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Bears vs. Jags - GDT


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11 hours ago, Superman(DH23) said:

Not to mention my nightmare scenario is Tru goes to Minny or SF and lights it up in a system that will allow him to really flourish

He would be an absolute stud in San Fran.

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19 hours ago, Sugashane said:

 

Both sucked. Trubisky was less of a liability but was asked to do less too. But again, he had much less to work with than Mayfield. If you feel I'm wrong feel free to correct me with logic rather than a Bearable-like exaggeration.

Sure, we can do nonsensical snowball arguments. If that's the case I cant wait for Mahomes to live in the great Mayfield's shadow.

You're simply living in the moment, is all. And I'd imagine you've realized that by now. My argument wasn't nonsensical at all. Overall, Mayfield is a better quarterback than Trubisky. 

You've got a white knuckle grip on the steering wheel there, bud, and you're doing an admirable job of keeping it between the ditches, as they say. But look down. That square pedal down there is the brakes. 

Pump them a bit. 

I get it--the Bears are on the best offensive tear since before even I, an old bastard, was born. Gale Sayers was their running back then, fer cryin' out loud!

And that's very cool. But it doesn't make Trubisky something he isn't. When the color guy talks about him making mistakes that high schoolers shouldn't be making...that should give you pause. Also--are sure that Trubisky has all that much less to work with than Mayfield? That's the cornerstone of my whole position that the Bears simply should not have been as bad as they were--they have some interesting pieces on offense. While the unit as a whole is lacking, they should have done a lot more than we've seen thus far. Montgomery has emerged, and we now have a playcaller with a level head that doesn't abandon the run. That's the magic formula, right there.

Now...Mitch is 26. Could he still, yet, improve? Sure. I'm on record as saying I don't think that's probably going to happen, but I was also wrong about how the defense would play this year. Some things are hard to call. I'll give you this, though, the pass he threw to Mooney in the back of the end zone--which was incomplete/out of bounds, but only just barely--was the best pass I've ever seen Mitch throw. Even better than the anticipation strike to Robinson for a touchdown in the Tampa game in 2018. 

Edited by Heinz D.
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On 12/27/2020 at 12:10 PM, Ty21 said:

It’s funny watching receivers being good at juking cause it always sends me back 15 years to Bernard Berrien catching a screen, trying to juke but standing in place and fooling no one for like 3 seconds and getting tackled for no gain and everything thinking he was a great wr

i miss @berrianburns80

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51 minutes ago, HuskieBear said:

wait, Buck, you switch allegiances from the vikes to the jags? 

Yep.  After 50 years with no Super Bowls I've finally had enough.  It has just gotten to the point where it isn't much fun following football anymore, so I needed a change.  People can call me a bandwagon jumper if they want to, but as far as I'm concerned, 50 years of my life is plenty of time to give the Vikings the chance.

The Jags haven't been too good either, but I like the way they cleaned house and went after their franchise QB.  It's what I've been saying the Vikings should do for a couple of years now.  That's just never going to happen, so it dawned on me, why don't I just start cheering for the team that does it the way I would do it if I were the owner?  In a few years I'm going to move down South anyway, so I'm just getting a head start.  I'll always be happy for the Vikings if they are winning, but my team is the Jaguars from now on.

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1 hour ago, Uncle Buck said:

Yep.  After 50 years with no Super Bowls I've finally had enough.  It has just gotten to the point where it isn't much fun following football anymore, so I needed a change.  People can call me a bandwagon jumper if they want to, but as far as I'm concerned, 50 years of my life is plenty of time to give the Vikings the chance.

The Jags haven't been too good either, but I like the way they cleaned house and went after their franchise QB.  It's what I've been saying the Vikings should do for a couple of years now.  That's just never going to happen, so it dawned on me, why don't I just start cheering for the team that does it the way I would do it if I were the owner?  In a few years I'm going to move down South anyway, so I'm just getting a head start.  I'll always be happy for the Vikings if they are winning, but my team is the Jaguars from now on.

Wow. You seriously gave them up? 

Crazy. 

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7 hours ago, Heinz D. said:

You're simply living in the moment, is all. And I'd imagine you've realized that by now. My argument wasn't nonsensical at all. Overall, Mayfield is a better quarterback than Trubisky. 

You've got a white knuckle grip on the steering wheel there, bud, and you're doing an admirable job of keeping it between the ditches, as they say. But look down. That square pedal down there is the brakes. 

Pump them a bit. 

I get it--the Bears are on the best offensive tear since before even I, an old bastard, was born. Gale Sayers was their running back then, fer cryin' out loud!

And that's very cool. But it doesn't make Trubisky something he isn't. When the color guy talks about him making mistakes that high schoolers shouldn't be making...that should give you pause. Also--are sure that Trubisky has all that much less to work with than Mayfield? That's the cornerstone of my whole position that the Bears simply should not have been as bad as they were--they have some interesting pieces on offense. While the unit as a whole is lacking, they should have done a lot more than we've seen thus far. Montgomery has emerged, and we now have a playcaller with a level head that doesn't abandon the run. That's the magic formula, right there.

Now...Mitch is 26. Could he still, yet, improve? Sure. I'm on record as saying I don't think that's probably going to happen, but I was also wrong about how the defense would play this year. Some things are hard to call. I'll give you this, though, the pass he threw to Mooney in the back of the end zone--which was incomplete/out of bounds, but only just barely--was the best pass I've ever seen Mitch throw. Even better than the anticipation strike to Robinson for a touchdown in the Tampa game in 2018. 

Nope, check my posts if you need to verify. I've said both suck for a long while and stand by it. You didn't say that Mayfield was better overall. You said -

Quote

He's better in every conceivable way over Trubisky.

I then directly pointed out several ways that he isn't. So yes, you were being nonsensical. That isn't a ringing endorsement for Trubisky in any way, that is saying one mediocre player has some better traits than another mediocre one. I've said repeatedly that Tru is better than Foles, but that's not a big deal at all. So are 50 other QBs (or at least including young guys with enough upside to take them over him). I've said not to re-sign Tru, the only reason I'd keep him was for about $7-8 mil After that it needs to be nothing but performance bonuses. if we were somehow able to dump Foles' deal. If we have one, get rid of the other. No reason to have 2 overpaid guys to take snaps.

I actually believe you are the one living in the moment. Mayfield being better than a back up QB shouldn't be something to crow about. He still isn't worth the big second deal, and I look forward to that being shown when they can't stock ridiculous talent around him. Is he better than Kizer, Brady Quinn, etc like they've had over the last 20 years? Definitely. That doesn't mean a lot though. Why brag about someone who is sub-Kirk Cousins?

IF you've watched Mayfield you would realize the irony in the bold. That is literally what happens with Mayfield too. lol

Am I sure Mayfield has a better cast around him then Tru? **** yes. That's ridiculous to even try to compare. lol   Better WR corps, better TE, Montgomery would be their #3 RB, OL is significantly better... How is it even close? Also if you aren't "living in the moment" how are you trying to support your claim that Tru might have a better cast when using only the last several weeks of their games? Pretty contradictory there... Tru had a hell of a run in 2018, McCown had a great run, etc etc. Who care? Look at their average play. Pick out handfuls of games and Grossman or Cutler can look like football gods. Look at another handful though and you wonder why Nathan Peterson is playing in someone else's jersey.  That's also why I'm not going to be too impressed about the throw to Mooney. He seems to constantly balance out the 'wow' throws with "wtf throws.'

And maybe the Bears should have been better, I agree... but so should CLE's passing attack, hell so should their overall offense. You have that much talent and don't even have a top 15 offense in YPG? You have better position match ups in 3/4 of the spots (and that is conservatively IMO) but still less passing yards than Chicago (with a "franchise" QB)? The top 5 in rushing is expected with that OL and RB duo, so they got that down at least. Even with that they still only have the 14th most PPG.

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6 hours ago, Uncle Buck said:

Yep.  After 50 years with no Super Bowls I've finally had enough.  It has just gotten to the point where it isn't much fun following football anymore, so I needed a change.  People can call me a bandwagon jumper if they want to, but as far as I'm concerned, 50 years of my life is plenty of time to give the Vikings the chance.

The Jags haven't been too good either, but I like the way they cleaned house and went after their franchise QB.  It's what I've been saying the Vikings should do for a couple of years now.  That's just never going to happen, so it dawned on me, why don't I just start cheering for the team that does it the way I would do it if I were the owner?  In a few years I'm going to move down South anyway, so I'm just getting a head start.  I'll always be happy for the Vikings if they are winning, but my team is the Jaguars from now on.

Cheer for who you want. I know a lot of people are hardcore fans that will root for their team through whatever, and that's cool, but you owe the team nothing IMO.

I'll always be a Bears fan but I loved some guys coming out of the draft and in college so I'll root for them any Sunday. Henry, Mahomes, etc are guys I've loved. Rodgers is my 2nd favorite draft prospect so I hate seeing hm do well for GB but still love the game he plays.

Congrats on winning the Lawrence sweepstakes. I'd buy a (knockoff) Darnold jersey to celebrate  lol

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6 hours ago, Heinz D. said:

Wow. You seriously gave them up? 

Crazy. 

Yep.  It was just time for a change.  I've been thinking about it for a while and figured now was a good time to jump ship to the Jags.  They have a LONG way to go before they will be competitive, but at least they will have a good QB prospect to start with. 

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This is just my opinion on who is better (not that you guys asked or that it carries any weight)......but based ONLY what they have shown so far in the NFL and not what they would or not be in some parallel universe. 

IMO, There's not much of a gap between Mitch and Mayfield, if any, and I certainly wouldn't bet my future on either of them.  Neither are capable of uplifting an offense. If I were forced to choose between which QB is better right now I would probably take Mayfield over Mitch (only because I think he has a higher ceiling) but I certainly be excited over it either --it would almost be similar to choosing Foles over Mitch.  However, in THIS offense...it would be Mitch. 

Both QBs are similar in several ways and also different in small areas. Both can look good when given plenty of time in the pocket. But both of them struggle with consistency in alot of the major areas needed for a QB to succeed for a long period of time. 

Both make bad decisions at higher rate than is preferred. 
Both of their deep balls are terrible.
Both have accuracy issues.
Both lack of arm control. 
Both are below average at reading defenses.
Both are indecisive under pressure in the pocket leading either taking unnecessary sacks or ill-advised throws (to be polite).
Both of them are mentally weak. 

Both also have some other bad traits that the other QB doesn't seem to have. Mitch is a stand-up guy with no off-field history and his teammates love him --and how he handled the benching like a true professional-- whereas Mayfield can come of as an arrogant prick and that can easily rub people the wrong way and give off the wrong vibe.  On the other hand, Mayfield is better at going through his progressions at a faster rate whereas Mitch needs more time in the pocket to process what's going on around him and scan the field. 

Both also have some good traits that the other lacks as well. Mitch's mobility allows him to escape pressure at a higher rate, which is an asset in todays game, and also gives him the versatility advantage over Baker. On the other hand, piggy backing off of each of traits, Mitch is very fidgety in the pocket when his first reads are not there, whereas Baker is patience and sees the field better. 

TLDR: I've never used the word "both" so much while making a single point in my life. 

Both QB's are similar in different ways and both of them offer the same thing.....they both can make routine throws with regularity. And once in while make a throw that makes you go "WOW--he has potential", only to follow it up with a what-the-hell-are-you-doing throw at the worst times. 

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4 hours ago, Uncle Buck said:

Yep.  It was just time for a change.  I've been thinking about it for a while and figured now was a good time to jump ship to the Jags.  They have a LONG way to go before they will be competitive, but at least they will have a good QB prospect to start with. 

I can definitely relate to that. I've been miiiiiighty close to giving up on the Bears more than a few times. 

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18 hours ago, Uncle Buck said:

Yep.  After 50 years with no Super Bowls I've finally had enough.  It has just gotten to the point where it isn't much fun following football anymore, so I needed a change.  People can call me a bandwagon jumper if they want to, but as far as I'm concerned, 50 years of my life is plenty of time to give the Vikings the chance.

The Jags haven't been too good either, but I like the way they cleaned house and went after their franchise QB.  It's what I've been saying the Vikings should do for a couple of years now.  That's just never going to happen, so it dawned on me, why don't I just start cheering for the team that does it the way I would do it if I were the owner?  In a few years I'm going to move down South anyway, so I'm just getting a head start.  I'll always be happy for the Vikings if they are winning, but my team is the Jaguars from now on.

i feel that. there are too many people that become fans of their local team just because of where they grew up and who their parents rooted for (i'm looking in the mirror here). I'm genuinely a fan of the bears, cubs, and hawks, but man, i just don't find any joy in being a fan of the bulls - i was too young for the bulls of the 90's, really remember "becoming" a fan around 2000. I live in Denver now, and am very close to moving over to the Nuggets - i'll probably wait until i see what this new executive team does in chicago first. 

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14 hours ago, Sugashane said:

I then directly pointed out several ways that he isn't. So yes, you were being nonsensical. 

I believe you said Trubisky was a better runner, yes? That's true. However, he's still mightily confused as just when to run, and Mayfield isn't.

14 hours ago, Sugashane said:

I actually believe you are the one living in the moment. Mayfield being better than a back up QB shouldn't be something to crow about. 

Not "crowing" about anything. You said that you hated the Browns. I said that I felt that was weird, and while Mayfield might be an *******, he's a better quarterback than Trubisky in every conceivable way. I don't see how that qualifies for being pegged as "living in the moment"...or much of anything else, really. 

Edited by Heinz D.
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