Jump to content

2021 Baltimore Ravens Offseason Tracker


Recommended Posts

2 hours ago, SalvadorsDeli said:

Assuming the price points are all relatively similar, what are people's preferences on the veteran EDGE market between Clowney, Houston, and Ingram? 

Ingram

Houston

 

 

Clowney

Link to post
Share on other sites

Houston for me even though he's the oldest. I just trust him more as a pass-rusher. Ingram is versatile but I think the Ravens have enough of that in Bowser who should see way more snaps this season. Give me the better threat off the edge.

Clowney... eh. Not sure I trust him with much of anything.

Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, coordinator0 said:

Houston for me even though he's the oldest. I just trust him more as a pass-rusher. Ingram is versatile but I think the Ravens have enough of that in Bowser who should see way more snaps this season. Give me the better threat off the edge.

Clowney... eh. Not sure I trust him with much of anything.

In 2020 Houston had 32 pressures on 388 pass rush snaps, Ingram had 28 on 219, and Clowney had 28 on 258.

Of the 3 Ingram is the best performing pass rusher and he can also rush from the interior(As we found out in a our playoff game against him a couple years ago). Clowney can as well and is the best against the run too, but his injury history is troubling to say the least.

I'd prefer Ingram or Clowney at the right price. Houston seems to be on the downswing.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, coordinator0 said:

 

I've admitted I'm in the dark somewhat when it comes to comp picks and how they work. Why aren't we expected to get 3rds for them considering contract size? Do stats and playing time matter? Could they become 3rds?

Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, baltimoreRebel said:

I've admitted I'm in the dark somewhat when it comes to comp picks and how they work. Why aren't we expected to get 3rds for them considering contract size? Do stats and playing time matter? Could they become 3rds?

Yeah I struggle to see how we wouldn't be getting a 3rd for Judon.

Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, baltimoreRebel said:

I've admitted I'm in the dark somewhat when it comes to comp picks and how they work. Why aren't we expected to get 3rds for them considering contract size? Do stats and playing time matter? Could they become 3rds?

The Bengals and Saints are only in line for 4th rounders for losing Carl Lawson and Trey Hendrickson on $15m AAV deals (Judon's is $13.6m AAV), so I assume the contract would need to be $16m AAV or more to qualify for a 3rd round comp pick

Playing time does factor in, but only in making comp picks worth less, not more iirc

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, drd23 said:

The Bengals and Saints are only in line for 4th rounders for losing Carl Lawson and Trey Hendrickson on $15m AAV deals (Judon's is $13.6m AAV), so I assume the contract would need to be $16m AAV or more to qualify for a 3rd round comp pick

Playing time does factor in, but only in making comp picks worth less, not more iirc

angry mark cuban GIF

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Am I the only one who doesn't consider EDGE a top need? Our defense has been built on coverage over pass rush and the fact that pass rush can be manufactured. The Bucs are kind of a deviation in terms of what the league was trending to there, which IMO is good for us in that it keeps making the way we (and the Pats) are building our defense "correct" and the most efficient path to building a top defense. FWIW, our defense was stellar in the playoffs against two very talented offenses. We just need stout/solid guys on the D-line. Ingram, Clowney, Aldon Smith, Oliver Vernon... there are solid names out there and I'm sure we are going to add one, once the comp pick date passes.

With our premium assets (read: 1st and 2nd round pick), I'm still looking playmaker and protection for Lamar, with the order dependent on whether Zeus Jr is moved. I also have a lot of faith in the front office to find someone in the mid-rounds to be somewhere on the Courtney Upshaw to Matt Judon scale as a starting OLB, which is "good enough". If we take an EDGE in the first, it should be a value thing where the rest of the draft order is mis-evaluating a special talent.

Edited by wackywabbit
  • Like 5
Link to post
Share on other sites

I'd agree. EDGE is a major need in the sense that we don't have a lot of talent there, but it isn't a priority need when put up against some other areas. 

Premium EDGE talents alone just don't change the trajectory of games the way they did previously. The cumulative effect of a talented and deep defensive line is what you should shoot for if you're actually trying to foolishly build your defense from the pass rush up. See 2017 Jags, 2019 49ers, and 2020 Playoff Bucs. That requires a lot of moving parts, money, luck, and draft investment though, into a project that the majority of the time just doesn't bear fruit. 

When looking back on our losses it's clear better weapons at WR, better protection on the interior, and a more advanced passing game could've changed our destiny. Certainly more so than Yannick, Judon, or even upgraded versions of them. Which is why the FO felt comfortable letting them go. 

All that said, (Presuming we don't make a splash FA signing) I still think we go EDGE in the 1st if some monster BPA talent elsewhere doesn't fall to us or a trade down scenario doesn't present itself. Just because that's how these EDC 1st Rounds are trending. The most empty position gets the investment, and seeing as how we took a LB in the 1st last year(And a HB in the 2nd)- it's clear positional value isn't a major determining factor. Though it's only a 2 year sample size so who knows? 🤷‍♂️

Also if we end up with a talent like Greg Rousseau, that shouldn't be looked at as a typically EDGE pick either. He's more in the Calais mold with the interior disruption he can bring, and future potential as a Base End/5T. Just throwing that out there.

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 4/7/2021 at 1:16 PM, wackywabbit said:

Am I the only one who doesn't consider EDGE a top need? Our defense has been built on coverage over pass rush and the fact that pass rush can be manufactured. The Bucs are kind of a deviation in terms of what the league was trending to there, which IMO is good for us in that it keeps making the way we (and the Pats) are building our defense "correct" and the most efficient path to building a top defense. FWIW, our defense was stellar in the playoffs against two very talented offenses. We just need stout/solid guys on the D-line. Ingram, Clowney, Aldon Smith, Oliver Vernon... there are solid names out there and I'm sure we are going to add one, once the comp pick date passes.

With our premium assets (read: 1st and 2nd round pick), I'm still looking playmaker and protection for Lamar, with the order dependent on whether Zeus Jr is moved. I also have a lot of faith in the front office to find someone in the mid-rounds to be somewhere on the Courtney Upshaw to Matt Judon scale as a starting OLB, which is "good enough". If we take an EDGE in the first, it should be a value thing where the rest of the draft order is mis-evaluating a special talent.

Depends on what you mean by “need”.

I think it’s definitely a top need and I think the front office will respond with attacking the position with a double dip in the draft. As @DreamKid mentioned, there is a precedence we seem to have established with attacking our weakest slots with a draft double dip early and in the middle rounds.

IOL was never going to be the position where that was the case as we needed a veteran presence to lockdown the IOL with being able to be fluid in diagnosing opposing DL stunts and such for protection.

WR already is composed of plenty of youth and so it was never going to be the likely spot to see a double dip either.

Safety I find to be a need that we also will strongly consider in the draft, but since we have two starters at the position, it could see less attention.

Which logically leaves edge as the position we’d want to target. While I agree that edge is of lower overall value to spend big money on, it’s still an important enough position. This past season regardless of the organizational importance on signing great edge players to strong deals, we’ve seen EDC spend a franchise tag and draft assets on improving the position.

Those are assets that we can’t get back and that with a strong talent locked down for 4-5 years, we wouldn’t have to. It only makes sense IMO that edge is by far our most likely position to spend a pick on in the 2021 draft’s 1st round and 3rd round.

Obviously BPA will certainly be taken into account, but there’s also little reason to believe that we wouldn’t navigate the board to obtain an edge at the most optimal value.

So while I don’t think it’s of significant team building need, I do think it’s the weakest built spot on the team and adding proper assets to the position now will prevent us from having to find ourselves (for the next few years) in a position where we’re utilizing other valuable assets on fielding proper impact/disrupting talents. Great coverage can only go so far and as long as we can add some quality pass rush in this draft our defense will require few investments in it moving forward.

I say this full well knowing that a game breaking WR could really change our fortunes, however as it stands, I don’t see us in position to grab such a player. Thus I feel we’re more likely to target a Dwayne Eskridge, Dyami Brown, or Tylan Wallace- at a supreme discount.

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, diamondbull424 said:

I say this full well knowing that a game breaking WR could really change our fortunes, however as it stands, I don’t see us in position to grab such a player. Thus I feel we’re more likely to target a Dwayne Eskridge, Dyami Brown, or Tylan Wallace- at a supreme discount.

Feels like Eskridge's stock has calmed a bit, right? He was up above a lot of guys in rankings just a month ago, getting that Late 1st-Early 2nd rub like Brandon Aiyuk last year. Now though it seems like he could available at our 2nd Pick or maybe even down into Early 3rd Territory. 

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...