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1 hour ago, NYRaider said:

I appreciate the optimism but everyone was saying the same things about Ferrell last off-season. 

Ferrell was actually a pretty good player last season when he wasn't injured. Not #4 overall good, but none of us ever implied he was. I think he needs to carve out a role for himself rushing inside. He showed some promise there last year.

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44 minutes ago, MrOaktown_56 said:

Ferrell was actually a pretty good player last season when he wasn't injured. Not #4 overall good, but none of us ever implied he was. I think he needs to carve out a role for himself rushing inside. He showed some promise there last year.

He was given the benefit of the doubt because he was drafted highly and now he's the 4th DE in our rotation. We're not picking up his 5th year option and he'll likely be gone this off-season or next off-season. Ferrell had 2.5 sacks as a starter on the worst defense in franchise history. 

Arnette and Ferrell actually have quite a few similarities as prospects/picks. Both played at major programs and were good players that were surrounded by other elite players. We reached on both because we had massive holes at DE/CB but neither has played well in the NFL. And I think there are two reasons for that, the first being that they played better than they actually were because they were surrounded by other legit NFL talent and the second being that neither guy is a great athlete. Being technical works in the Big Ten and ACC, when you look at the best players in the NFL the majority of them are great athletes. And almost every really good player flashed that ability early in their career, Mack only had 4 sacks as a rookie but when you watched him play you could tell he had the juice, the talent to be very good. When you watch Ferrell/Arnette they're both extremely underwhelming and are getting beat more often then not. 

I think both guys can be okay NFL players but when you're taken in the first round you're not supposed to just be an okay, complimentary player. We drafted those guys where we did to be impact starters. 

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4 hours ago, NYRaider said:

I wonder if Gus Bradley consults with Paul Guenther about where he drafted guys to play so that he can ensure he uses them there exclusively?

I personally wonder if Gus Bradley consults the fans to see what they think. I’m sure he values the fans expertise on where to play players lol

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1 hour ago, Jeremy408 said:

I personally wonder if Gus Bradley consults the fans to see what they think. I’m sure he values the fans expertise on where to play players lol

He definitely doesn't consult with you or Damon Arnette wouldn't be at water boy. 

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2 hours ago, NYRaider said:

He definitely doesn't consult with you or Damon Arnette wouldn't be at water boy. 

Actually I made it pretty clear that Casey Hayward should’ve been the starter the minute he got signed. And that Damon Arnette can learn a lot from Casey Hayward starting the entire year(I think I actually said that only a couple of hours ago) So me and Gus Bradley actually agree LOL

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12 hours ago, NYRaider said:

 

youll find Marcus lattimore Ronald Darby John johnson Harrison Smith Nnamdi Asomugha Darrell revis and stephon Gilmore in there missing tackles. 
 

How about this one

Here you’ll see Janoris Jenkins Denzel ward Jaylon Johnson(twice) Ronald Darby(Again) Vonn Bell Kendall fuller Kyle fuller James Bradbury breshard breeland & Jabril peppers. (I left out Tre’Davious whites missed tackle because at least Metcalf went out of bounds)

Breaking news: people miss tackles. You don’t need to be 175 and have a cast to miss tackles. That happens because you’re playing grown man in the NFL they get paid to break tackles. But it sure helps when you’re NFL weight and I have two hands to tackle. That’s not something anyone can just pretend doesn’t matter.

That’s the reason why I ask if you actually played organized football.

Edited by Jeremy408
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7 hours ago, NYRaider said:

Arnette and Ferrell actually have quite a few similarities as prospects/picks.  And I think there are two reasons for that, the first being that they played better than they actually were because they were surrounded by other legit NFL talent and the second being that neither guy is a great athlete

I agree with Ferrell not being a great athlete and it shows in his games at Clemson but Arnette I do not.  I would have liked for him to have done more at the combine but you can see from his play at OSU he was a good athlete.  To show you how much the combine messed up his forty time his ten yard split was 1.66 seconds.  Tristan Wirfs ran a 1.69 at 320 lbs.  Jake Fromm is the only QB that had a slower split at 1.68.  If you want to see how explosive he is just watch his college games.  Last year he was dealing with a lot and it showed.  I expect to see a different player this year.  At least physically.  Hopefully GB will play him in the slot and it is great to hear that Amik is going to be on the outside.

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9 hours ago, NYRaider said:

He was given the benefit of the doubt because he was drafted highly and now he's the 4th DE in our rotation. We're not picking up his 5th year option and he'll likely be gone this off-season or next off-season. Ferrell had 2.5 sacks as a starter on the worst defense in franchise history. 

Arnette and Ferrell actually have quite a few similarities as prospects/picks. Both played at major programs and were good players that were surrounded by other elite players. We reached on both because we had massive holes at DE/CB but neither has played well in the NFL. And I think there are two reasons for that, the first being that they played better than they actually were because they were surrounded by other legit NFL talent and the second being that neither guy is a great athlete. Being technical works in the Big Ten and ACC, when you look at the best players in the NFL the majority of them are great athletes. And almost every really good player flashed that ability early in their career, Mack only had 4 sacks as a rookie but when you watched him play you could tell he had the juice, the talent to be very good. When you watch Ferrell/Arnette they're both extremely underwhelming and are getting beat more often then not. 

I think both guys can be okay NFL players but when you're taken in the first round you're not supposed to just be an okay, complimentary player. We drafted those guys where we did to be impact starters. 

I agree somewhat, but I think both were also unlucky in terms of draft position. Arnette was not great value. Ferrell we just missed out on Quinnen Williams. That was tough. 

I do think both can be good players, but I don't think either will live up to their draft status.

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15 hours ago, Jeremy408 said:

I personally wonder if Gus Bradley consults the fans to see what they think. I’m sure he values the fans expertise on where to play players lol

I think he came on this board and read what we said about Amik being a better CB on the outside.

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18 hours ago, NYRaider said:

He was given the benefit of the doubt because he was drafted highly and now he's the 4th DE in our rotation. We're not picking up his 5th year option and he'll likely be gone this off-season or next off-season. Ferrell had 2.5 sacks as a starter on the worst defense in franchise history. 

Arnette and Ferrell actually have quite a few similarities as prospects/picks. Both played at major programs and were good players that were surrounded by other elite players. We reached on both because we had massive holes at DE/CB but neither has played well in the NFL. And I think there are two reasons for that, the first being that they played better than they actually were because they were surrounded by other legit NFL talent and the second being that neither guy is a great athlete. Being technical works in the Big Ten and ACC, when you look at the best players in the NFL the majority of them are great athletes. And almost every really good player flashed that ability early in their career, Mack only had 4 sacks as a rookie but when you watched him play you could tell he had the juice, the talent to be very good. When you watch Ferrell/Arnette they're both extremely underwhelming and are getting beat more often then not. 

I think both guys can be okay NFL players but when you're taken in the first round you're not supposed to just be an okay, complimentary player. We drafted those guys where we did to be impact starters. 

I don't think I have ever agreed with any point you have ever made on this site....  Until now.  Pretty much spot on!

I think we can all agree that CF was over drafted and is an average athlete at best.  He was surrounded by superior talent in Clemson and that gave the illusion that he was a better player than he actually was.  I was not a fan of this pick on draft day and wanted either Allen or Oliver.  Both would have been a better pick than CF.

Arnette's athleticism is questionable and what bothered me most was his age.  He is now 25, ran a 4.5 40, no matter what excuses fans come up with, that is all we have to go off of. 25 years old, was supposed to be pro ready and was flat out horrific last year.  

The main issue with Grudock is wasted draft capital and the continuous perception around the league that our organization is still completely inept.  We currently have an Oline in flux, nothing proven at WR and a D that has not only been the worst of the last decade but clearly still devoid of any elite talent as you can see us still scrambling, trying to pluck players off the scrap heap.  

All of this draft capital and FA cash to spend over the last 3 years and we have literally nothing to show for it.  WE are at best an average team that is propped up by the play of Carr as his surrounding cast on both sides of the ball has been amongst the worst in the NFL.  

It's the time of year where the excuses are flowing like the salmon of Capistrano...  It was Gunthers fault, sure CF was over drafted but he wasn't that terrible, Arnette was torched all of last season but it was due to him not getting pre season reps, we just signed a 500 YO 3T (what does that say?), allegedly looking for an upgrade at LB (with another dinosaur), Hayward (another dinosaur) is our starting CB and he was good years ago.  We still zero pass rush from the interior Dline, LB's are questionable, secondary is questionable at best....  If we can be around .500 with the terrible talent we have I think that would be impressive.

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21 hours ago, NYRaider said:

I appreciate the optimism but everyone was saying the same things about Ferrell last off-season. 

No, last off-season we had to listen to "He should get 7-8 sacks because reasons" before ot was finally conceded that "he's pretty good stopping the run.....". 

 

That's not even optimism, it's blind faith lol

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14 hours ago, Jeremy408 said:

youll find Marcus lattimore Ronald Darby John johnson Harrison Smith Nnamdi Asomugha Darrell revis and stephon Gilmore in there missing tackles. 
 

How about this one

Here you’ll see Janoris Jenkins Denzel ward Jaylon Johnson(twice) Ronald Darby(Again) Vonn Bell Kendall fuller Kyle fuller James Bradbury breshard breeland & Jabril peppers. (I left out Tre’Davious whites missed tackle because at least Metcalf went out of bounds)

Breaking news: people miss tackles. You don’t need to be 175 and have a cast to miss tackles. That happens because you’re playing grown man in the NFL they get paid to break tackles. But it sure helps when you’re NFL weight and I have two hands to tackle. That’s not something anyone can just pretend doesn’t matter.

That’s the reason why I ask if you actually played organized football.

You were saying that he missed tackles because his arm was broken and he was 175 pounds. What's his excuse for missing tackles 20 pounds heavier when his arm isn't broken? 

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