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2021 Draft Thread: Senior Bowl, Combine, Virtual Visits


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3 hours ago, soflbillsfan said:

After last nights game the top priority in beating or coming close to beating KC will be getting a capable front 4 pressure without blitzing. They pressured Mahomes a ton last night while blitzing around 20% the entire game. Forcing Mahomes to be uncomfortable because of the front 4. I think the bills need to stop with paying the average players to rotate in and stick with 4 main dlineman majority of the game with little rotation. So to me Butler, Jefferson, and Addison while playing mediocre and showing some flashes are not worth the 26 million in cap space they could have to let him go. I am saying pass rusher is top priority and unfortunately this draft is weak at this position so I am all for them going in on one guy, Bud Dupree to me is the ideal guy for the job and I think if there is one player on defense that can make an impact on this defense it would be him. I know there will be flags cause of his injury but ideally I think this is the guy we should look at in order for the dline to make an impact like the Bucs did last night. 

Came in here to post this. Last nights game showed just how important improving our pass-rush should be. I also agree that I don't see that guy available anywhere near our pick, so we'll likely need to trade picks or spend big in free agency. There are a number of free agents at that position... some better than others in terms of fit and skill.

Not that I disagree, just adding to discussion here. Sal (WGR) brought up an interesting point on your mention of dropping Butler, Jefferson and Addison. I wonder if the circumstances of the virus and offseason slows down player movement or has NFL front offices rethinking player movement in any way. I don't think any of them were that bad, but certainly not effective enough, some more than others. 

I wonder if we explore the trade market again with our top pick, especially with a team looking to rebuild or retool with a younger roster (Broncos come to mind). Dream scenario is acquiring Khalil Mack from Chicago, although he's tough to fit financially. Could we take a look at Von Miller (who might require less to acquire)?  

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1 hour ago, Nick said:

Came in here to post this. Last nights game showed just how important improving our pass-rush should be. I also agree that I don't see that guy available anywhere near our pick, so we'll likely need to trade picks or spend big in free agency. There are a number of free agents at that position... some better than others in terms of fit and skill.

Not that I disagree, just adding to discussion here. Sal (WGR) brought up an interesting point on your mention of dropping Butler, Jefferson and Addison. I wonder if the circumstances of the virus and offseason slows down player movement or has NFL front offices rethinking player movement in any way. I don't think any of them were that bad, but certainly not effective enough, some more than others. 

I wonder if we explore the trade market again with our top pick, especially with a team looking to rebuild or retool with a younger roster (Broncos come to mind). Dream scenario is acquiring Khalil Mack from Chicago, although he's tough to fit financially. Could we take a look at Von Miller (who might require less to acquire)?  

Yes the draft is uninspiring when it comes to pass rushers, the guy from Univ of Miami is said to be the best prospect to come out and even then he had 1 good year in college and is a big risk, reminds me of maybin in that sense. Talent from him to 7/8th edge rusher are all similar in talent and can be had in the 2-4th rd.

As for gettin Miller, or Watt my concern is your replacing an aged pass rushing corps with more aging pass rushers. They need youth mixed in there. Honestly if we can get Mack with the 30th pick and a mid rd pick in 2022 I would love to just pull the trigger as they need to get the player that can impact immediately on that dline.

Sal talking about OTAs and all of that, but honestly the reason we brought in guys like Addison, Klein, and Butler is because they played with McDermott in Carolina and the risk of missing camp was to bring them in so they are familiar with the scheme already and nothing big has to change where you bring in unknowns like Jefferson, as he should have been the only one struggling to pick up the defense since he has no ties to McD. 

Honestly the Saints are 90 mil over the cap (this doesnt include the brand new restructure to Brees which can clear around 20 mil), they are still well over it and they are in discussions of signing Winston a long term deal. If this team can pull the numbers out in which they are able to be under cap and still sign a qb who is likely going to generate around 20 mil a year I think we can manage to figure it out being 5 mil under the projected 181 mil. 

Addison will be 34 years old by the time week 1 rolls around and his cap hit is 10.1 mil, how is 5 sacks going to justify paying this guy that much to produce so little at the tail end of his career? Jerry Hughes will be 33 once camp comes around 9.5 mil due with 4.5 sacks. May have been able to be consistent rushing the passer but we also blitzed one of the most in the league last year. So someone is bound to get pressure on them. Basically we will be paying 19.6 mil for 2 aged pass rushers that we could use on youth. Yes we will have 6.1 mil in dead cap but with a long term deal in place we can push the cap to next year. 

Jefferson clears 6.5 mil, butler clears 6.8 mil, lee smith if retires clears 2.25 mil, john brown clears 9.5 mil so we have several players that we can recoup some cap back to go after a couple of key guys and then the draft to go in and add the depth. We will also land some veteran's on the end of their career looking for a ring, and willing to take a much discounted contract to be a part of something then they would be chasing money on another team. 

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1 hour ago, soflbillsfan said:

Yes the draft is uninspiring when it comes to pass rushers, the guy from Univ of Miami is said to be the best prospect to come out and even then he had 1 good year in college and is a big risk, reminds me of maybin in that sense. Talent from him to 7/8th edge rusher are all similar in talent and can be had in the 2-4th rd.

As for gettin Miller, or Watt my concern is your replacing an aged pass rushing corps with more aging pass rushers. They need youth mixed in there. Honestly if we can get Mack with the 30th pick and a mid rd pick in 2022 I would love to just pull the trigger as they need to get the player that can impact immediately on that dline.

Sal talking about OTAs and all of that, but honestly the reason we brought in guys like Addison, Klein, and Butler is because they played with McDermott in Carolina and the risk of missing camp was to bring them in so they are familiar with the scheme already and nothing big has to change where you bring in unknowns like Jefferson, as he should have been the only one struggling to pick up the defense since he has no ties to McD. 

Honestly the Saints are 90 mil over the cap (this doesnt include the brand new restructure to Brees which can clear around 20 mil), they are still well over it and they are in discussions of signing Winston a long term deal. If this team can pull the numbers out in which they are able to be under cap and still sign a qb who is likely going to generate around 20 mil a year I think we can manage to figure it out being 5 mil under the projected 181 mil. 

Addison will be 34 years old by the time week 1 rolls around and his cap hit is 10.1 mil, how is 5 sacks going to justify paying this guy that much to produce so little at the tail end of his career? Jerry Hughes will be 33 once camp comes around 9.5 mil due with 4.5 sacks. May have been able to be consistent rushing the passer but we also blitzed one of the most in the league last year. So someone is bound to get pressure on them. Basically we will be paying 19.6 mil for 2 aged pass rushers that we could use on youth. Yes we will have 6.1 mil in dead cap but with a long term deal in place we can push the cap to next year. 

Jefferson clears 6.5 mil, butler clears 6.8 mil, lee smith if retires clears 2.25 mil, john brown clears 9.5 mil so we have several players that we can recoup some cap back to go after a couple of key guys and then the draft to go in and add the depth. We will also land some veteran's on the end of their career looking for a ring, and willing to take a much discounted contract to be a part of something then they would be chasing money on another team. 

I agree–we could and should consider clearing all those contract you mentioned, as I don't like what we saw from them given what we're paying for. I hope Star comes back, so we can more easily look to clear Jefferson and/or Butler. Harrison Phillips looked pretty darn good at the end of the year, and I really liked Zimmer for his role. So I think while that unit needs to play better overall, I like the depth there even if we move on from Jefferson and Butler. 

I trust Beane completely, he's shown he can maneuver the cap like a wizard.  

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On 2/8/2021 at 3:34 PM, Nick said:

I agree–we could and should consider clearing all those contract you mentioned, as I don't like what we saw from them given what we're paying for. I hope Star comes back, so we can more easily look to clear Jefferson and/or Butler. Harrison Phillips looked pretty darn good at the end of the year, and I really liked Zimmer for his role. So I think while that unit needs to play better overall, I like the depth there even if we move on from Jefferson and Butler. 

I trust Beane completely, he's shown he can maneuver the cap like a wizard.  

I would be surprised if we let go of all 3. My money is on Addison leaving.  Butler was coming into his own later in the year I thought and being able to stay at 3T and not have to take on double teams should help him and Oliver. 
 

Jefferson I’m on the fence about. He offers versatility and graded out well but he was often misused  this past season too. It just doesn’t seem like McDermott’s style to completely move on from all those guys at once. We’d run into the same problem with a new DL taking time to gel in 2021.

My ideal DL to begin the season would be something like this:

Hughes, Jefferson
Oliver, Butler
Star, Phillips, Draft pick
(one of Watt/Dupree/Ngakoue), Epenesa 

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18 minutes ago, Trentwannabe said:

I would be surprised if we let go of all 3. My money is on Addison leaving.  Butler was coming into his own later in the year I thought and being able to stay at 3T and not have to take on double teams should help him and Oliver. 
 

Jefferson I’m on the fence about. He offers versatility and graded out well but he was often misused  this past season too. It just doesn’t seem like McDermott’s style to completely move on from all those guys at once. We’d run into the same problem with a new DL taking time to gel in 2021.

My ideal DL to begin the season would be something like this:

Hughes, Jefferson
Oliver, Butler
Star, Phillips, Draft pick
(one of Watt/Dupree/Ngakoue), Epenesa 

Problem with keeping both Jefferson and Butler would be the financial cost of the dline once again in which the production may be lacking. We had the highest paying dline in cap last year with very little to show from it. We ended up blitzing more then we ever did because the front 4 was unable to get to the qb on their own.  Honestly what has butler done in his career, his impact with Sean on Bills and Carolina has been abysmal at best. I just dont see the justification of paying him the 8 mil, to rotate behind Star or Oliver. I hate to use PFF but if you look at his grades he was in the 502 and 60s his entire career. You can probably land Dalvin Tomlinson for a cheaper price in which he has proven to be a better player against the run. As you mention Jefferson seems out of place and I think he is more suited on a 3-4 team then he is on a 4-3 team and if you can trade him I would be all for it. Addison is definitely the odd man out at this point with his age and the expectations of him coming in and having a better year I do not see him surviving out of the 3. Ideally Hughes should take a pay cut  but I doubt that works out unless you tack on another year in which he can be expendable at that point. With Star, Oliver and Hughes in the starting lineup I think they will have the ability to gel. I dont think that was the issue this year, I think the lack of talent and the idea of paying mid-level players to have constantly rotate in was something they thought would work out well on top of bringing in guys that know McDermott and his defense with the offseason up in the air at the time. 

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11 minutes ago, Trentwannabe said:

Beane getting a close look at the Clemson players. 
 

Obviously Etienne. Who else may he be scouting there?

Several guys other then Etienne, Carmen LT who could be playing at Guard or RT, as well as late rd pick in WR Amari Rodgers and Cornel Powell. Powell has the speed that may make up for Brown's release. 

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After Milano and Daryl Williams getting locked up, have to think we're looking at #2 CB and G early, and of course Etienne. Don't love the edge rushers that will be available in that range. 

Jaycee Horn, Wyatt Davis, Travis Etienne, Jalen Mayfield, Greg Newsome all seem like the likely targets now.  

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2 hours ago, Nick said:

After Milano and Daryl Williams getting locked up, have to think we're looking at #2 CB and G early, and of course Etienne. Don't love the edge rushers that will be available in that range. 

Jaycee Horn, Wyatt Davis, Travis Etienne, Jalen Mayfield, Greg Newsome all seem like the likely targets now.  

I would be very happy with anyone from that list. Even Etienne with the moves we've now made. 

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Whats interesting is we have met with or linked to a ton of WR, CB, and a handful og RBs but very minimal dline and olineman. The Rbs we have met with are mid rd picks and based on the lack of run game we had last year with 4 of the 5 starting olineman returning you have to wonder what the bills are going to do with the run game. I wouldn't mind Etienne or Harris but I have a feeling they will be taken before us. Keep an eye out on teams like the jets, dolphins, and steelers, as I could see them going for one of these 2 in the 1st rd. If Phins are active in fa for jones or connor then it would be hard to think they go RB in the 1st rd. Jets could go anybody at this point since they need a total rebuild. Steelers may look at an rb but they need quite a bit as well not to mention future placeholder for ben.

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1 hour ago, soflbillsfan said:

Whats interesting is we have met with or linked to a ton of WR, CB, and a handful og RBs but very minimal dline and olineman. The Rbs we have met with are mid rd picks and based on the lack of run game we had last year with 4 of the 5 starting olineman returning you have to wonder what the bills are going to do with the run game. I wouldn't mind Etienne or Harris but I have a feeling they will be taken before us. Keep an eye out on teams like the jets, dolphins, and steelers, as I could see them going for one of these 2 in the 1st rd. If Phins are active in fa for jones or connor then it would be hard to think they go RB in the 1st rd. Jets could go anybody at this point since they need a total rebuild. Steelers may look at an rb but they need quite a bit as well not to mention future placeholder for ben.

Newsome at WR and Hawkins at RB would be great additions to offense. Both home run threats and at least one adds to the return game. 

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Quick little 7 rounder I did through the Mock Draft simulator on Draft Network. I'd be so giddy

Round 1: OL Teven Jenkins - exp at both Tackle spots and RG.
Round 2: DE Carlos Basham - the LDE we need.
Round 3: CB Israel Mukuamu - Flexible CB who can play inside/out and S in sub packages
Round 5: RB Javian Hawkins - The home run threat we need at RB. Perfect compliment to Moss between the tackles
Round 5: WR Ihmir Smith-Marsette - McKenzie/Roberts in one player and a much higher ceiling 
Round 6: LB Justin Hilliard - LB Depth 
Round 7: DL Carlo Kemp - DL depth and a good rusher from the 3T

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CB2 is the clear biggest need right now.

DE, OG/C for the future and DT are next in line for me. 

I'd add RB but only if it's a clear upgrade over Moss (either needs to be a home run threat and/or a guy who can catch 50+ passes a season).

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