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3 hours ago, thebestever6 said:

Can we get out of the Gordon contract easily? If so I definitely would. And I'm interested to see how much Marlon Mack would command as like a bridge rb.

Why would we want to get rid of Gordon? We have him for one more year, he's been moderately productive and knows the offense. Cutting him saves only $2.5m against the cap. There's no real reason to move on from him right now, this team has much bigger issues to worry about than Melvin Gordon. 

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45 minutes ago, AnAngryAmerican said:

Why would we want to get rid of Gordon? We have him for one more year, he's been moderately productive and knows the offense. Cutting him saves only $2.5m against the cap. There's no real reason to move on from him right now, this team has much bigger issues to worry about than Melvin Gordon. 

I thought his dui made it voidable but I guess idk think he beat up on bad teams

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i have to give gordon credit because i was absolutely killing the contract and his play for like 6 months. still think he is overpaid/overrated etc but he had a very nice second half of the season. so i can eat some crow on that 

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Re: MG3 - if he even just agrees to a plea deal (diversion program counts) and gets the charges dismissed - it's an automatic 3-game suspension, AND the contract guarantees for 2022 void - the 4.5M of the base salary that's guaranteed, the 2M roster bonus, and the 500K game bonuses.    I think the chances of that diversion program are very high.    So in fact, we could save 7M from the 9M cap hit this year - but only if we cut him on the 3rd day of the 2022 football new year (in early March).  If we waited until later, then the 2M roster bonus would kick in, and we could only save 5M.

As much as I still think it was a terrible contract to have committed to, and would have rather that we attacked the deep RB pool in the draft last year - I don't foresee Paton cutting MG3, for 1 simple reason - I think Paton is letting Lindsay walk.    Lindsay's a total gamer, and his grit/heart can't be underestimated - but his total lack of progression in blocking / pass receiving game, and his wearing down over the 2H of the season, were pretty clear signs he's just not capable of being a 3-down back, or the lead guy for a full season.      You don't commit significant $ on 2nd contracts to RB's who can't do it all, or take on a full season-long workload.    For all the criticism Elway gets about waiting too long and letting the market play out - he probably saved money on avoiding an extension with Lindsay last year.   

If Lindsay wants to take an incredibly team-friendly deal with few to no guaranteed $ beyond next year - sure, no one would complain.  But I don't blame him for chasing a better deal if he can find it.    RB lifespans are so short in the NFL, if he can find a decent payday, he should absolutely take it.  I doubt it's going to be with us, however.   

Conversely, the Lindsay situation likely means MG3 is back for 2020 - by committing to the roster bonus in March, it makes less sense to part ways later on, and I doubt we'll have clarity on Lindsay's situation by then.   At least MG3's contract won't be guaranteed, so he could be cut later on and save 5M (instead of the original 2.5M) if more issues come up.   I do think it means RB should be prioritized with a Day 2 pick this draft, as long as the value is there.  Sadly this RB draft class is nowhere as special or as deep as last year's class - but I do hope Paton considers RB at Rd2 - there are a couple of big difference makers it would be worth investing on (hello Javonte Williams - doubt Najee Harris or Etienne last that far), so we can prepare for life after MG3 next year (and Lindsay whenever).

 

Edited by Broncofan
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12 minutes ago, Broncofan said:

Re: MG3 - if he even just agrees to a plea deal (diversion program counts) and gets the charges dismissed - it's an automatic 3-game suspension, AND the contract guarantees for 2022 void - the 4M of the base salary that's guaranteed, the 2M roster bonus, and the 500K game bonuses.    I think the chances of that diversion program are very high.    So in fact, we could save 7M from the 9M cap hit this year - but only if we cut him on the 3rd day of the 2022 football new year (in early March).  If we waited until later, then the 2M roster bonus would kick in, and we could only save 5M.

As much as I think it was a terrible contract to have committed to, and would have rather that we attacked the deep RB pool in the draft last year - I don't foresee Paton cutting MG3, for 1 simple reason - I think Paton is letting Lindsay walk.    Lindsay's a total gamer, and his grit/heart can't be underestimated - but his total lack of progression in blocking / pass receiving game, and his wearing down over the 2H of the season, were pretty clear signs he's just not capable of being a 3-down back, or the lead guy for a full season.      You don't commit significant $ on 2nd contracts to RB's who can't do it all, or take on a full season-long workload.    For all the criticism Elway gets about waiting too long and letting the market play out - he probably saved money on avoiding an extension with Lindsay last year.   

If Lindsay wants to take an incredibly team-friendly deal with few to no guaranteed $ beyond next year - sure, no one would complain.  But I don't blame him for chasing a better deal if he can find it.    RB lifespans are so short in the NFL, if he can find a decent payday, he should absolutely take it.  I doubt it's going to be with us, however.   Conversely, that likely means MG3 is back for 2020.   Sadly this RB draft class is nowhere as special as last year's - but I do hope Paton considers RB at Rd2 - there are a couple of big difference makers it would be worth investing on, so we can prepare for life after MG3 next year (and Lindsay whenever).

The only thing I disagree with here is using a 2nd round pick on a RB when their shelf life is so short.

In the 2nd round, you need to target players who a)play important positions and b) to whom you can foresee giving a second contract and hopefully enjoy 6, 8 or even 10 years of good production. 

Get a RB in free agency on the cheap or take a couple late round/UDFA fliers. We should use our 2nd rounder to get a DL, ILB, EDGE or CB. I think this years draft needs to be as defense-heavy as last year’s was offense heavy, particularly on days 1 and 2. 

Edited by AnAngryAmerican
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1 hour ago, AnAngryAmerican said:

The only thing I disagree with here is using a 2nd round pick on a RB when their shelf life is so short.

In the 2nd round, you need to target players who a)play important positions and b) to whom you can foresee giving a second contract and hopefully enjoy 6, 8 or even 10 years of good production. 

Get a RB in free agency on the cheap or take a couple late round/UDFA fliers. We should use our 2nd rounder to get a DL, ILB, EDGE or CB. I think this years draft needs to be as defense-heavy as last year’s was offense heavy, particularly on days 1 and 2. 

Just so I'm clear - I'm talking about Rd2 picks on an elite level RB talent.   Not some guy you keep for 4 years, and move on - guys you may still say "what a great pick" - 5-6 years later, on their not-bargain 2nd contract.    Jonathan Taylor,  JK Dobbins & Cam Akers seem to fit the bill from this past year (I figured Taylor & Dobbins were going early Rd2, I was hoping Akers would fall to us Rd3 out of the elite tier, but he didn't make it out of Rd2 - great pick by LAR).    The guys who become the next Chubbs, Kamaras - Zeke/CMC level talents, but not spending the Rd1 pick; truly elite guys, not just very-good-but-not-great guys.   

I'm not even sure Najee Harris fits that bill, because I'm not convinced he's Derrick Henry V2, but more Jeremy Hill (who was a fantastic rookie-contract RB, but not a guy to last beyond that).   Etienne & Williams IMO are those 2 guys, at least so far (although I doubt there will be much new material to change thinking on the other guys).   I'm talking elite-level ceiling.   Early Rd2 is the new market inefficiency to find the next Kamara/Chubb - not the next MG3, to be clear.  But maybe I'll stop there and save that for the College thread lol.

 

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2 hours ago, The Helicopter said:

Keeping MG3 sets a bad precedent. Cut him. Draft and sign a replacement. 

Why? My impression of him is as a very solid, 3 down RB. Very good at pass pro also. 

His charge was DUI, right? Not good by any means but not assault or domestic violence either. 

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3 hours ago, thebestever6 said:

Did Chubba Hubbard fall off didn't hear much about him

He got outplayed by the other guy on the roster for most of the season, and showed a lot less burst and vision this season.  His stock fell hard.   It’s a pretty meh class after the top 3-4 but just hard to see him vault into the top tier.   

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I wonder if Paton might make a splash and go for Xavier Rhodes. We are pretty short at CB with Bouye likely being cut, Ojemudia still being raw and Callahan being injury prone and best as a slot man anyway. Plus we have struggled with drafting corners and having them play early because QBs love to pick on rookie corners. Rhodes was dreadful in 2019 but played much better in 2020 for the Colts. He could be a $10m a year type signing. 
 

Plus he was a Minnesota draft pick to Paton probably liked him coming out. 

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4 hours ago, paul-mac said:

I wonder if Paton might make a splash and go for Xavier Rhodes. We are pretty short at CB with Bouye likely being cut, Ojemudia still being raw and Callahan being injury prone and best as a slot man anyway. Plus we have struggled with drafting corners and having them play early because QBs love to pick on rookie corners. Rhodes was dreadful in 2019 but played much better in 2020 for the Colts. He could be a $10m a year type signing. 
 

Plus he was a Minnesota draft pick to Paton probably liked him coming out. 

That’s astute. He’s a good fit for Vic’s scheme too and he probably knows him from his time with the Bears. That could very well be one of our top targets. 

Does anyone have a link to list of likely league-wide free agents? 

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1 hour ago, jolly red giant said:

I would expect Paton to got for a top tier CB in FA - for the reasons you point out. This does not prohibit taking a CB in the 1st round - you can never have too many good CBs.

I agree with this. I like the idea of resolving the emergency at CB in FA (adding one bonafide starter) as well as the other defensive position groups in need (depending on the vet cap decisions) and putting ourselves in a position to go BPA in R1. MOJ, Bassey, Bausby, and Callahan (w/ his injury history) aren’t going to cut it as-is but I don’t think we should panic and get tunnel vision on CB in R1.

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