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1 minute ago, beardown3231 said:

 

When were these two considered busts?

Bust is too strong for many of these guys, but the example given was Drew Brees.

Green Bay Packers[edit]

Following his college career, Warner went undrafted in the 1994 NFL Draft. He was invited to try out for the Green Bay Packers' training camp in 1994, but was released before the regular season began. Warner was competing for a spot against Brett Favre, Mark Brunell, and former Heisman Trophy winner Ty Detmer. While Warner was with the Packers, the head coach was Mike Holmgren, the quarterback coach was Steve Mariucci, and Andy Reid was the offensive assistant.[9]

After his release, Warner stocked shelves at a Hy-Vee grocery store in Cedar Falls for $5.50 an hour.[10] Warner often cites this starting point when telling of his rise to NFL stardom in 1999. He also mentions that his deepened dedication to Christianity occurred around 1997.[11] Warner returned to Northern Iowa and worked as a graduate assistant coach with the football team, while still hoping to get another tryout with an NFL team.

Atlanta Falcons (1991)

Favre was drafted by the Atlanta Falcons in the second round with the 33rd overall pick in the 1991 NFL Draft.[16] On July 19, 1991, Favre agreed to a three-year, US$1.4 million contract with a reported signing bonus of $350,000.[17] Atlanta head coach Jerry Glanville did not approve of the drafting of Favre, saying it would take a plane crash for him to put Favre into the game.[18] Favre's first pass in an NFL regular season game resulted in an interception returned for a touchdown in a game against the Washington Redskins.[19][20] He only attempted four passes in his career at Atlanta, was intercepted twice, and completed none of them. Favre took one other snap, which resulted in a sack for an eleven-yard loss.[21]

 

 

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32 minutes ago, dll2000 said:

Bust is too strong for many of these guys, but the example given was Drew Brees.

Green Bay Packers[edit]

Following his college career, Warner went undrafted in the 1994 NFL Draft. He was invited to try out for the Green Bay Packers' training camp in 1994, but was released before the regular season began. Warner was competing for a spot against Brett Favre, Mark Brunell, and former Heisman Trophy winner Ty Detmer. While Warner was with the Packers, the head coach was Mike Holmgren, the quarterback coach was Steve Mariucci, and Andy Reid was the offensive assistant.[9]

After his release, Warner stocked shelves at a Hy-Vee grocery store in Cedar Falls for $5.50 an hour.[10] Warner often cites this starting point when telling of his rise to NFL stardom in 1999. He also mentions that his deepened dedication to Christianity occurred around 1997.[11] Warner returned to Northern Iowa and worked as a graduate assistant coach with the football team, while still hoping to get another tryout with an NFL team.

Atlanta Falcons (1991)

Favre was drafted by the Atlanta Falcons in the second round with the 33rd overall pick in the 1991 NFL Draft.[16] On July 19, 1991, Favre agreed to a three-year, US$1.4 million contract with a reported signing bonus of $350,000.[17] Atlanta head coach Jerry Glanville did not approve of the drafting of Favre, saying it would take a plane crash for him to put Favre into the game.[18] Favre's first pass in an NFL regular season game resulted in an interception returned for a touchdown in a game against the Washington Redskins.[19][20] He only attempted four passes in his career at Atlanta, was intercepted twice, and completed none of them. Favre took one other snap, which resulted in a sack for an eleven-yard loss.[21]

 

 

But the original question was about busts

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40 minutes ago, beardown3231 said:

But the original question was about busts

And I know you didn't pose it...but Favre's situation was weird. The Falcons thought their starter was heading towards bust status, then when it became clear he wasn't, they traded Favre to Green Bay. 

Warner was a FA afterthought, so no one every really thought of him as a bust. 

Eason was thought of as a bust, and changed that after a bit. The same with Rich Gannon and Doug Flutie (although Flutie never set the world on fire, it was clear he was a player...eventually.)

Linemen seem to bounce back from their "bust" determinations more than other players. 

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2 hours ago, Nads786 said:

Can you give an example of a QB who is a bust at one time that turns into a good QB in another team? The only one I can think of is Brees. 

Apparently you guys aren't old enough to remember Jim Plunkett lol

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16 hours ago, beardown3231 said:

But the original question was about busts

UDFA who, from what John Jurko says, refused to take reps in practice.  

Atlanta thought they had fleeced GB on that trade.  They thought he was terrible.  He was absolutely a bust in ATL.  

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58 minutes ago, Superman(DH23) said:

UDFA who, from what John Jurko says, refused to take reps in practice.  

Atlanta thought they had fleeced GB on that trade.  They thought he was terrible.  He was absolutely a bust in ATL.  

He threw the ball 4 times. He was a 2nd round pick. That's not a bust

FWIW I don't agree with what Nads said. I agree with you guys. I just think Warner and Favre are poor examples

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17 minutes ago, beardown3231 said:

He threw the ball 4 times. He was a 2nd round pick. That's not a bust

FWIW I don't agree with what Nads said. I agree with you guys. I just think Warner and Favre are poor examples

I would say in 1 year, if the team that drafted you gives up on you, that's a bust.

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3 hours ago, beardown3231 said:

He threw the ball 4 times. He was a 2nd round pick. That's not a bust

FWIW I don't agree with what Nads said. I agree with you guys. I just think Warner and Favre are poor examples

I think Tannehill is the strongest example of a QB resurrecting's his career after getting meaningful time as a starter. Warner nor Favre received that amount of playing time.

My belief is that it's extremely rare and not worth the effort to pursue Darnold or Rosen or any of these players who failed with playing time. The most I would give Darnold is a 5th and at that point you're just gambling for a lucky lotto ticket.

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1 minute ago, Nads786 said:

I think Tannehill is the strongest example of a QB resurrecting's his career after getting meaningful time as a starter. Warner nor Favre received that amount of playing time.

My belief is that it's extremely rare and not worth the effort to pursue Darnold or Rosen or any of these players who failed with playing time. The most I would give Darnold is a 5th and at that point you're just gambling for a lucky lotto ticket.

Tannehill you just mentioned.

You mentioned Brees who had one good season in SD before jetting him off to NO.  There was not a huge bidding war for Brees.  Not many thought he was going to be a star.   

Warner was cut and bagging groceries.  He got a shot and won a SB.  Failed again in NY and went to AZ and went back to SB.   

Flutie came back and played good for Bills as an old man after failing for Bears and being a Canadian star.  They named a cereal after him he was so loved in Buffalo.  

Young was terrible for a bad Tampa Bay team for 2 years before going to SF and becoming a HOF.

Plunkett has a story, I just don't know it.

It's rare.   Being a successful QB in NFL is rare.  It's all rare.   And people don't get hung up on word "Bust".   Not the point.   

The point is it isn't unheard of for a QB one team thinks isn't that good to be a good QB somewhere else.

Favre, Brees, Warner and Young are all not only good but HOF good.   Plunkett is right on borderline of HOF.

Will Darnold be good? Who knows?  Probably not?  Can he be good?   Yes, I believe so.  But a lot of 'good' is situation.

Warner doesn't play for showtime Rams talent he is likely a nobody still.   Same if Young stays in Tampa. 

 Flutie likely could have been a great NFL QB for another team outside of Chicago.  He was a college legend.

I think if Darnold got drafted by Rams instead of Goff (timelines don't match up I know, but pretend that they did in this hypo) or if SF traded for Darnold instead of Jimmy G he is a standout for either of those teams under those coaches in those situations (not under Fisher, but under current staff).

Would he succeed with Bears?  Probably not.  But almost nobody would.  Bears are where most QBs go to die.

Situation matters.  

 

 

 

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4 hours ago, Superman(DH23) said:

Atlanta thought they had fleeced GB on that trade.  They thought he was terrible.  He was absolutely a bust in ATL.  

They didn't think he was terrible at all (they were willing to trade up in the 1st round to snag him). He just didn't get along with HC/OC (forget his name) which is why they traded him. 

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Just now, JAF-N72EX said:

They didn't think he was terrible at all (they were willing to trade up in the 1st round to snag him). He just didn't get along with HC/OC (forget his name) which is why they traded him. 

Jerry Glanville was the HC and he flat out Favre couldnt play.  I watched the documentary on it a few years back.  The story is fascinating bc Ron Wolfe was w/ the Jets, and he wanted Favre in the draft.  When he got to GB as GM it was one of his 1st moves.

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1 minute ago, Superman(DH23) said:

Jerry Glanville was the HC and he flat out Favre couldnt play.  I watched the documentary on it a few years back.  The story is fascinating bc Ron Wolfe was w/ the Jets, and he wanted Favre in the draft.  When he got to GB as GM it was one of his 1st moves.

Yes, that's correct. Seeing the name jogged my memory. He thought they needed a 3rd string QB and sent a 5th round to some team and put Brett 3rd on the depth chart. 

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