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BDL Discussion Thread 2021

Jlash

By Jlash
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7 minutes ago, MD4L said:

RBs grow on trees

final 4 teams last season

KC: drafted RB round 1
GB: Paid Aaron Jones the bank, drafted RB round 2 in AJ Dillion
TB: Drafted Ronald Jones round 2, Leonard Fournette (former top 5 pick)
BUF: Two 3rd rounders for their dual combo (Moss and Singletary. Josh Allen was their RB1 in redzone)

CLE: Kareem Hunt (gift) and Nick Chubb (round 2)
BAL: drafted JK Dobbins round 2
LAR: Drafted Cam Akers round 2
NO: Drafted Kamara round 2
 

IND: Drafted Jonathan Taylor round 2
PIT: Drafted Najee Harris this year, 32nd rushing game with late day 2/early day 3 guys
TEN: Derrick Henry is an all pro who ran for 2k yards
SEA: drafted Penny round one, Carson earned his 2nd contract
WAS: Gibson (round 3 pick 2)
CHI: David Montgomery (round 3 pick 11)
 

RBs grow on trees is a myth. The positional value is clearly not in comparison to a QB but to act like you can plug and punch anyone in with the talent of the high level guys in the NFL is an asinine claim. 

Aaron Jones was drafted in the 5th and Kamara was a 3rd, not 2nd.

There’s a very obvious trend there in that there are a lot of quality backs taken on Day 2 and have been for a while. It’s not as simple as throwing any guy out there and running the ball successfully, but it’s clear that it’s easier to get a quality starter at RB on Day 2 or later than a lot of other positions.

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rackcs

rackcs

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7 hours ago, RuskieTitan said:

I don't mind the +/- overall tbh, but I do want to clarify that Darrisaw was not my pick.

You're correct, my bad. I think I just mocked him to you so often that when I saw his name I automatically associated him with your team lol

7 hours ago, MD4L said:

Nice to see Etienne snatched up. Not the biggest fan of him going to Jacksonville because James Robinson was not a JAG (pun intended). It could be a challenge for him to get workhorse responsibility in the early portion of his rookie season.

Eh, Robinson was good but Urban Meyer has been very clear that he wants to "be the fastest team on the field." If Etienne is good enough right away, I think he'll easily be the main guy there because there's a lot more you can do with him compared to Robinson.

6 hours ago, WFLukic said:

RBs don't necessarily grow on trees but using premium picks on rbs isn't smart either.

I think that discussion is more for the Barkley, Elliott, Fournette type picks as opposed to necessarily 2nd rounders.

This is my take on RBs as well. Taking them top 10 is probably not smart no matter what. But I think day 2 picks are more than fine for the right guys and I don't mind late round 1 either. You take a RB late in round 1, you have a cheap, good starter (assuming they pan out) for 5 years and then you can franchise them too so you're not committing long term money to the position. I think that's honestly one of the smarter ways to handle the position, so you can have a good player there but not have to pay them the big bucks.

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MWil23

MWil23

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8 hours ago, SirA1 said:

Trying to think of best landing spot for JOK

My Browns friend is happy he wanted JOK or Greg Newsome II and got one of them .

Browns fan here. Most of our forum really wanted Newsome and thought after the Horn/Surtain II picks there was no way he'd fall to us. If he pans out, that Ward/Newsome/Greedy/Troy Hill foursome for Dime package should be something else, not to mention the big nickel of Delpit, Harrison, and Johnson.

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MWil23

MWil23

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6 minutes ago, rackcs said:

I want Alex Leatherwood to go in the first round!

The monkey's paw curls

He gets drafted by the Raiders

IMO, he'll walk in and start D1 at RT. I don't personally see this as a bad fit. Oakland likes size on their OL, and he'll likely do what he's best at on the right side, which is be a bit of a mauler in the run game, which makes up for his stiffness...and if he doesn't end up at RT, he can slide inside to his natural OG position.

JMHO 

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rackcs

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17 minutes ago, MWil23 said:

IMO, he'll walk in and start D1 at RT. I don't personally see this as a bad fit. Oakland likes size on their OL, and he'll likely do what he's best at on the right side, which is be a bit of a mauler in the run game, which makes up for his stiffness...and if he doesn't end up at RT, he can slide inside to his natural OG position.

JMHO 

It's a good fit as far as he'll start but Oakland has been absolutely horrible at developing players and Leatherwood is a guy who I think is going to need some development at the next level.

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MWil23

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Just now, rackcs said:

It's a good fit as far as he'll start but Oakland has been absolutely horrible at developing players and Leatherwood is a guy who I think is going to need some development at the next level.

You may absolutely be right in that regard. That said, their OL over the past 5+ years has definitely been a strength, so he should be surrounded by some other talent there. Let's hope Las Vegas is better at developing talent than Oakland was ;) 

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bcb1213

bcb1213

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Per tradion, here are your day one landing grades.  Please remember this is not an evaluation of the talent, more so in how I see their fit on the team and general playing time.  No one gets an F when you're a first round pick

 

Trevor Lawrence Jags:  A-   Jags have an actual offensive line that isn’t a dumpster fire which most rookie QB inherit.    The wild card is really going to see if Urban Meyer can be a successful coach at this level or whether he’ll be a Chip Kelly type dumpster fire.  Chark, Shenault and Westbrook give a solid trio with a reliable security blanket TE in Eifert and new RB Erienne

 

Zach Wilson Jets :  A-     Yes its New York, but if you look hard enough, this team actually doesn’t completely suck.  With the addition of Corey Davis and another rookie at guard, this team has a little bit of potential.  Davis as a number one is shaky but you have a deep threat in Mims and one of the best slot WR in Crowder.  They really need to address the running game though or people are gonna key in on destroying Wilson

 

Trey Lance San Francisco:  B   Some of this is the Jimmy G factor.  Normally a qb drafted this high doesn’t sit.  So if Jimmy gets moved, you can push this grade up.  Solid weapons on the outside, a qb friendly coach and a solid, if aging O Line.  I’m not as enamored with the WR as many are but Kittle is a stud and as long as he’s healthy will give Lance a nice safety valve across the middle.  Another team that may address the RB position soon in the draft

 

Kyle Pitts Atlanta:  B-   Pitts has amazing ability but he’s the third option in this offense with another tight end who is solid also on the roster.  There’s just a lot of mouths to feed in this passing game, not so much an indictment on Pitts himself

 

Jamar Chase Bengals B+   Joe Burrow connection makes this an easy higher grade.  He could easily become the number one WR here with tee as 2 and boyd as three makes a nice wr group.  What can hold this grade back however is the lack of time that may prevent Chase from getting downfield easily before Joe gets destroyed.  If the line outperforms, this grade is an A easily

 

Jaylen Waddle Dolphins C   Reconnecting with Tua will help, but I’m not sold on Tua, at all.  Not to mention he has another burner in Will Fuller already on the team with Devante Parker as well.  Kid can break any play at any time so if the offense gets creative that’s great, but you want your rookies to have guaranteed starting time, and I don’t know if that happens here outside of three wide

 

Penei Sewell- Lions A-  He’s going to start. They clearly like him a ton based upon the reaction in the draft room.  There’s happy, then there’s jumping up and down ecstatic.  Would be an A+ but rookie coach I don’t have a lot of knowledge about in developing O Line

 

Jaycee Horn Panthers  A+   Carolina’s scheme fits Horn’s playstyle and he won’t have to come in and be the number one right away with Jackson still there.  That’s basically the perfect recipe for what you want your cornerback to land in.  Starting gig where he doesn’t have to face number one WR in hs first year.

 

Patrick Surtain- Denver  A:  See Horn, Jaycee.  Only reason not an A+ is a little more CB talent in Denver to compete with

 

Devonta Smith Eagles  A-   He’s gonna be used early and often.  Only concern for me is that Jalen Hurts is ehh whatever at QB.  However I feel they will scheme the ball in his hands and let him do his thing

 

Justin Fields Bears D+   I don’t even know where to begin.  This feels like Trubisky 2.0 except they just signed Andy Dalton and still have Nick Foles with a coach who needs to win now to keep his job.  Weapons are OK, line is meh.  May not play year one, or will he.  Too many question marks here for a high grade

 

Micah Parsons Cowboys D-  I, dont, get it.  LVE and Jaylon Smith already here.  They run a 4-3 .  Unless there’s a trade I don’t see what Dallas is doing.  Jerry probably wanted Surtain and didn’t bother making a backup plan

 

Rashawn Slater Chargers A  When drafted you hope he went somewhere he’d be a LT and not a guard.  Perfect fit here.  They will allow him to develop and with Bulaga on the other side, can slide protection if need be to help him out early

 

Aliijah Vera Tucker Jets A   He’s a guard, he’ll start.  Not much more to say here

 

Mac Jones Patriots  C   Yes I hear the Tom Brady comparisons.  But frankly this is still a Cam offense which is the complete opposite of what Jones does.  It’s like having to install two different offenses.  The good news is that the patriots have a really nice line to keep him upright but the receiving weapons are, eh,  just average guys

 

Zaven Collins Cardinals  B  This is the team that finally figured out how to use Hassan Reddick last year, Collins kind of compares to Reddick so if they can get the same thing out of him, great.  Would have preferred him in a more traditional 43 team personally

 

Alex Leatherwood Raiders  LOL    I imagine he’ll start, where I don’t know unless they are giving up on Parker already.  The Raiders developing lineman under gruden has been well, not great

 

Jaelan Phillips Dolphins A  Will clearly have a heavy role on this team that gets creative in how they use their pass rushers.  Stays in the same city he went to college in so little adjustment needed.  Probably the best fit for him

 

Jamin Davis Washington A+   One thing I know about Ron Rivera is he will get the most out of his defensive talent.  Thisi kid has tools for days and Rivera will find a great fit for him.  Would have preferred him being in more a cover three based look as his pass recognition skills are superb but he has the athleticism to go one on one, if not the most experience doing so yet

 

Kadarius Toney  D-  The only thing saving this from an F is he somehow got drafted in the first round.  He got Golladay, Slayton, Shehard, hell even John Ross on this team who they signed earlier.  This goes with the Dallas, I don’t get it grade

 

Kwitty Paye Colts  B   Was there any doubt, he feels like a Colts kind of guy and that’s where he ends up.  Indy hasn’t had the best recent history with outside pass guys, but he could easily take the old Autry role where he goes outside on run downs and inside on pass downs which I think would be a boom for him.  We’ll see if that’s how they use him, would really boost the grade

 

Caleb Farley- Titans A  Well i think that this is a great fit.  Tennessee clearly needed to replace Adoree and get someone just like him.  Assuming they can keep him healthy, this is a nice scheme fit as well

 

Christian Darrisaw Vikings A-   This guy kind of reminded me of Brian O Neil coming out of college.  Which is interesting cause well, hes drafted by the same team.  Unfortunately O Neil has become a solid RT so we will see if they can develop Darrisaw, the job should be his to lost however on the left side

 

Najee Harris Steelers  A+    This may have been the most barren RB group I’ve ever seen so he is looking at three down work right off the bat,  Some concerns with the o line and a pass centric offense but once Ben leaves it’s gonna become the Najee Nightmare train

 

Travis Etienne Jags B-   This is probably the hardest grade I’ve had to give.  On one hand the Jags have a nice offensive line, on the other hand Urban has shown to like to rotate backs throughout his college career and James Robinson balled out last year.  Can certainly carve out a nice role but I also fear the ghost of Carlos Hyde swiping goal line touches

 

Greg Newsome Browns  C    So the browns now have Ward, Greedy, recently signed Troy Hill and now Newsome.  From a playing time perspective this isn’t great.  The browns do like their off man coverage though which is what Newsome is good at.  Although they also have a terrible time keeping dudes healthy whcih is also a newsome bugaboo   

 

Rashod Bateman Baltimore B-   This is the tale of two scenarios.  The first is the Ravens clearly could use a large wide receiver upgrade.  The other side is they just completely suck at developing WR talent   He’ll have an opportunity for a large role however if he doesn’t suck

 

Payton Turner Saints D+   So this team gave Davenport the fifth year option earlier in the day and then drafted, another edge.  Unless Cam Jordan is on the trading block and I’m unaware Turner is looking at a rotational role at best.  The only thing that saves this from being a D or D- is that the Saints generally develop defensive lineman very well so long term its a nice fit

 

Eric Stokes  Packers B-    Definitely has a chance to start.  However, he feels more like Josh Jackson than Jaire Alexander.  The pack simply seem to draft at least one bust CB every year

 

Greg Rousseau Bills  B+  Has a nice chance to get a good piece of playing time.  If I had more faith in Buffalo developing pass rushers I’d give this a higher grade.  The better news is he probably won’t find as much trouble in Buffalo and he would in other places so maybe some of this off field concerns will be dissolved

 

Jayson Oweh Ravens  B-  A lot of people like the fit.  I just don’t know.  Ravens are really hit or miss with edge rushers and when they miss the guys almost never do better elsewhere.

 

Joe Tryon   Bucs C-  I just don’t like Tryon in a 3-4. Maybe they might switch to a more traditional look or have him do some situational pass rushing from the inside.  Not a lot of early playing time unless JPP or Barrett get hurt

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rackcs

rackcs

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9 minutes ago, bcb1213 said:

Micah Parsons Cowboys D-  I, dont, get it.  LVE and Jaylon Smith already here.  They run a 4-3 .  Unless there’s a trade I don’t see what Dallas is doing.  Jerry probably wanted Surtain and didn’t bother making a backup plan

You can't count on LVE with as much time as he misses. I think this is their signal that they're ready to move on from LVE when his contract is up rather than bringing him back when he's just too unreliable.

9 minutes ago, bcb1213 said:

Najee Harris Steelers  A+    This may have been the most barren RB group I’ve ever seen so he is looking at three down work right off the bat,  Some concerns with the o line and a pass centric offense but once Ben leaves it’s gonna become the Najee Nightmare train

Hopefully the Steelers fix those OL issues tonight but other than that, I think if we have a competent run game we'd ideally like to run the ball more. Just last year it was so ineffective that it was better to just let Ben throw, as not great as he was himself. Plus Ben likes getting the RB involved out of the backfield so that'll be a nice aspect of his game we should hopefully utilize.

9 minutes ago, bcb1213 said:

Greg Newsome Browns  C    So the browns now have Ward, Greedy, recently signed Troy Hill and now Newsome.  From a playing time perspective this isn’t great.  The browns do like their off man coverage though which is what Newsome is good at.  Although they also have a terrible time keeping dudes healthy whcih is also a newsome bugaboo   

I think the Browns are feeling similarly about Greedy as the Cowboys about LVE. He's too unreliable and they need to start preparing now for when/if they eventually move on. And Troy Hill is pretty strictly nickel I'm pretty sure so I don't think he's too much of an issue. I feel better about this situation for Newsome than you do.

9 minutes ago, bcb1213 said:

Payton Turner Saints D+   So this team gave Davenport the fifth year option earlier in the day and then drafted, another edge.  Unless Cam Jordan is on the trading block and I’m unaware Turner is looking at a rotational role at best.  The only thing that saves this from being a D or D- is that the Saints generally develop defensive lineman very well so long term its a nice fit

They gave the 5th year to Davenport but I think they're still not that committed to him if he continues playing poorly. If Turner is good I could see him overtaking Davenport sooner rather than later.

Really nice explanations, it was a good read.

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MWil23

MWil23

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27 minutes ago, rackcs said:
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Greg Newsome Browns  C    So the browns now have Ward, Greedy, recently signed Troy Hill and now Newsome.  From a playing time perspective this isn’t great.  The browns do like their off man coverage though which is what Newsome is good at.  Although they also have a terrible time keeping dudes healthy whcih is also a newsome bugaboo   

I think the Browns are feeling similarly about Greedy as the Cowboys about LVE. He's too unreliable and they need to start preparing now for when/if they eventually move on. And Troy Hill is pretty strictly nickel I'm pretty sure so I don't think he's too much of an issue. I feel better about this situation for Newsome than you do.

It's come out that Greedy has permanent nerve issues and his future is more than a little bit in doubt. Throw in Ward's injury history and Woods's desire to run more big nickel and dime personnel, and IMO, this was a fantastic pick at a premium position with need mixed in.

He's also still just 20 years old and has 3 years of production to match.

Ward and Greedy only have 1-2 more years on their contracts as well.

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