Week 17 - Rams vs Cardinals

[rocky_rams]

2 minutes ago, LeotheLion said:

I don't think it was that. The 2 deep shots that Wolford hit were due to corners trying to jump the underneath routes. Wolford recognized those and fired the deep shots for big gains. Part of me thinks the Cards were jumpy due to expecting Wolford to go with conservative throw. 

The other deep shots Wolford took weren't connected. I like that he took them but it's a low percentage throw. Goff has shown this year he prefers the easier completion. I'd expect if Wolford actually goes this week he'd look more for Kupp underneath than jump balls to single coverage. 

I agree. I think Kupp would be a good safety blanket. It’d be interesting to see how Wolfs mobility works hand in hand with Kupps route running. It could be a very good combo 

[JonStark]

6 minutes ago, rocky_rams said:

Do you think McVay is scared to open up the playbook because of Goff’s turnovers?

by the way, one of Goff’s biggest weaknesses is staying in the pocket and consistently picking defenses apart out the pocket 

He’s much better when the pocket moves 

I personally don't think so, but I'm not sure what the reason is. To me, it seems pretty easy to see that continuing to shorten the field with only short throws will bunch the defenders up, leading to more contested catches and turnovers. I think you always need to at least threaten the entire field by running, short passing, and deep passing, so that the defenders aren't always in one place. 

Also, anyone saying Goff can't go deep anymore is just wrong. I see that a lot on Twitter, but that's always been one of his strengths and wouldn't just disappear at 26 years old. He does need a pocket to throw from but with protection, he'd be just as deadly as he always has been. So honestly, I don't know why Mcvay doesn't call every game like he did last week. My best guess was that it's to make up for the OL not being 2018 form and he was more confident in Wolf avoiding the pressure and still being able to get the ball out. Goff is a better passer, but I don't think anyone here would disagree that Wolf is much better at getting out of the pressure. 

I'd say his weakness is staying in a chaotic pocket. Some of his best throws have been from a clean pocket when he doesn't have to worry about being hit. 

[rocky_rams]

8 minutes ago, jrry32 said:

Yes, their careers aren't comparable. But it's not because of what Jameis lacked. It's because Goff has been a far superior QB. Jameis has had Mike Evans his entire career. His secondary targets throughout his career have included DeSean Jackson, Chris Godwin, Vincent Jackson, Adam Humphries, Cameron Brate, and O.J. Howard. In 2018, he had Mike Evans, DeSean Jackson, Chris Godwin, Adam Humphries, O.J. Howard, and Cameron Brate, yet he ended up benched for Ryan Fitzpatrick. In 2019, he turned the ball over 35 times while playing for Bruce Arians, despite having one of the best groups of weapons in the NFL and Todd Bowles coordinating the defense.

Meanwhile, Jared Goff's best year for the Rams (2018) came with a defense that ranked around 20th in the NFL. And Wade never gave us a top 10 defense during his entire time coordinating the Rams. Goff and the offense led us to 13 regular season wins and a Super Bowl appearance in 2018. Jameis Winson has never led his team to double-digit wins once in his career. He has led his team to an above .500 record only once (9-7 in 2016). Swing and a miss.

I agree when speaking about 2017 and 2018 Goff. That was when he had prime Todd Gurley, better long ball accuracy, and less turnover prone. Everything was based off the play action, when teams were terrified of Gurley 

im talking about this current version of Goff without an offensive player of the year running back and one that’s had 40 turnovers over the last two seasons 

[rocky_rams]

3 minutes ago, JonStark said:

I personally don't think so, but I'm not sure what the reason is. To me, it seems pretty easy to see that continuing to shorten the field with only short throws will bunch the defenders up, leading to more contested catches and turnovers. I think you always need to at least threaten the entire field by running, short passing, and deep passing, so that the defenders aren't always in one place. 

Also, anyone saying Goff can't go deep anymore is just wrong. I see that a lot on Twitter, but that's always been one of his strengths and wouldn't just disappear at 26 years old. He does need a pocket to throw from but with protection, he'd be just as deadly as he always has been. So honestly, I don't know why Mcvay doesn't call every game like he did last week. My best guess was that it's to make up for the OL not being 2018 form and he was more confident in Wolf avoiding the pressure and still being able to get the ball out. Goff is a better passer, but I don't think anyone here would disagree that Wolf is much better at getting out of the pressure. 

I'd say his weakness is staying in a chaotic pocket. Some of his best throws have been from a clean pocket when he doesn't have to worry about being hit. 

Goff can’t go deep for numerous reasons some of which include lack of vertical wr threat and subpar OL play but his accuracy has also waned off. It’s a combo of things. He’s missed some easy ones this year. 
 

And when you add things up like why McVay consistently: chooses to run near the goal line, throws screens on anything longer than 3rd and 9 and “doesn’t open up the playbook,” you can clearly tell that McVay doesn’t have full trust in Goff because of Goff’s decision making
 

even commentators and analysts are picking up on it now 

[jrry32]

13 minutes ago, rocky_rams said:

I agree when speaking about 2017 and 2018 Goff. That was when he had prime Todd Gurley, better long ball accuracy, and less turnover prone. Everything was based off the play action, when teams were terrified of Gurley 

im talking about this current version of Goff without an offensive player of the year running back and one that’s had 40 turnovers over the last two seasons 

This Goff is that Goff. Put Goff on the 2018 or 2019 Bucs, and he'd have vastly outplayed Winston.

[jrry32]

7 minutes ago, rocky_rams said:

Goff can’t go deep for numerous reasons some of which include lack of vertical wr threat and subpar OL play but his accuracy has also waned off. It’s a combo of things. He’s missed some easy ones this year. 
 

And when you add things up like why McVay consistently: chooses to run near the goal line, throws screens on anything longer than 3rd and 9 and “doesn’t open up the playbook,” you can clearly tell that McVay doesn’t have full trust in Goff because of Goff’s decision making
 

even commentators and analysts are picking up on it now 

McVay doesn't have trust in the OL. He ran the ball multiple times on 3rd and long with Wolford in. He ran the ball at the goal line with Wolford in.

[btfd16]

Just now, jrry32 said:

McVay doesn't have trust in the OL. He ran the ball multiple times on 3rd and long with Wolford in. He ran the ball at the goal line with Wolford in.

OL, LB, deep threat. Offseason wish list in that order (obviously pending departures etc)

[JonStark]

7 minutes ago, rocky_rams said:

Goff can’t go deep for numerous reasons some of which include lack of vertical wr threat and subpar OL play but his accuracy has also waned off. It’s a combo of things. He’s missed some easy ones this year. 
 

And when you add things up like why McVay consistently: chooses to run near the goal line, throws screens on anything longer than 3rd and 9 and “doesn’t open up the playbook,” you can clearly tell that McVay doesn’t have full trust in Goff because of Goff’s decision making
 

even commentators and analysts are picking up on it now 

It is a combination of things, which is why I find myself defending Goff while also criticizing him at times. If it's a combination of things, it's not 100% on him. Some of it should be, but not all. Last year his deep threat is hurt and the OL declines. This year he has no deep threat and the OL improves marginally. He was never set up for his 2018 form to return.

The thing that I don't understand is that Goff has always been this guy. If you protect him, he can pick the defense apart and his decision making is fantastic. If you let him get hit a bunch, he starts anticipating the pressure and forcing it where he shouldn't. This can be said for the majority of QB in the league. Are people just realizing this now? 

 

[rocky_rams]

35 minutes ago, JonStark said:

It is a combination of things, which is why I find myself defending Goff while also criticizing him at times. If it's a combination of things, it's not 100% on him. Some of it should be, but not all. Last year his deep threat is hurt and the OL declines. This year he has no deep threat and the OL improves marginally. He was never set up for his 2018 form to return.

The thing that I don't understand is that Goff has always been this guy. If you protect him, he can pick the defense apart and his decision making is fantastic. If you let him get hit a bunch, he starts anticipating the pressure and forcing it where he shouldn't. This can be said for the majority of QB in the league. Are people just realizing this now? 

 

This isn’t true. Goff is at his best when he makes his first or second read out of a clean pocket. But typically when the pocket is “too clean” where he has a lot of time and his first two reads are covered, you can tell he starts panicking. He struggles. You can tell by his movement. This isn’t new. This is something I’ve seen on film. 
 

Kurt Warner says something similar recently. He says Goff can’t sit in the pocket and picka team apart. 
 

and of course you can hit a lot of QBs a bunch and they struggle but a) most don’t have the drop off Goff has and b) Goff hasn’t even been hit that much

[rocky_rams]

46 minutes ago, jrry32 said:

McVay doesn't have trust in the OL. He ran the ball multiple times on 3rd and long with Wolford in. He ran the ball at the goal line with Wolford in.

That makes perfect sense. It’s a combo of not having trust in the OL and the QB. Wolford is a backup. He doesn’t want his backup causing turnovers during critical times that end up costing his team the game. 
 

but Goff is the starter so why does Goff not get more flexibility? McVay is always saying how the QB is “an extension of the coaching staff”

[rocky_rams]

54 minutes ago, jrry32 said:

This Goff is that Goff. Put Goff on the 2018 or 2019 Bucs, and he'd have vastly outplayed Winston.

Sure. He prolly does outplay him. I don’t know about vastly outplaying him 

[BStanRamFan]

6 minutes ago, rocky_rams said:

This isn’t true. Goff is at his best when he makes his first or second read out of a clean pocket. But typically when the pocket is “too clean” where he has a lot of time and his first two reads are covered, you can tell he starts panicking. He struggles. You can tell by his movement. This isn’t new. This is something I’ve seen on film. 
 

Kurt Warner says something similar recently. He says Goff can’t sit in the pocket and picka team apart. 
 

and of course you can hit a lot of QBs a bunch and they struggle but a) most don’t have the drop off Goff has and b) Goff hasn’t even been hit that much

To add to this, this is a clip of Wolford going through his progressions, feet constantly moving, head on a swivel and hits Everett for the 1st. Pressure comes in from LG Edwards at the end, but he makes a nice throw from a mostly clean pocket.  Was Everett his 2nd or 3rd option? Tough to tell with Akers coming out of the backfield and Reynolds on the left.

 

 

 

[Rrrrrrrams]

here we go again with the bs about the ol.
sure. mcvay doesn't trust the ol.
but the rams run more deep routs with wolford at qb compared to goff against arizona.
mcvay doesn't trust goff, after all his "i'm gonna fix it, i promise" garbage.

dink and dunk. first read. 5 yards through the air.
 

wolford is not the answer.
but goff is what we saw in his rookie year.
once the offense got figured out.
evrybody knew: just put pressure on the 49ers joe monatana fan boy and he will be toast.

all he needs is an elite OL, WR crew, RB, play calling and **** defense to face...and he is a top 10 nfl qb
payed like a top three nfl player.

2022. good riddance jared goff.

 

[JonStark]

5 hours ago, BStanRamFan said:

To add to this, this is a clip of Wolford going through his progressions, feet constantly moving, head on a swivel and hits Everett for the 1st. Pressure comes in from LG Edwards at the end, but he makes a nice throw from a mostly clean pocket.  Was Everett his 2nd or 3rd option? Tough to tell with Akers coming out of the backfield and Reynolds on the left.

 

 

 

You gotta stop quoting Sosa lol the guy wants to be the one to call the Wolf breakout so bad that he'll will it into existence with everything he's got. If you sat down and picked out all of Goff's good plays and nothing else, he'd seem like a hall of famer. 

[BStanRamFan]

2 hours ago, JonStark said:

You gotta stop quoting Sosa lol the guy wants to be the one to call the Wolf breakout so bad that he'll will it into existence with everything he's got. If you sat down and picked out all of Goff's good plays and nothing else, he'd seem like a hall of famer. 

I personally don't agree with everything he posts, but he's a Rams fan and a PFF analyst so it's helpful. Also, I have no idea how to post videos without including them in tweets so sadly his commentary has to come with it. And I'm sure if I had picked all of his highlights it would look like that, but we only have ONE game to go off of lol