOUGHMAN said:

No rookie qb “contract window“ Duration. You know rookie qbs get iirc 4 year deals as first rounders and 3yr as 2nd rounders iirc. Do ya homework Russ, flacco, pat etc etc Big Ben etc 

Yes with a 5th year option. Your strategy is that no team should bother paying a QB a 2nd contract. They should simply get a new rookie QB. 

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4 minutes ago, NCOUGHMAN said:

No rookie qb “contract window“ Duration. You know rookie qbs get iirc 4 year deals as first rounders and 3yr as 2nd rounders iirc. Do ya homework Russ, flacco, pat etc etc Big Ben etc 

Im Quite aware of the phenomenon of the rookie Deal QB.... but I don’t fully buy into it..... and neither do GMs..... otherwise they wouldn’t be extending QBs after these deals and definitely wouldn’t be giving non-elite starting QBs the contracts they get.  
 

the rookie deal qb thing looks at one relatively small Part of a championship rosters composition And ignores countless other factors and variables.

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1 minute ago, jimkelly02 said:

Im Quite aware of the phenomenon of the rookie Deal QB.... but I don’t fully buy into it..... and neither do GMs..... otherwise they wouldn’t be extending QBs after these deals and definitely wouldn’t be giving non-elite starting QBs the contracts they get.  
 

the rookie deal qb thing looks at one relatively small Part of a championship rosters composition And ignores countless other factors and variables.

It’s interesting but the proof is in the pudding who had paid their qbs past rookie deals w/o a sb win. 
-Matt Ryan, dalton, Stafford, Goff 

hm: wentz but philly won the sb without him

look at the fringe/playoff team qbs Still on rookie contract: Baker, Allen, Kyler*,  Lamar 

 

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20 minutes ago, NCOUGHMAN said:

It’s interesting but the proof is in the pudding who had paid their qbs past rookie deals w/o a sb win. 
-Matt Ryan, dalton, Stafford, Goff 

hm: wentz but philly won the sb without him

look at the fringe/playoff team qbs Still on rookie contract: Baker, Allen, Kyler*,  Lamar 

 

Clearly there’s a huge advantage to having a QB at 6-8M per and not 25-35M per for 4 years.

usually teams spend that money on building a defense. 
but the whole rookie qb idea ignores a Ton of variables. 
 

its not some magic formula.... it’s a small trend that requires several other conditions.... namely a top defense.  
 

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1 hour ago, oakdb36 said:

I'd bet on Miami being a one year wonder and regressing like the Jags did. The exact same was said about the Jags on this forum back then.

Thats an interesting take. I disagree with it. I guess it depends on the development of tua most. But texans about to give them another top 5 pick and they still got some cap space. They have resources to keep building it up. Tua would be the biggest question. 

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9 minutes ago, jimkelly02 said:

Clearly there’s a huge advantage to having a QB at 6-8M per and not 25-35M per for 4 years.

usually teams spend that money on building a defense. 
but the whole rookie qb idea ignores a Ton of variables. 
 

its not some magic formula.... it’s a small trend that requires several other conditions.... namely a top defense.  
 

Agree it’s not magic but it very successful formula 

id put the $ difference in the defense.

 

 

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Just now, NCOUGHMAN said:

Agree it’s not magic but it very successful formula 

id put the $ difference in the defense.

 

 

IM driving and can’t go into This in detail..... but the money advantage is overblown majorly IMO.  
teams regularly “waste” way more than then the Rookie QB savings.....

just look at us This year..... I’d say mayock wasted a Good 50-65M: Trent Brown, Ty Williams, Joyner, Nassib, M.Collins, Mariota.

plus..... with Carr at 22m and 20m the next 2 years the advantage of drafting a 1st Round QB isn’t much.  A rookie QB would cost 5-7M each of his first 2 years.  ThTs only a 1st year savings of approximately 17m and 2nd year of 13M.....

that doesn’t buy you much to be quite honest.
 

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Gruden could still work. But he really needs to take an overseeing approach. Gruden can still scheme a good offense. He just need a real offensive coordinator to add some more to it. His brother had sean mcvay and Matt Lafleur. He can get a young guy to come in bring more to his scheme and call plays. Hire a real defensive coordinator let him shape his scheme around players strengths. As we add more talent he adjust it. 

I do kinda agree that gruden playcalling mixed with carr is never going to.get us where we want to go. I rather try an offensive coordinator under gruden with carr first than a new qb with gruden play calling. 

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45 minutes ago, jimkelly02 said:

And again..... it’s not even a formula.... those teams weren’t built with that as the plan....

Seattle drafted Wilson in the 3rd to be a backup but hit gold

Baltimore rode an insane defense and had a qb who Just didn’t mess up 

Their starting QB was Matt Flynn. Doubt they drafted Wilson to back him up lol 

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