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Spinning Tires: Steelers 2021 Offseason and Beyond...


43M

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6 hours ago, DR43 said:

Could we be looking to drafting Asante Samuel Jr. in round 1 due to the recent moves?  At 5'10 could he play the outside?

Never know with the Steelers.

Smaller corners have played outside.   Just depends on his skillset, which admittedly I dont know much about him.  

I personally believe the pick at this point will be OLine or RB.      I think any shortcomings we have on defense will just be pushed off until next year and we will just plug stop gap types in for now.....even if they arent necessarily good stop gaps. 

While Im not a fan of drafting RB in the first, I think they are desperately looking to get the running game back.   They know Ben cant rip it like he used to, so a much improved running game is the only hope this team has of winning with Ben.     Sure, the defense wont be as good, I think they are willing to chance that if they can improve the run game.

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16 hours ago, wwhickok said:

Everything you said about me is completely fair and up until this season, I admit, I was not pleased with Dupree. But this season he really broke out. We all knew we couldn't afford to keep him and I'm glad he got a good opportunity.  I was 100% wrong in the end on Dupree for sure. 

I'm probably as bipolar a Steelers fan as it gets lol.

Dupree had a good season, too bad he didn't have more like that.  It will be something to observe , how he has an affect on the titans since they really has a pass rush need

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19 hours ago, warfelg said:

“Play with him for a long time.”

Bens gonna be here crippling us for a few more years. 

Yeah, that really stinks that we're stuck with a QB that went 11-0, with 8 of those games with a Rating of over 100 (ok one was 98.7).  Oh that's right, he did have that ONE bad game in the Playoffs...good thing Tomlin decided that Ben needed to sit that last game, that would have been a great dry-run for him for the Playoff game.

It's funny...I don't remember seeing a lot about Ben crippling us during our winning streak...outside of the true Ben haters, of course...

 

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14 minutes ago, Ward4HOF said:

Yeah, that really stinks that we're stuck with a QB that went 11-0, with 8 of those games with a Rating of over 100 (ok one was 98.7).  Oh that's right, he did have that ONE bad game in the Playoffs...good thing Tomlin decided that Ben needed to sit that last game, that would have been a great dry-run for him for the Playoff game.

It's funny...I don't remember seeing a lot about Ben crippling us during our winning streak...outside of the true Ben haters, of course...

 

Statistically we were one of the luckiest teams and we faced the weakest defensive DVOA over those 11 games. 
 

Im not overreacting to one game. I’m reacting to a 38/39 YO QB with 17 years, countless injuries, showing signs of decline making a comment that he wants to keep playing. You make comments about other being emotional, and pushing this narrative that Ben is fine to keep playing is about as emotional as it gets. 

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7 minutes ago, warfelg said:

Statistically we were one of the luckiest teams and we faced the weakest defensive DVOA over those 11 games. 
 

Im not overreacting to one game. I’m reacting to a 38/39 YO QB with 17 years, countless injuries, showing signs of decline making a comment that he wants to keep playing. You make comments about other being emotional, and pushing this narrative that Ben is fine to keep playing is about as emotional as it gets. 

It’s somewhere in the middle...you don’t have the season he had with the worst run offense in the NFL and the most drops to boot without being an average to above average QB.

He also isn’t what he used to be...I’m just gonna appreciate his career and try to enjoy his last season whatever happens.

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33 minutes ago, Ward4HOF said:

Yeah, that really stinks that we're stuck with a QB that went 11-0, with 8 of those games with a Rating of over 100 (ok one was 98.7).  Oh that's right, he did have that ONE bad game in the Playoffs...good thing Tomlin decided that Ben needed to sit that last game, that would have been a great dry-run for him for the Playoff game.

It's funny...I don't remember seeing a lot about Ben crippling us during our winning streak...outside of the true Ben haters, of course...

 

Ben's been declining for several years now.

His deep ball started decling big time about 3 years ago, 2 years before his major elbow injury.   His mobility and pocket presence have been slipping for years as well.    Not that he was ever the most mobile or had the best pocket presence, but he was strong enough to get out of sacks and move out of the pockets to make plays.

His deep ball and ability to move outside the pocket were his biggest assets.   Both were weaknesses last year, and its not going to get better.

As @AFFstated....he was in a pretty horribly run offense with no running game, an OLine that got weaker as the season went on, and receivers that werent doing him any favors....so its not entirely on Ben.      However, it indisputable that he is NOT the same Ben we have come to know and love.   He is a shell.    We went 11-0 against a pretty weak schedule with our defense being opportunistic and our offense managing to slowly move the ball without a running game.

As soon as that stopped being the case.....as soon as our defense wasnt creating splash plays and our opposing defenses started taking away the short passing game....we went from being an 11-0 team, to a bottom 7 team in the league.   And make no mistake, the final 5-7 games....we were (at times) one of the worst teams in the league.

Can Ben have a bounce back season, of sorts?   Sure, but again, this isnt the same Ben it used to be, and that cannot be argued.     He needs to be treated like we treated QBs under Cowher....that they need major help from the running game and defense, because thats the only way we are going to win with Ben this year.

I personally dont think its going to happen.    I think the running game....whoever we get...will only be marginally improved and the defense will likely be worse.

This is why I didnt want Ben back.   If the overall team was in a better situation and he was our best chance at winning....that would be one thing.    But we are talking about a significantly declining, 39 year old QB on a team that is in obvious rebuild mode....but is still clinging on to false hope that it can still compete with a relic from bygone glory days.    

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I think Ben is just too broken down. His knees are shot, his arm is weaker, his joints are bad. He was just hit too many times in his career. I agree with what @43M, @AFF, and @warfelg said. The only chance we're contenders this year is if we play like Peyton's SB win with Denver. Fantastic defense, great running game, accurate game manager/field commander/play caller on the fly QB. I think we have one of those three, unfortunately I don't think he believes that's where he is in his career. And frankly, I don't see us being able to build the other two in one offseason, especially as cash strapped as we are. 

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I'm preparing myself for a rough season tbh I think this is  8-9 win team at best. Our road schedule looks really tough on paper. I'm still really optimistic about the near future tho team still has young talent on both sides and I trust the FO to pump more young talent on this team with draft picks and more cap room. I can see us being SB contenders again soon.

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The knees are the most concerning thing and what I actually question is his ability to keep them healthy through a 16 game season. But I don't see the declining arm some people claim. Timing and play design is the issue with the deep ball. He looked just fine throwing it deep against the Colts when Johnson was actually running the correct route and when he was calling his own plays to Juju. His arm is still far above Drew Brees' and even if it's blasphemous to say it, Tom Brady's.

The offense we saw with Ben was basically what we saw the prior year with Hodges and Rudolph. They'd occasionally chuck it deep into a one-on-one situation and hope for the best, but it was predicated on short passing out of the gun.

The notion that Ben is 2015 Peyton Manning right now is absurd.

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My Newest Mock Draft:

1. Travis Etienne, RB Clemson
2. Kyle Trask, QB Florida
3. Chazz Surratt, OLB North Carolina
4a. Rodarius Williams, CB Oklahoma State
4b. Cary Angeline, TE North Carolina State
6. Brennan Eagles, WR Texas
7a. Max Duffy, Punter Kentucky
7b. Dicaprio Bootle, CB Nebraska 
 

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I’m less worried about Ben physically than I am about a 39 year old who has shown incredible resistance to coaching he opposes buying into what should be a stark philosophical change. 

Rewatching the season, I’m honestly not worried about the physical aspect of Bens game. There’s plenty of examples of him being able to throw outside the numbers, in the intermediate with heat, and move in the pocket (honestly— he was actually pretty good at it still). This offenses was losing games before they ever took the field in the second half of the season. It started with X’s and O’s and if we even take a small step forward things can be vastly different. Ben is absolutely on super twilight rates right now, but there’s more than enough there to win with a competent plan. 

Whether or not Ben agrees with said competent plan is another story....

Also, whether or not Canada has a competent NFL plan is another, another story. 

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1 hour ago, MOSteelers56 said:

No thanks on Trask in the second. We don't need anymore QBs that are fringe starter/backup material. We've got that in spades. If we take a QB it better be in the first 15 picks, because anything else is a wasted pick IMO.

I dont really know much about Trask, and I generally agree with what youre saying, but a) we dont have a fringe starter outside of maybe Ben.     Rudolph is a fringe 2nd string QB.     Haskins at this point isnt even a sure thing to make the team.

Not saying we should draft Trask or any other QB....just that I wouldnt count Rudolph or Haskins as quality backups....much less fringe starters.

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