What to do at QB?

[Cutler06]

27 minutes ago, jolly red giant said:

The only reason to pass on Fields at 1.09 was if you believed that Lock had the potential to be a franchise QB - and if that was the case then Lock has to be the starter.

Well, that’s ONE possibility but certainly not the only reason. Paton, more than likely didn’t see Fields or Jones as franchise QB, was possibly setting up Fangio/Lock to fail so he can bring in his own people, even wanted just to build up the defense to a superior level before bringing in his own people. There are more options than your habitual whining about Fields

[Cutler06]

14 minutes ago, AkronsWitness said:

Who is a bust? Justin Fields? Mac Jones? They havent played a game yet.

My point is you have to take the chance on them being franchise QBs. No prospect is guaranteed, but that cannot deter you from trying to draft them and helping them reach their potential. 

You miss 100% of the shots you dont take, and the Broncos have taken 1 legit shot since Elway retired (Cutler). Since then its been a revolving door of retread .500 level garbage.

I will also say, a franchise QB for your team is more important than a HOF CB. If the Broncos cared as much about drafting a franchise QB as they do stockpiling DBs, then the future would look a lot brighter.

They also aren’t Franchise QBs either. Lock has as much going for hum as either Fields or Jones as if this moment

Edited August 25, 2021 by Cutler06

[AKRNA]

5 minutes ago, BroncoBruin said:

Pro-Lock people are also really making an effort to exaggerate Teddy’s incompetence. Teddy isn’t bad and he’s capable of putting together some good stretches of QB play. 

I agree completely. I've gone back and watched all of Teddy's throws this preseason. He looks quite competent, good pocket presence and mental clock, quite accurate, can throw 30 yard darts and seems really comfortable.

I've seen plenty of below average QB play in my lifetime and that ain't it.

 

[AkronsWitness]

13 minutes ago, broncosfan_101 said:

Why would you “take a shot” on a QB that you think is gonna bust? That makes no sense. Was Paxton Lynch a good pick? Certainly better than taking Kenny Clark, Xavien Howard, or Chris Jones, right? 

Dude....you 'take a shot' on a QB with high upside and develop them. Who is saying anything about them busting. There will be a 'bust' factor with every player drafted but you cant let that scare you into never taking one.

How do you get a franchise QB if you keep passing on the obvious options (in this case Fields) for more CB depth.

If Justin Fields turns into a 3x Pro Bowler and 12 year franchise level starter--that is more important than if a CB turned into a 10x Pro Bowler and 15 year starter. The amount of importance a top 10 level starting QB makes to a franchise is infinietly more important than a CB.

If you were starting a team picking #1 overall. Would you take Matt Stafford or Champ Bailey to build around? If your answer is Champ Bailey, thats the reason the Broncos havent been competitive in 5+ years. I love Champ Bailey, but he doest effect Wins and Losses on a weekly basis like Stafford would.

Edited August 25, 2021 by AkronsWitness

[AkronsWitness]

15 minutes ago, Cutler06 said:

They also aren’t Franchise QBs either. Lock has as much going for hum as either Fields or Jones as if this moment

Drew Lock was statistically the worst starting QB in the NFL last year. While I 100% agree he should get the nod over Bridgewater--neither of them come close to the high level prospect Fields/Jones were and are.

Lock was a 2nd round QB and the Broncos passed on drafting him twice before finally selecting him.

He has much more upside I would have like to seen through compared to Teddy though.

Edited August 25, 2021 by AkronsWitness

[broncosfan_101]

22 minutes ago, AkronsWitness said:

Dude....you 'take a shot' on a QB with high upside and develop them. Who is saying anything about them busting. There will be a 'bust' factor with every player drafted but you cant let that scare you into never taking one.

How do you get a franchise QB if you keep passing on the obvious options (in this case Fields) for more CB depth.

If Justin Fields turns into a 3x Pro Bowler and 12 year franchise level starter--that is more important than if a CB turned into a 10x Pro Bowler and 15 year starter. The amount of importance a top 10 level starting QB makes to a franchise is infinietly more important than a CB.

If you were starting a team picking #1 overall. Would you take Matt Stafford or Champ Bailey to build around? If your answer is Champ Bailey, thats the reason the Broncos havent been competitive in 5+ years. I love Champ Bailey, but he doest effect Wins and Losses on a weekly basis like Stafford would.

It is entirely possible that Justin Fields has a fatal flaw that will prevent him from becoming a quality NFL starter, and that Paton identified it pre-draft. You don’t draft a QB you think will bust just because they’re a QB. Again, that’s insane. 

[germ-x]

Drew Lock sucks.  The fact that Teddy Bridgewater couldn’t hands down win the job shouldn’t be seen as encouraging.  

[Cutler06]

3 hours ago, AkronsWitness said:

Drew Lock was statistically the worst starting QB in the NFL last year. While I 100% agree he should get the nod over Bridgewater--neither of them come close to the high level prospect Fields/Jones were and are.

Lock was a 2nd round QB and the Broncos passed on drafting him twice before finally selecting him.

He has much more upside I would have like to seen through compared to Teddy though.

You seem to want to bring up Lock's past w/o acknowledging the progress he's shown this year, doesn't seem fair or accurate, just brought up to dig on Lock. And you have NO IDEA how Fields or Jones will turn out so at least don't try to present that as a fact. From what I have seen of Fields in the preseason, he has looked pedestrian at best, although I am on record as saying I would've like to see Fields here. To represent that they are SURE THINGS just show me that you have an agenda. And coming from a Browns fan, not sure what level of validity I want to take from your posts.

 

You are correct that Lock was a 2nd and we did pass on him twice (for 2 starters BTW) but you did leave out (or wanted to omit) that we also traded up to get him. 

My take is Teddy is a steadier, save-Vic's-job QB, I'd probably made the same choice if my balls were as small as Fangio's are right now. However, it does limit Lock's ongoing growth, his big play ability (also that of Hamler's too) which Bridgewater doesn't have seems like he's leaving it to the defense and the rest of the roster. Feels like Lock could've had the potential to take this offense to a higher level but at a higher risk. 

Edited August 26, 2021 by Cutler06

[Cutler06]

18 minutes ago, germ-x said:

Drew Lock sucks.  The fact that Teddy Bridgewater couldn’t hands down win the job shouldn’t be seen as encouraging.  

Did you see ANY of the progress Lock has made or did Lock date your sister ??

[germ-x]

1 hour ago, Cutler06 said:

Did you see ANY of the progress Lock has made or did Lock date your sister ??

So much progress that he couldn’t do enough to beat out Teddy Bridgewater?

Drew Lock and Teddy Bridgewater were 2 of the worst starters in the NFL last year.  Denver put them in a QB competition and looking at it, neither did enough to outright win.  Denver went into default mode and picked the guy they think is the safer player even though it could be easily argued that Lock slightly won the competition.

The only way this looks like a win for Denver is if one of them had taken the reigns and dominated camp…..neither did.

If you are for Teddy it’s because he’s smarter with the football and you’re hanging your hat on his 5 starts in NO can be replicated.  If you’re for Lock it’s because you think his talent will shine through and hanging your hat on a few starts where it looked like he could be a franchise QB.

At the end of the day both have enough out there that would say they’re good backups.  Denver put 2 high end backups in a QB competition.  They played like high end backups in camp.  QB is a problem position in Denver.

[Cutler06]

5 minutes ago, germ-x said:

So much progress that he couldn’t do enough to beat out Teddy Bridgewater?

Drew Lock and Teddy Bridgewater were 2 of the worst starters in the NFL last year.  Denver put them in a QB competition and looking at it, neither did enough to outright win.  Denver went into default mode and picked the guy they think is the safer player even though it could be easily argued that Lock slightly won the competition.

The only way this looks like a win for Denver is if one of them had taken the reigns and dominated camp…..neither did.

If you are for Teddy it’s because he’s smarter with the football and you’re hanging your hat on his 5 starts in NO can be replicated.  If you’re for Lock it’s because you think his talent will shine through and hanging your hat on a few starts where it looked like he could be a franchise QB.

At the end of the day both have enough out there that would say they’re good backups.  Denver put 2 high end backups in a QB competition.  They played like high end backups in camp.  QB is a problem position in Denver.

Fangio indicated that the 50/50 wasn't a success, I maintain that Teddy was picked expressly to save Vic's job. Many here will say Lock DID win, other say Teddy. I agree that neither QB stood out but I did think both were playing better than they did LAST YEAR., Drew has cut down on his turnovers, Teddy because he now has a better support staff To outright blatanly say  Drew Sucks really just says you don't like him w/o much reasoning like I wanted Fields, (haven't heard that one much), I wanted AR12,  Drew violated my sister...

[germ-x]

3 minutes ago, Cutler06 said:

Fangio indicated that the 50/50 wasn't a success, I maintain that Teddy was picked expressly to save Vic's job. Many here will say Lock DID win, other say Teddy. I agree that neither QB stood out but I did think both were playing better than they did LAST YEAR., Drew has cut down on his turnovers, Teddy because he now has a better support staff To outright blatanly say  Drew Sucks really just says you don't like him w/o much reasoning like I wanted Fields, (haven't heard that one much), I wanted AR12,  Drew violated my sister...

He’s played on 18 games.  Completed less than 60% of his passes.  Thrown for less than 4000 yards.  23 TDs to 18 INTs with a below 50 QBR.  That’s a bad QB.

What evidence do you have that he’s good other than you want him to bang your sister?

[broncos_fan _from _uk]

33 minutes ago, germ-x said:

He’s played on 18 games.  Completed less than 60% of his passes.  Thrown for less than 4000 yards.  23 TDs to 18 INTs with a below 50 QBR.  That’s a bad QB.

What evidence do you have that he’s good other than you want him to bang your sister?

I don’t know that he’s good. I don’t know that he’s bad. I do know that he has tripled his career offseason work this year (got injured 2 weeks in rookie year, obviously none last year) and has made huge improvements on the issues he had (making the right read, footwork, using his eyes to manipulate the defense, touch). 
 

kid has the tools and appears to be making strides on his deficits. Arguably won a competition where the cards were stacked against him (most of the starters were sat for his “start” and again when he came in on relief, while Teddy got multiple 4th down attempts to bolster his case), and despite not getting the nod is by all accounts continuing to be a great teammate and get better every day. 
 

people talking about not willing to take the shot, I fear we may end up with eggs on our faces ala the falcons after they traded Favre. We don’t know, let’s take the f-ing shot. 

[germ-x]

7 minutes ago, broncos_fan _from _uk said:

I don’t know that he’s good. I don’t know that he’s bad. I do know that he has tripled his career offseason work this year (got injured 2 weeks in rookie year, obviously none last year) and has made huge improvements on the issues he had (making the right read, footwork, using his eyes to manipulate the defense, touch). 
 

kid has the tools and appears to be making strides on his deficits. Arguably won a competition where the cards were stacked against him (most of the starters were sat for his “start” and again when he came in on relief, while Teddy got multiple 4th down attempts to bolster his case), and despite not getting the nod is by all accounts continuing to be a great teammate and get better every day. 
 

people talking about not willing to take the shot, I fear we may end up with eggs on our faces ala the falcons after they traded Favre. We don’t know, let’s take the f-ing shot. 

I saw Lock at camp his rookie year and it was embarrassing the way he played.  Couldn’t make the correct reads and complete a ball in 7 on 7.  Even with that, I do agree that he has tools, enough that if his mind caught up he could be a franchise caliber QB.

Lock has not been good in Denver and I think he’s immature.  With that, I’d have went with him in a tied competition with Teddy.  If I’m Paton/Fangio I’m rolling with the upside for the initial 3-4 games and evaluating from there.

So this isn’t like I didn’t want Lock to win the job.  Everyone with any sense should’ve wanted Lock to win the job. Physical talent wise he’s probably knocking on the door of the top 10-12 in the league.  Teddy’s bottom 10.  

At the end of the day, both Lock and Teddy project as to shelf backups and the fact that neither could pull away in this competition proves it.  I’d love to be proven wrong though.  This team is so hard to watch without someone behind center. 

[thebestever6]

19 minutes ago, broncos_fan _from _uk said:

I don’t know that he’s good. I don’t know that he’s bad. I do know that he has tripled his career offseason work this year (got injured 2 weeks in rookie year, obviously none last year) and has made huge improvements on the issues he had (making the right read, footwork, using his eyes to manipulate the defense, touch). 
 

kid has the tools and appears to be making strides on his deficits. Arguably won a competition where the cards were stacked against him (most of the starters were sat for his “start” and again when he came in on relief, while Teddy got multiple 4th down attempts to bolster his case), and despite not getting the nod is by all accounts continuing to be a great teammate and get better every day. 
 

people talking about not willing to take the shot, I fear we may end up with eggs on our faces ala the falcons after they traded Favre. We don’t know, let’s take the f-ing shot. 

I don't think his story is written easier to go from Teddy to him with no pressure after he's been written off. Let's see how this team maximizes under Teddy.