xrade Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 3 hours ago, Bobby816 said: Point being that if we draft a QB and don’t help what’s around him What makes you think that we would treat the O rebuild any differently whether we have Sam, a rookie or Watson? The rebuild needs to be done regardless of who is at QB. You think many of us want change for the sake of change. Nope. We want a good QB and based on watching Sam play and not just conjecture, many of us feel he will not make a big enough leap to justify a risky contract next offseason. You criticize Wilson because of two years poor play before breaking out. I can understand your concerns. But knowing he was playing at less than 100% and then finally having the light come on signals growth to me. I suspect he also has more growth in him. Is it a risk? Absolutely. Just like every other draft pick. I just feel it is less of a risk than hoping Sam can all of a sudden become a good QB in one year. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xrade Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 3 hours ago, Sandwhich2 said: I'm of the opinion that any Jets fan that doesn't want to trade for Watson is a masochist. I want Watson but not for the cost of three or more FRP. I guess that make me a cheap, quasi-masochist? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doumeyer Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 20 hours ago, KingOfNewYork said: I could see Washington maybe doing it because they pick mid to late first and he's better than anything they could get there. Downside is they'd only have 1 year to really see what they have in him. I think you have a very interesting point about Washington, they are a team that has been under the radar with all this Darnold talk. What I still don't understand is how could all those so called experts be so wrong when when they were rating Darnold so high before the 2018 draft. What we could get for Darnold is still unknown, if we do trade him and only get a third round pick that would mean we gave up the third overall pick in the2018 draft, and three second round picks that would be the final piece in the disastrous Macc, legacy. I still say we just stay put and and let let the offers come to us both in the Darnold, and Watson offers. Just the idea of us knocking on the door of the Houston, GM with a offer of three first round picks and a second plus Q is flat of insane. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doumeyer Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 43 minutes ago, xrade said: I want Watson but not for the cost of three or more FRP. I guess that make me a cheap, quasi-masochist? NO you are not cheap you are just smart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby816 Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 58 minutes ago, xrade said: What makes you think that we would treat the O rebuild any differently whether we have Sam, a rookie or Watson? The rebuild needs to be done regardless of who is at QB. You think many of us want change for the sake of change. Nope. We want a good QB and based on watching Sam play and not just conjecture, many of us feel he will not make a big enough leap to justify a risky contract next offseason. You criticize Wilson because of two years poor play before breaking out. I can understand your concerns. But knowing he was playing at less than 100% and then finally having the light come on signals growth to me. I suspect he also has more growth in him. Is it a risk? Absolutely. Just like every other draft pick. I just feel it is less of a risk than hoping Sam can all of a sudden become a good QB in one year. You draft a QB at 2 you can’t get that star player in that spot. You trade back. Now you still get a star player a couple picks later along with several other picks (valuable picks) to help out the QB. You draft the qb and yes you still have a couple really valuable picks to help out. But it’s still no matter how you slice it not adding as much around the qb. The league as a whole is not as sour on Sam as it appears a lot of the fans are. Let’s remember that. So I do think telling FAs he’s what we have going forward and we think a new staff and new talent around him he will be good. Is a better selling point in FA, then just saying we will be drafting a QB at 2, we aren’t sure who yet. But do you want to play for us? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doumeyer Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 27 minutes ago, Bobby816 said: You draft a QB at 2 you can’t get that star player in that spot. You trade back. Now you still get a star player a couple picks later along with several other picks (valuable picks) to help out the QB. You draft the qb and yes you still have a couple really valuable picks to help out. But it’s still no matter how you slice it not adding as much around the qb. The league as a whole is not as sour on Sam as it appears a lot of the fans are. Let’s remember that. So I do think telling FAs he’s what we have going forward and we think a new staff and new talent around him he will be good. Is a better selling point in FA, then just saying we will be drafting a QB at 2, we aren’t sure who yet. But do you want to play for us? Now we are getting to the core of our real problem, yes we have five good picks in this years draft. If we use the second pick in the draft on a QB which we might do how do we get the real impact player on offensive that we are in dire need of, I don't think we have a chance to get one at 23 sure it could happen but as Jet fans we are not that lucky, How can we get another pick in this year draft between 12 and 18 in the up coming draft to get a top receiver? Maybe Douglas, is thinking he can get one in the FA market. We can't even trade down because of the uncertainty of the QB situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetsfan4life51 Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 With a system like this and what looks to be a good coaching staff I am starting to feel that we should just grab any QB that is talented and put him in a position to succeed. I'm getting to the point I wouldn't be upset if we traded down for more picks and still ended up with Lance. Or take a top 5 talent then trade back up for someone like Lance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattmanz91 Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Bobby816 said: You draft a QB at 2 you can’t get that star player in that spot. You trade back. Now you still get a star player a couple picks later along with several other picks (valuable picks) to help out the QB. You draft the qb and yes you still have a couple really valuable picks to help out. But it’s still no matter how you slice it not adding as much around the qb. The league as a whole is not as sour on Sam as it appears a lot of the fans are. Let’s remember that. So I do think telling FAs he’s what we have going forward and we think a new staff and new talent around him he will be good. Is a better selling point in FA, then just saying we will be drafting a QB at 2, we aren’t sure who yet. But do you want to play for us? And what if we trade down a couple spots, accumulate more picks, surround Sam with a ton of talent and he still sucks next year but we are picking tenth? then what? We trade pick 10, seattle's first and probably another valuable pick to trade up for a QB who's in the same tier as Wilson or Fields? So you'd rather trade down for a couple of extra picks and take a huge risk that Sam will become successful vs the much more probable situation of sam will still suck and now you have to trade up for a QB next year and not have any picks other than that 1st round QB until the 3rd round? I'd much rather draft Wilson at 2, and use 23, 34, another second from trading Sam, the rest of our picks, FA and the 3 top 50 picks we will have next year to build this roster. Edited February 13, 2021 by mattmanz91 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GangGreen420 Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 I don’t want Darnold OR WIlson The Jets failed Sam by hiring a piss poor coach and giving him very little talent AND he’s probably just not that good Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby816 Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 46 minutes ago, mattmanz91 said: And what if we trade down a couple spots, accumulate more picks, surround Sam with a ton of talent and he still sucks next year but we are picking tenth? then what? We trade pick 10, seattle's first and probably another valuable pick to trade up for a QB who's in the same tier as Wilson or Fields? So you'd rather trade down for a couple of extra picks and take a huge risk that Sam will become successful vs the much more probable situation of sam will still suck and now you have to trade up for a QB next year and not have any picks other than that 1st round QB until the 3rd round? I'd much rather draft Wilson at 2, and use 23, 34, another second from trading Sam, the rest of our picks, FA and the 3 top 50 picks we will have next year to build this roster. Good QBs are only drafted in the top few picks? That’s news to me. There’s probably a decent argument that most good QBs aren’t drafted in the 1st few picks. Not saying this is the philosophy to take. But to think there’s no way we can get a QB if Darnold fails... seems pessimistic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xrade Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 1 hour ago, Bobby816 said: You draft a QB at 2 you can’t get that star player in that spot. So, in essence, you would rather have a stud WR like Smith at 2? I would like him as well but there is no doubt in my mind that we will upgrade the WR position via FA. Even if we did not get a stud FA WR, this is a deep WR draft. Would it be so terrible to get, say, Marshall in round 2? And do we really want to draft a #4 WR at 2? There is no doubt Smith would become a #1 by 2022, but now is not the time to be drafting depth. We need to be drafting starters for 2021 especially at 2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingOfNewYork Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 8 hours ago, Bobby816 said: When he had 0 confidence and had a clean pocket not very often... this is what happens. For me I just find it rather funny that Sam is done here in like 95% of your minds Bc of this last year. Even after looking good in 2019. Like a new system or player around him can’t make him improve from that 2019 guy we saw. Yet Wilson with 2 awful seasons and 1 good season is totally worth the 2nd pick. As I’ve said. It seems some just want change more so than anything. How was Wilson's freshmen season awful? Sam was good for a decent stretch in 2019 but reverted back to the norm and this past season was even worse. You can take the risk of him being good in 2021 and beyond but if he isn't then you've pretty much set the team back at least another 2 seasons as you try and find a new way to handle the QB position. We can make excuses for Darnold, and only Darnold it seems but the kid has done himself no favors with his decision making and thats the biggest concern. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xrade Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 11 minutes ago, Bobby816 said: Good QBs are only drafted in the top few picks? That’s news to me. There’s probably a decent argument that most good QBs aren’t drafted in the 1st few picks. Not saying this is the philosophy to take. But to think there’s no way we can get a QB if Darnold fails... seems pessimistic. This is certainly true. However, it is more about perception than anything else. We all buy into the hype about a select few and dismiss other prospects even though every year later picked QB’s do better. I wonder if some FO’s buy into that same hype. I hope JD does not. If JD and his crew think they can make a QB with a later pick, I am all for it. Maybe they think Jones will work well in LaFleurs system. Smart kid, accurate in the 20yd range, good release. They can trade down a bit and take him at, say, 8-12. Risky, but it could happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattmanz91 Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Bobby816 said: Good QBs are only drafted in the top few picks? That’s news to me. There’s probably a decent argument that most good QBs aren’t drafted in the 1st few picks. Not saying this is the philosophy to take. But to think there’s no way we can get a QB if Darnold fails... seems pessimistic. But why take that risk when we don't have to? We have the pick this year to grab a top tier QB prospect and a ton of draft capital to continue to build. As it stands right now I would take Wilson over every QB prospect next year, obviously things could definitely change but I really like Wilson and I hope he's the pick if we don't trade for Watson. Grab Thuney, one of Schuster/Fuller/Arob in FA draft IOL, WR and RB with our 2nd and both 3rds. That's an awful lot of help in one offseason for Wilson. Also that still leaves our second 1st rounder for CB or edge help. Edited February 13, 2021 by mattmanz91 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby816 Posted February 13, 2021 Share Posted February 13, 2021 10 minutes ago, mattmanz91 said: But why take that risk when we don't have to? We have the pick this year to grab a top tier QB prospect and a ton of draft capital to continue to build. As it stands right now I would take Wilson over every QB prospect next year, obviously things could definitely change but I really like Wilson and I hope he's the pick if we don't trade for Watson. Grab Thuney, one of Schuster/Fuller/Arob in FA draft IOL, WR and RB with our 2nd and both 3rds. That's an awful lot of help in one offseason for Wilson. Also that still leaves our second 1st rounder for CB or edge help. My point is what are you selling guys like them in FA? Not a lot of established stars want to join a team not knowing who the QB will be. If we were in position to draft TLaw, I’d agree. But we aren’t. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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