G08 Posted January 18, 2021 Author Share Posted January 18, 2021 On 1/15/2021 at 6:39 PM, topwop1 said: Crazy is thinking we're ever going to win a Super Bowl or contend without a legitimate QB. We're just spinning our wheels until then. Who would you rather have right now...Kevin White, Leonard Floyd Mitch Trubisky, Khalil Mack and Roquan Smith or just a Patrick Mahomes/Deshaun Watson. There's some good players in that former list but it hasn't gotten us very far now has it? I mean of course I'd rather have Mahomes/Watson. We could have drafted them and we didn't. You know what happens if we trade for Watson? I'll tell you: he'll come here, he'll get hurt, he'll rehab and return and never be as good as he showed in Houston. Why? Because Bears. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G08 Posted January 18, 2021 Author Share Posted January 18, 2021 On 1/15/2021 at 7:23 PM, Heinz D. said: Knock, knock. Reality at the door. We need a quarterback. We half-assed a new scheme and Trubisky was the 20th ranked QB in QBR (includes defenses played, etc). Not saying that's the end all be all of course, but there was promise there if Nagy wasn't a dip****. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dll2000 Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 2 hours ago, WindyCity said: No one wants Mack. He is 30 and hasn’t been dominant in a couple of years. He also makes 26 million a season and his contract is ugly because Pace has back loaded it so much. Fans always seem to believe we can trade our underperforming expensive assets for gold. When you have a decent performing player who has actual trade value and you suggest trading him before he falls off or his contract is up its like nooooooo we can't trade him. You are crazy to even think it. If want something good you have to trade something good. TANSTAAFL. Other people aren't complete fools. You have to hope Mack and Quinn get healthy and motivated. It could happen. Quinn didn't play as bad as his stats suggest and both were reportedly playing far less than 100% healthwise all season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nads786 Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 2 hours ago, G08 said: We half-assed a new scheme and Trubisky was the 20th ranked QB in QBR (includes defenses played, etc). Not saying that's the end all be all of course, but there was promise there if Nagy wasn't a dip****. It’s time to move on Mitch sucks. He cannot play well against good defenses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nads786 Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 1 hour ago, dll2000 said: Fans always seem to believe we can trade our underperforming expensive assets for gold. When you have a decent performing player who has actual trade value and you suggest trading him before he falls off or his contract is up its like nooooooo we can't trade him. You are crazy to even think it. If want something good you have to trade something good. TANSTAAFL. Other people aren't complete fools. You have to hope Mack and Quinn get healthy and motivated. It could happen. Quinn didn't play as bad as his stats suggest and both were reportedly playing far less than 100% healthwise all season. Plus with Goldman back I think the defense can return to top 10 status. It won’t matter becuaee we don’t have a QB and end up with the same close games that we end up losing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G08 Posted January 18, 2021 Author Share Posted January 18, 2021 37 minutes ago, Nads786 said: It’s time to move on Mitch sucks. He cannot play well against good defenses. Who does consistently play well against good defenses, though? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dll2000 Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 47 minutes ago, Nads786 said: Plus with Goldman back I think the defense can return to top 10 status. It won’t matter becuaee we don’t have a QB and end up with the same close games that we end up losing. If everyone on defense performs at their peak it is can be great. Problem is you don't know who is going to have personal problems, who is going to be injured, who is going to have an off year, who isn't trying anymore, who just got too old, etc. Offense can't be great because it lacks the talent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 On 1/15/2021 at 6:39 PM, topwop1 said: Who would you rather have right now...Kevin White, Leonard Floyd Mitch Trubisky, Khalil Mack and Roquan Smith or just a Patrick Mahomes/Deshaun Watson. That's a bit of a dishonest question, since you're asking in a "worst case" scenario. With the exception of Khalil Mack and Roquan Smith, those picks were busts for where they were selected. If those picks were hits instead of misses, do you still feel that way? Pace's player evaluation is the one that takes a hit, not the concept. If Pace correctly evaluated the QBs, he walks away with Mahomes or Watson. Instead, he chose Trubisky. For that, he should fall on the sword so to speak. The fact that he's whiffed on so many FRPs and still has his job is mystifying to me as a Packers' fan. Those are the picks you're not supposed to miss on, especially picking inside the top 10. You're probably not getting a star with the pick used for White, but should have gotten at least a quality starter. Don't remember the Bears' needs at the time, but passing on Laremy Tunsil for Leonard Floyd is/was unexcusable even with the late character concerns popping up. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 20 hours ago, beardown3231 said: In terms of quality of picks, maybe, but you never know in the NFL. Allegedly Gruden chose to trade Mack here because he thought they would suck. If they trade Watson to Miami that's a championship contender instantly. The #3 pick would be nice but the next 1 or 2 would be in the 20's. Maybe including a good young player can change their mind, like Nichols. A guaranteed top 3 pick which means they get a shot at least one of Zach Wilson or Justin Fields vs. the 20th overall pick which you're lucky if you'll be able to draft QB4. It really is a no brainer for Houston. The only way Houston can outbid Miami/NY Jets is by offering more picks. I really think ~3 FRPs is the rate that you're going to have to get Houston to even consider that deal, and if you're Chicago you have to beat that by a pretty healthy margin given the disparity in picks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topwop1 Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 30 minutes ago, CWood21 said: That's a bit of a dishonest question, since you're asking in a "worst case" scenario. With the exception of Khalil Mack and Roquan Smith, those picks were busts for where they were selected. If those picks were hits instead of misses, do you still feel that way? Pace's player evaluation is the one that takes a hit, not the concept. If Pace correctly evaluated the QBs, he walks away with Mahomes or Watson. Instead, he chose Trubisky. For that, he should fall on the sword so to speak. The fact that he's whiffed on so many FRPs and still has his job is mystifying to me as a Packers' fan. Those are the picks you're not supposed to miss on, especially picking inside the top 10. You're probably not getting a star with the pick used for White, but should have gotten at least a quality starter. Don't remember the Bears' needs at the time, but passing on Laremy Tunsil for Leonard Floyd is/was unexcusable even with the late character concerns popping up. It is dishonest but it's being posed because we are stuck with Pace for the time being and for who really knows how much longer considering Bears ownership refused to answer when Pace's deal expires and given their affinity for him. I am using his track record of 1st round pick success rate as a comparison since we know it's not that good and that we may actually be better off trading those for proven players like the Khalil Mack's, Watson's etc of the world for as long as he is GM. On the other hand the financially conservative part of me thinks that this is not a proper way to build a team and that in all likelihood it's not a move that would push us over the top. 31 minutes ago, CWood21 said: A guaranteed top 3 pick which means they get a shot at least one of Zach Wilson or Justin Fields vs. the 20th overall pick which you're lucky if you'll be able to draft QB4. It really is a no brainer for Houston. The only way Houston can outbid Miami/NY Jets is by offering more picks. I really think ~3 FRPs is the rate that you're going to have to get Houston to even consider that deal, and if you're Chicago you have to beat that by a pretty healthy margin given the disparity in picks. I think one thing that gets overlooked here about a potential Watson trade is that the Texans would probably rather deal him out of the conference and that new GM Nick Caserio may not want to do his old team dirty (Patriots) by making it even harder on them competing in the AFC East for years to come. If he goes to Jets or Dolphins how in the heck are the Pats going to compete with that plus with the Bills looking like they will be a force for years to come? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 13 minutes ago, topwop1 said: I think one thing that gets overlooked here about a potential Watson trade is that the Texans would probably rather deal him out of the conference and that new GM Nick Caserio may not want to do his old team dirty (Patriots) by making it even harder on them competing in the AFC East for years to come. If he goes to Jets or Dolphins how in the heck are the Pats going to compete with that plus with the Bills looking like they will be a force for years to come? If the Jets/Dolphins are willing to dangle a top 3 pick, I think that trumps anything the Bears can offer. I'd rather have a top 3 pick this year than the Bears pick this year and next year. If the Bears are willing to dangle a 3rd FRP, then the discussion gets close. But I guess it just depends on what the secondary pieces the Jets/Dolphins are willing to dangle. The Texans need to do what's right for them. If that means dealing him within the conference, so be it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abstract_thought Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 5 hours ago, G08 said: We half-assed a new scheme and Trubisky was the 20th ranked QB in QBR (includes defenses played, etc). Not saying that's the end all be all of course, but there was promise there if Nagy wasn't a dip****. He's right there with Daniel Jones and Ben Roethlisberger. In ANY/A he ranks 24th in the league. The problem isn't the scheme, it's Mitch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G08 Posted January 18, 2021 Author Share Posted January 18, 2021 24 minutes ago, abstract_thought said: He's right there with Daniel Jones and Ben Roethlisberger. In ANY/A he ranks 24th in the league. The problem isn't the scheme, it's Mitch. If that is indeed the case, wouldn't have Nick Foles done markedly better rather than markedly worse? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beardown3231 Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 1 hour ago, CWood21 said: A guaranteed top 3 pick which means they get a shot at least one of Zach Wilson or Justin Fields vs. the 20th overall pick which you're lucky if you'll be able to draft QB4. It really is a no brainer for Houston. The only way Houston can outbid Miami/NY Jets is by offering more picks. I really think ~3 FRPs is the rate that you're going to have to get Houston to even consider that deal, and if you're Chicago you have to beat that by a pretty healthy margin given the disparity in picks. My point was you have no idea how the next first rounders will fall after this draft. Maybe Easterby doesn't like Wilson, Fields or Lance. Chances are Miami will be picking in the 20's in 2022 and 2023. Chances are far worse that the Bears will be picking in the 20's in those years Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topwop1 Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 Just now, beardown3231 said: My point was you have no idea how the next first rounders will fall after this draft. Maybe Easterby doesn't like Wilson, Fields or Lance. Chances are Miami will be picking in the 20's in 2022 and 2023. Chances are far worse that the Bears will be picking in the 20's in those years I don't think Easterby has that kind of pull as to which players the GM Caserio will target at QB. The guy is more or less a preacher and not a talent evaluator Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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