Ragnarok Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 13 hours ago, Danger said: Winston has so many weapons.... there's no excuse unless his offensive line is on par with like... Seattle/Giants Looking at Winston, Goff, Wentz, Mariota, and I'll include Dak...Winston has the worst OL. Philly, TN, and Dallas have very good OLs and the Rams are much better with Whitworth and Sullivan. TB probably isn't too far behind LAR though. Marpet, Sweezy, and Dotson have been solid. But they all have very good supporting casts. Winston has the worst rushing attack as the other four are 14th at worst in terms of rush yards per game. TB is 27th. That may change with Martin back...but he's had to carry his offense more than the other four. But based on points per game, he might have the best defense. While TB is 30th in yards per game, 31st in pass yards per game, 28th in yards per play...they have been good against the run and in total points where they're they only one of these five teams in the top half of the league(which I hold in higher regard than yards). Part of that could be due to playing against Glennon and Eli in two of those games. It could also be due to a porous secondary that puts TB behind earlier in games. All this said, if I had to pick one of these five QBs to start a franchise, I'd take Jameis. His leadership and work ethic are impeccable, he has(imo) the highest ceiling of any of them, and his one major flaw is that he will try to do too much at times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BAConrad Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 The thing that scares me with Winston is that he really hasn't improved like the other young franchise QBs tend to. His first season was good for a rookie. He definitely showed his egregious decision making that year and the thing is, he wasn't that much better his sophomore year. His issues have been his accuracy, poor decision making, holding on to the ball.....etc. And everyone says hes a guy who supposedly watches so much film and is such an amazing QB off the field, so why hasn't he fixed those issues really? I'm not saying he won't ever get better , but the fact that it's taking him as long as it is is worrisome. His comp% has hovered around 59-60%....he turned the ball over more in his 2nd season and at times looked worse than as a rookie. And the Bucs have done all they can to put pieces around him to help. Drafting Godwin, signing Jackson, drafting OJ Howard...people thought this Bucs offense would be incredible but it really hasn't. He faced the worst secondary in the league on that TNF game and really didn't look great. He's thrown for 60.0%, 57.9%, and 56.5% against Finch, NYG, and NE. Put up 20+ pts in only 2 games. He just doesn't look like this amazing QB that people make him out to be when I watch him. Look at Lucks career up until this season where he's been hurt. from 2012-2014 He got better every year significantly, both individually and his team, advancing one round further in the postseason each year. Then he got hurt in 2015 and shouldn't have played at all. Last season you can tell he wasn't fully recovered and he still put up his highest comp% and ypa, while throwing for 31 tds and 13 picks. All while on such terrible teams. *Note: Just used Luck as one example. Wilson also improved as his career has gone on, Mariota has, Wentz and Goff have made big strides from their rookie years...Carr did so as well from year 1 to year 3/4. Get what I'm putting down?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iamcanadian Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 Way too early at this point, give it a year or 2 and maybe a reasonable answer could be given. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyU Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 12 hours ago, BAConrad said: The thing that scares me with Winston is that he really hasn't improved like the other young franchise QBs tend to. His first season was good for a rookie. He definitely showed his egregious decision making that year and the thing is, he wasn't that much better his sophomore year. His issues have been his accuracy, poor decision making, holding on to the ball.....etc. And everyone says hes a guy who supposedly watches so much film and is such an amazing QB off the field, so why hasn't he fixed those issues really? I'm not saying he won't ever get better , but the fact that it's taking him as long as it is is worrisome. His comp% has hovered around 59-60%....he turned the ball over more in his 2nd season and at times looked worse than as a rookie. And the Bucs have done all they can to put pieces around him to help. Drafting Godwin, signing Jackson, drafting OJ Howard...people thought this Bucs offense would be incredible but it really hasn't. He faced the worst secondary in the league on that TNF game and really didn't look great. He's thrown for 60.0%, 57.9%, and 56.5% against Finch, NYG, and NE. Put up 20+ pts in only 2 games. He just doesn't look like this amazing QB that people make him out to be when I watch him. Look at Lucks career up until this season where he's been hurt. from 2012-2014 He got better every year significantly, both individually and his team, advancing one round further in the postseason each year. Then he got hurt in 2015 and shouldn't have played at all. Last season you can tell he wasn't fully recovered and he still put up his highest comp% and ypa, while throwing for 31 tds and 13 picks. All while on such terrible teams. *Note: Just used Luck as one example. Wilson also improved as his career has gone on, Mariota has, Wentz and Goff have made big strides from their rookie years...Carr did so as well from year 1 to year 3/4. Get what I'm putting down?? Jameis numbers through 4 games this year( missed 1 game hurricane irma)... ARE CAREER HIGHS ACROSS THE BOARD... The Bucs are 2-2, Jameis is on pace for 4,700 yards passing, about 32 td passes, while completing over 61% of his passes and having a yards per attempt of 7.8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danger Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 Regardless of how you feel about Wentz, he's clearly on the upswing and improving with each week. Ignore the QBR. I'm sure someone can find Passer rating statistics that are more telling in that regard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patriotsheatyan Posted October 12, 2017 Author Share Posted October 12, 2017 38 minutes ago, JohnnyU said: Jameis numbers through 4 games this year( missed 1 game hurricane irma)... ARE CAREER HIGHS ACROSS THE BOARD... The Bucs are 2-2, Jameis is on pace for 4,700 yards passing, about 32 td passes, while completing over 61% of his passes and having a yards per attempt of 7.8 He's had one good game, which was against an 0-5 team. Like half of those yards came when trailing by a big margin against the Vikings and Patriots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyronnosaurus Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 3 minutes ago, patriotsheatyan said: He's had one good game, which was against an 0-5 team. Like half of those yards came when trailing by a big margin against the Vikings and Patriots. Never understood this logic. You play to win and the only way to win or come back from a deficit is to, well put up yards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyU Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 4 minutes ago, Tyronnosaurus said: Never understood this logic. You play to win and the only way to win or come back from a deficit is to, well put up yards. dude dont mind them, those probably the same guys that thought dak would have a sophomore slump lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 On 10/11/2017 at 10:38 AM, JohnnyU said: Dak Prescott Career stats Completion percentage: 66.3 Passing yards: 4,859 TD–INT: 34–8 Passer rating: 101.6 Rushing yards: 408 Rushing touchdowns: 8 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Carson Wentz Career Stats Passing yards: 5,144 TD–INT: 26–17 Passer rating: 83.4 Completion percentage: 62.4 Rushing yards: 258 Rushing touchdowns: 2 ----------------------------------------------------------------- Jared Goff Career Stats Passing completions: 212 Passing attempts: 369 Percentage: 57.5 TD–INT: 12–10 Passing yards: 2,449 Passer rating: 77.2 Ok these are the numbers i have posted for each of them, since it may be hard for you to do math. Right now the Eagles according to pff have the best oline in football and have a top 15 defense. The rams have a top 10 oline and a top 15 defense as well. The Cowboys oline is underperforming, zeke is outta shape, and their defense is rated 29th Like i said this is andrew luck vs. russell wilson part 2.. and what i mean by that is, people want wentz to be better than prescott so bad that they become fanboys. Same with Luck and Wilson from 2012, when in reality the stats show the comparison is not really close, and Prescott is closer to someone like Wilson and Rodgers than he is to Wentz. In fact, when you compare Prescott to Wentz, i feel you are in an unintentional way disrespecting Prescott Lol at comparing career stats when Dak had the Top OL, Top 2-3 RB, and a Top 10 WR. Wentz and Goff had both a Bottom 5 Overall supporting cast their rookie season. Probably only the 49er and Brown overall offensive casts were worse. If Wentz/Goff, especially Wentz, had Daks Offense their rookie year, would of been similar numbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
patriotsheatyan Posted October 12, 2017 Author Share Posted October 12, 2017 39 minutes ago, Tyronnosaurus said: Never understood this logic. You play to win and the only way to win or come back from a deficit is to, well put up yards. The fact of the matter is that it is easy to throw for yardage in the second half when trailing by multiple scores because the other team will let you, and at the very end you have an extra down to work with. It's not impressive to throw for 300 yards when trailing all game in 2017, and Winston's late game yardage in loses is the only thing superficially impressive about his totals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyronnosaurus Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 58 minutes ago, BayRaider said: Lol at comparing career stats when Dak had the Top OL, Top 2-3 RB, and a Top 10 WR. Wentz and Goff had both a Bottom 5 Overall supporting cast their rookie season. Probably only the 49er and Brown overall offensive casts were worse. If Wentz/Goff, especially Wentz, had Daks Offense their rookie year, would of been similar numbers. Can't you flip that for this year when Wentz's OL has been arguably the best and the Cowboys OL has clearly not been in the same stratosphere as they were last year? Plus had it not been for having one of the worst defenses in the league, Dak would be 4-1 this year. Not gonna argue who is better but if you use that argument for Dak last year it should definitely be used against Wentz this year. And while Dak still has Zeke, an offensive line is probably 75% of any running back ever aside from maybe 1 or 2 of the all time greats (I'll let you determine who those are). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master of Suspense Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 I think it's just too soon to ask this. Winston and Mariota have an extra year in the league so they look better by default with the extra experience. It's hard to say Goff and Wentz with god terrible the former was last year. I'm surprised the poll results are what they are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyU Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 4 hours ago, BayRaider said: Lol at comparing career stats when Dak had the Top OL, Top 2-3 RB, and a Top 10 WR. Wentz and Goff had both a Bottom 5 Overall supporting cast their rookie season. Probably only the 49er and Brown overall offensive casts were worse. If Wentz/Goff, especially Wentz, had Daks Offense their rookie year, would of been similar numbers. smh.. daks oline is not good this year., zeke hasnt been good this year, neither has dez.. if the cowboys had a top 15 d.. prescott would be in the running for mvp Philly has the number #1 oline this year, with a better defense, same with Jared goff which means limited chances at the ball for dak and guess what ,Dak still has a higher completion rate than wentz... Carson has a long way too go before he is on prescotts level. And i say this as a fan of the bucs and texans Carson aint that dude yall tryna to make him out to be, If Dak had a game that Wentz had last week it would be just another day at the office, but wentz does it.. and stop the presses he is the next aaron rodgers.. stuff is ridicolous man Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyU Posted October 12, 2017 Share Posted October 12, 2017 3 hours ago, Tyronnosaurus said: Can't you flip that for this year when Wentz's OL has been arguably the best and the Cowboys OL has clearly not been in the same stratosphere as they were last year? Plus had it not been for having one of the worst defenses in the league, Dak would be 4-1 this year. Not gonna argue who is better but if you use that argument for Dak last year it should definitely be used against Wentz this year. And while Dak still has Zeke, an offensive line is probably 75% of any running back ever aside from maybe 1 or 2 of the all time greats (I'll let you determine who those are). Dak is on pace for 43 total td's this year, and colin cowherd said he is worse than jared goff lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BAConrad Posted October 13, 2017 Share Posted October 13, 2017 Did you just saywe have the NUMBER ONE oline??? lmao Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.